Why should an engine that is capable of turning 5000 RPM be handicapped by forcing it to run the same gear as an engine than can turn only 3500?

I would argue that torque per RPM is the exact opposite of what you should be looking for. Certainly some minimum amount of torque is required at a sufficiently low enough RPM to start the load moving, and the more you have at that low speed, the quicker you can start. But after that, torque times RPM is what is most beneficial.

Below is a link to an article (or a copy of it) I read a few years ago that I think does a good job of putting everything together, and explaining why, ultimately, horsepower is what counts. Its long, and uses a few exaggerated-for-clarity examples, but is worth your time to read it. As a teaser, how does a power plant putting out 2,600 ft-lbs of torque sound? Read below to see how it might be completely useless in a truck, or even an average sized car.

http://www.4x4abc.com/jeep101/torque.html

 

I already said it would be significant at higher speeds unloaded.

 

How about the simple fact that if you don't apply equal drive trains to the engines YOU ARE NOT COMPARING JUST THE ENGINES! If you are saying that the gasser would be handicapped by doing so, you have basically just admitted defeat and apparently that's a tough pill for some of you to swallow...

What's this thread again?

 

You boyz are forgetting that the 2005 2V V10 Ex that I drive has the exact same freaking drivetrain that the post 1999 7.3L has except for final gearing.

Why would I want to limit myself to an RPM range that is outside the design parameters that the engineers at Ford (i.e. not you) designed the V10 to run at?

The design paramters are DIFFERENT but the end result is the SAME...power to move a load.

Why is it so freaking foregin for you smoke heads to understand that RPMs in a V10 is not struggling?...the SOHC V10 makes her power ABOVE 2000RPMs and up to ~4200...the power band is flat from 2000-4000 RPMs and is at or above 400 ft-lbs...

Here is a graph that shows the curves...it is not completely correct since it doesn't show the curves crossing at 5250rpms...the HP and Trq curves are depicted separately in this graph but it shows the curve...notice how the HP is continually CLIMBING up the RPM band and the trq is pretty flat above 2000 rpms out to 4000



This motor is DESIGNED to REV.

I could ask the question a different way than you with your smoke filled mentality...why don't we run the tow off at above 3000RPMs? Ford gave you gears in your tranny for a reason...if my V10 uses what the engineers gave me how is that a disadvantage...

You guys kill me...in your quest to only see one side of the situation trying to put unrealistic limitations on the situation. Why don't you tell the soldiers fighting for our freedom that even though they have a magazine with more rounds...they can only use the one in their chamber...come on...

Gearing IS the way motors make things work...plain and simple. Do you think modern tractor trailers grunt 80,000#'s up 7% grades with pure diesel power...really?

If we restrict things to one to one ratio how is that real world? We don't buy motors we buy TRUCKS that are wrapped AROUND the motor to do a given job...the overall TRUCK is what moves the package and that includes suspension to support the tongue weight and items inside the truck in addtion to the trailer and wind load...

Are you guys serious in your arguments or just looking to argue?

I drive a truck in real life towing a 9000# trailer all over the country in all kinds of terrain and weather...to me what is important that I carry my family safely inside the truck while the truck does what she does best...PULL the load under all conditions and gets us to our destination...the 4.30 geared 2V V10 in my Ex has not found a hill or road that she can't easily pull using what the Ford engineers gave her mated to the engine...plain and simple.

I guess you can't get to near 700 pages on a thread unless there are enough people that like to hear themselves talk about non-factual stuff...the thing I know is that this real-life truck does real-life stuff very well...if I wanted to sit at home and argue with a bunch of smokeheads...I guess that would be something different...I just don't have time to sit around and argue as I am still planning our July 3 week towing trek that will include the Rockies yet again...oh dear...will my little ole V10 have enough HP/Trq to make it to the top of a Rocky mountain pass ladened to 17,000#'s combined?...yeah right...life is too short guys...

Joe.

 

X_Hemi_Guy I just want throw out there that the thread is titled V10 vs. PSD not V10 (with 4.30, 3.73, etc) vs. PSD (with 3.55's). Also the 3rd grade name calling is kinda silly don't you think? Smokehead's? Really? Both motors will pull heavy loads, have their good points, and have their bad points. Now can we all hold hands and sing Kumbaya?

 

Yes some of us got this a long time ago. To really get the full benefit out of the diesel engine, you need a tranny with about 10 gears since the power band, torque, and RPM limits are much narrower than a gas engine.

 

When was the last time you saw just a PSD or V10 pulling a trailer? We buy TRUCKS around our motors and that includes transmissions and gears as well as suspensions, seats, cd and DVD players, etc...we buy a package.

For me...I would have loved to have the 5R110 tranny in my 2005 Ex since that would have given me yet one more gear to assist moving the load but I am stuck with the 4R100 tranny and it has done an exceptional job non-the-less.

Gears are what makes the motor do what it is designed to do. I'm not sure how you can have a motor by itself moving loads...that makes no logical sense to me...sorry...

Now hold on there...some are making the argument that we are to ignore gearing and go 1:1...

I happen to 100% agree with you BTW...check your reps too for the logical post...gearing and transmission ARE what make the motors do what they do best...and as I mentioned just above in this same post...I would have loved to have gotten the 5speed Torqshift tranny in my 2005 Ex for that extra gear!!!

Joe.

 

Okay X_Hemi_Guy let's go back to post #1.
It looks like the thread is about the motors not what you can put behind it. I agree with you in that gearing is what makes the trucks go and with the correct gearing my push mower's self propel could drag a fully loaded semi but that's not what the thread is actually about.

Edit: Forgot to mention that I love internet arguments. No one is ever right and the other guy is an (insert self chosen profanity).

 

What's there to forget? Again, as soon as you said "except for" THEY ARE NOT THE SAME!

 

Fine then. Pull your turbo off.

How about the simple fact that if you don't apply equal aspiration to the engines YOU ARE NOT COMPARING JUST THE ENGINES! If you are saying that the diesel would be handicapped by doing so, you have basically just admitted defeat and apparently that's a tough pill for some of you to swallow...

See how ridiculous that sounds?

 

X_Hemi_Guy can't spell, pass it on...

 

I'm pretty sure the turbo is an integral part of the POWERSTROKE diesel motor. Nice try, but you were probably doomed from the moment you sat down at your keyboard...

 

I'll match you for a pull in that condition if you pull 2 spark plugs out. That doesn't match the transmission argument because the motor is designed to run with a turbo just like your motor is designed to run with 10 spark plugs. The trans and rear end gearing can be the same by design from ford. But I reference you to my previous post about what the thread is actually about.

 

The last time I thought I was wrong... I was wrong about thinking I was wrong.

 

I'm speaking about the other guys opinion of you. You get a chance to open the bike up yet?