Well I am partial to wielded aluminum railings after all....

But perhaps I shouldn't hijack the thread to talk about that.

 

I've been reading a lot of the posts on here about making HHO generators. I built two grids so far. The first one was like two "M"s stacked one over the other with a "V" that fit below the "V" shape between the outside legs of the "M". I welded the "V" to the outer "M" so that adjacent plates had opposite polarity. Sorry but that's the best I can describe it.

Then I read about neutral plates which I take it are not connected to anything electrically. I built a second grid of parallel flat plates with the outer plates being 2"X9" and six neutral plates stacked between them being 2"X8". The extra length of the outer plates gave me room to tap holes for making the electrical connections. I ran it off my 12 amp battery charger and added caustic until I had about 15 amps draw. I could see it producing gas but had a hard time measuring output. I think I have a problem with the seal where the wires go into the container I'm using. It is a 7 liter plastic jug that had a medical solution in it.

To assemble the grid I drilled two holes through all the plates and used 1/4-20 SS bolts and SS nylock nuts. I sleeved the bolts with plastic tubing to electrically insulate them and punched out washer-like spacers from rubber gasket material that's about 3/16" thick. I slid the spacers over the sleeved bolts between each plate.

I am just starting out with this, using straight 12 VDC. My thinking was that plates 1-2 make the first cell, 2-3 the second, 3-4 the third, etc. which is why I have a total of 8 plates making 7 cells. This grid sits in the jug with about 6.5 liters of electrolite. I have two 1/4" outlets with hose barb fittings and tubing to vent the gas into the air filter box. When I need to add water I will fill through one tube while the other vents air from the jug. I set this first one up on the car and the jug isn't readily accessable which is why I went with the two tubes.

To power the generator I wanted to be as safe as I could engineer it. I took relay power from an "Ignition On" source. Relay power is fused at 5 amps. It then goes through a SPST rocker switch with a red LED indicator which I call an Arming Switch. With the Arming Switch on, the red LED illiminates. Relay power then passes through a momentary contact push button switch which I call the Activation Switch. On the load side of it are two relays. One is the Main Power Relay to the HHO generator, the other one is what I call a "Drop Out" relay. The contacts of the DOR are wired in parallel to the Activation Switch so that when the Activation Switch is depressed the DOR contacts close and it then supplies power to the coils of itself and the MPR even with the Activation Switch open.

Any interuption in relay power shuts the system down, be it shutting the ignition off, opening the Arming Switch, relay power fuse blowing or relay failure. HHO generator startup must be manually initiated every time, there is no way to accidentally leave it on. This prevents battery drain and unwanted HHO generation while the engine is not running.

The MPR is rated for 30 amps. It has one input fused at 30 amps from the battery and this relay has two load terminals. The first is of course used to power the HHO generator. The second one I wired to send power back to a green LED that is next to the Activation Switch. Once the system is powered up by pressing the Activation Switch, the green LED illuminates to let you know that you're making HHO.

Am I on the right track here? I realize I could add more caustic to increase both current and HHO production but want to start out slow and easy. How about the electrical end of it? Any input would be appreciated.

 

Dave & David.......I'm glad you are busy....enjoy it if you can, I'm a Residential Designer and construction of all kinds is extremely slow. Lot's of contractors, sub-contractors & designers have closed up because of it. I don't think I'll last through the year at this rate....we'll see! Very nice job though!

thedaddycat............electrically it sounds great, maybe even overkill if that is possible. But then again I'm not the best person to ask....just my 2 cents. As far as the design, I'm have a hard time seeing in my head your "M" layout and how your isolating the + & -. Can you post some pics? I'd love to see it. You said you had a hard time measuring flow.....did you try a small clear bottle as close to 1 liter as you can in a bucket full of water? Doing that, you should be able to see the bubbles and see how fast the water is displaced. Oh and as far as having 8 cells, I always understood that 14 plates made 7 cells I do not know if it works the way your describing........still would love to see pics, LOL

 

Hey Milehigh and anyone else running an HHO setup..... watch your amps.... did a little test on my truck today.

Truck running with nothing on around 20 amps

truck running with a/c, blower on
high, wipers on high and high beams
on. around 71 amps

truck running, nothing on but
HHO pulling 42 amps alt. was at 76 amps

I have a 110 amp single alt setup but you really should not push it past 70% all the time. plus if you turn anything else on you will really push the limits. the best thing it to get a high output alt. I have seen them at 175-200 amps for $250 and up. But you might want to check this guy out on ebay. eBay Motors: Powder Coated 175 Amp FORD 7.3 Diesel Truck Alternator (item 230258724600 end time Jul-03-08 06:51:04 PDT)
about $152 shipped 175 amp black powder coated

 

sorry guys I feel like I am posting a 100 times a day but I have a lot of questions...

Milehigh is your box made of plexiglass? I just talk to a glass shop and they said they did not think it (the sealant) would hold up for long filled with water. I would think that they would know what they are talking about but who knows.

 

Lets see now, How many acrylic aquariums have you seen in the world? HUMM? about a billion or so LOL! I would say your glass guys dont have the answer. I work with a plastic supply house here in the Denver area and they build water tight containers all the time. I would say they know what will work and what wont. they sold me the acrylic sheet and coached me on assembly, so far no leaks no fouls! My seams are bonded not sealed and then after drying they were sealed with the adhesive as well. My bubbler holds 20psi no problem, (did not want to blow the seams so i stoped the test there) and i have installed an inline bubbler with a blow off plug right at the inlet to the engine just in case.

testing with the PWM has started and i will post when i have data.

 

note zero fossils' latest

YouTube - ZeroFossilFuel's Channel

 

Great find lowell75.....I guess I need to get that copper #10 wire out of my unit!

 

$250 for a friggen alternator?
$152 for a friggen alternator?

GOOD GOD, NO WAY WOULD I EVER PAY THAT MUCH FOR A FRIGGEN ALTERNATOR WHEN ANYTHING THAT PUTS OUT VOLTS AND AMPS, AND WILL BOLT IN WILL DO!

Even if I had a LAMBORGHINI, I'd find something cheaper to fit in there that looked good!

I'm just too cheap!

I only spent $15!

Just do like I did and go to the wrecking yard and find a decent one, like the 120A one I got off a torched Corvette, powder coated the housings yellow and add it to your engine with some fabricated brackets and a longer belt!

Or like the other P.C. yellow one I have sitting around, a generic, cheap, old GM 78 amp one should do just fine, and if space is a serious issue, there are some decent "tiny" import alternators on those imports out there as well.

 

I guess how much you are willing to spend on an alternator depends on how many amps you need and how much you depend on it.

If you are in the snow plow business, 200 dollars is reasonable for a 150 to 200 amp alternator.

You loose more than the cost of the alternator in a couple hours of down time, and if the lots are not plowed when the customers wake up, you will probably loose customers.

200 dollars is cheap.

 

Hi folks.
Been reading this thread, amongst many others far and wide, over the last few days. Itchin to do a practical install ASAP.
I have no brand affiliations (hope y'all don't mind too much).

I'm an Aussie alive in Japan. I reckon I'm about ready to grab the bull by the horns and do an install. So... I rocked on down to the local DIY (Caines Homecenter) and scoured the joint from top to bottom for what looked like useable SS. Being Japan, most premium stuff was wrapped and presented gorgeously, with price tags to suit... but then I ventured into the 'tradesman's section'.
Joy Oh JoY! Tons of useable (sheet and tube stuff) SS products at cool prices... but no mention of SS type at all. AND most was so thin it would damn near bend if you breathed on it.

Before I go any further, I should mention that my interest in matters of HHO (or HOH) is purely academic. I ride a bicycle and so fuel cost is not an issue for me.

........ So (iffin y'all don't mind) can anyone give opinions on the following questions?

1 Would using .5mm material for plates present problems? (Warping and hence shorting between plates - in the context of quite a small 'brick' unit))

2 Would using SS material of unknown grade present short term problems? (none of the staff seemed to even know what 316 was).

After all that I did get lucky! On the way home I stopped in at the bike shop over the road from my house, and found a 50cc accident damaged machine with a good motor, running on 12V. I reckon I can get it for a song and use it show folks that HHO is REAL!

Well, thanks. (beer no. 6 awaits me)

 

welcome mike,

maybe we should all post what works best that we each have found. size shapes thicknesses, so on.

.5mm ss should be ok just watch the temps. dont boil the water
we use SS so it dont rust and make the water a muddy bath
next time you go to the store take a magnet with you. if it dont stick to the SS at all then you should be OK with it. Just dont get aluminum.
that little motor would be fun to play with to see if you could run it on HHO.

 

Yep, it would be great to get some info from folks who have successfully used any 'wacky' designs. Very often people just fall into line with a common model, not that that is a bad thing, and overlook other possibilities.

I particularly like the 'brick' idea because the generator does not house any volume of accumulating HHO. Of course the larger the volume of accumulated HHO the bigger the potential explosion.
Another thing I like about 'bricks' is that the plates themselves form the generator casing, resulting in lower weight, smaller size, and potentially better heat dissipation.

Having said all that I do realize that this forum is for Ford users, so if anyone would prefer this angle of discussion to be taken elsewhere, then please don't hesitate to say so.

Cheers for a great practical forum!

 

mikexyz,
Welcome to FTE and the IDI diesel forum.

We have several diesel boat owners in this forum as well as trucks and vans.

You are welcome to post here.

At 50 cc, you are a bit undersized, we are in the 6900 or 7300 cc range.

But you are welcome here anyway.

 

Thank you.

Yeah... I did ask if they had a bike that big, but got no joy. I'll let you know if I get any results with steroid injection.

Cheers