so since he got to 60 before you he out towed you?

 

I was illustrating the point that because the 6.2L engine makes more power and has a tranny that can keep it where it needs to be to make that power that it can accelerate faster, that's all.

Throughout this thread you never needed convincing of this, as you seem to have a good grasp on how each engine gets the job done.

I think it's worth making the point that my 6.4L truck towed that load from Columbus, OH to Hudson, WI in overdrive, only having to downshift less than half a dozen times. This is why I love the way PSDs tow.

But at nearly any speed, that 6.2L will be able to spin up and out power my 6.4L. So it might have to downshift more but it's just as capable of hauling the load.

I have my 6.7L because I got really accustomed to the low end torque of a diesel and I happen to enjoy 20 MPGs, which is something the 6.2L isn't capable of. Rationally I should have picked the 6.2L, as it would have suited my needs just fine. I just like the PSD better.

 

Ever wonder why diesels generally have taller gears than gassers? They dont NEED the higher rpms. That's why it's going to be in the higher gear. All this talk assumes the PSD will NEED to drop a gear at the same time the V10 does and this is simply not the case.

Yes, let's.


Hmm indeed. How exactly are you managing to maintain the exact same rpm in the exact same gear at the exact same road speed, using two different rear end ratios?

In your V10 4.10 scenario you're either doing 68 mph or about 5100 rpm. Take your pick. The V10 "might" still pull 3rd gear with 4.10s at 75mph, but I don't know how long I'd want to stay there. How about you? Especially since it falls flat on it's face right about there.

And assuming your numbers are correct, which is suspect. I'm looking at independent dyno charts of both engines that tell a different story.

V10 - 4700 rpm HP- 240 RW TQ-260 RW

6.4 - 3100 rpm HP- 250 RW TQ- 420 RW

Stock trucks, same company, presumably the same dyno, same gears, both run to their respective redlines (more or less) which in the case of the PSD is not 3100 btw. This wasn't a gas vs diesel run but rather "our whiz bang gizmo will improve your performance by thiiiiiiiiiiiis much", so there wouldn't be any particular reason for fudging the numbers to favor one engine over the other.

The HP & TQ curves on the PSD are practically exact duplicates of each other. Both HP & TQ climb across the board at essentially the same rate.

The V10 has drastically different HP & TQ curves. The TQ is impressively flat from 2500 rpm up to 4700. HP shows a steady climb to your chosen rpm. Not surprisingly both engines fall flat on their faces at their redline areas.

Let's look at some numbers using a relatively reasonable highway rpm of 2600 rpm. Pretty high for the PSD unless you're toting a refinery along with you, but a reasonable rpm nonetheless.

The PSD shows 145/292 at this rpm and the V10 140/305. Pretty comparable. To me the big difference is from here on out the PSD has more to give and gives it using a lot less rpm. You need 2100 more rpm to get to 240/260 while the PSD is going to use an additional 500 rpm and jump up to 250/420. Notice that impressively flat does not mean flat. The V10 actually drops torque across the band while the PSD is still climbing, along with its HP.

Based on this information the PSD is going to be the better performer, especially when the going starts to get tough. Of course I'm sure that by the time I actually get this posted there will have been a gazillion more posts with a gazillion more arguments.

Bill, maybe it's time you give Guinness a call.

 

Gotcha
I got that. I don't know about you doing over 55mph in 3rd.

Lead Head my 6.0 redlines at 4200 not 3100. I can pull up to somewhere between 3800-4000 rpms. I just can't pinpoint right where she quites pulling. I do know she's pulling at 3800 and not pulling at 4000. If we can't get any confirmation and yall coach me through on getting it hosted I'll video my tach. My Torch turns out to make some pretty good videos.

 

The tranny issue is a valid point, and the reason I keep saying the VS argument is invalid. People aren't arguing this engine vs that engine, they're arguing drive train packages. Different story. Anyway....


So you are comparing your presumably stock 6.4 to his chipped 6.2? He has 4.30 gears and you have/had what, 3.73s? Maybe 4.10s? You say your trailer is 11k and he says his is 10K w/a dinghy. Do either of you have a scale ticket to validate that? No guess work allowed.

Are you really comparing apples to apples here?

 

Yep, the 6.4 was stock.

Here's the empty ticket:



And loaded

 

Yeah, I have seen this and I am going to say the same thing. Different tow vehicles with different weights, different wind drags, different weather, etc. Same trailer, same day is the only thing that will prove anything.

Plus he had a tune in, you don't think that gave an advantage.

I am not saying the 6.2 or the v10 can't pull, I just want to see one outpull a PSD. Screw this "pull from a dead start up a 32% hill" junk. Who drag races their truck with a camper in tow? Not me and not 99% of this forum or the users of these trucks. Hook them up, at 65 mph up a 7% grade for 8 miles, see who comes out on top.

 

[QUOTE=Crazy001;9463897]
Throughout this thread you never needed convincing of this, as you seem to have a good grasp on how each engine gets the job done[QUOTE]
Your right I've openly stated the gassers will out run me. On the same coin I stand that they won't out tow me. I was just making sure that your defination of out pulling you was the fact it got to 60 mph faster than you. Let me add to this. This was 11,000lb trailers. Double it. You will see a very short drop in your performace he'll see a big difference. There again I don't claim I'll out pull anybody except Bill lol.

 

Don't forget wind drag and wheel drag differences. I hate when diesel guys say "I get 14 mpg towing 12k" or V10 guys that say "you only get 9 mpg towing 10k, I get 10 mpg towing 12k"

I have had my toy hauler bumper pull behind a 7.3 manual that was built, a 6.0 auto that was built, and a 2008 stock Duramax, and every one it gets between 8.5 and 10 mpg. Part of the reason is the speed, we tow at 65 to 70 mph, part of it is I don't have true trailer tires, they are an off road tire designed for sand, and it is a brick wall, 10 feet plus high.

Sorry for the rant. LOL

 

Sure his tuner may have given him an advantage, but his MUCH higher profile trailer also makes for a disadvantage. Without a weight ticket from Mike we'll never know the exact weight though.

I was trying to point out that torque isn't everything when it comes to towing. That gas V8 was happy singing north of 5,000 RPMs for much of the video just like my 6.4 was at 3,000 RPMs.

 

Ya, I was just in the mood to rant last night. LOL I still don't think a 6.2 in real world conditions would out pull a 6.4. Can it pull as much weight? Sure it can. Will it get to the top of the hill faster than a 6.4? I say no way. It will be close, heck it might be even, but it won't out pull the 6.4.

 

Why is that not believable?

Yes the 6.2l has a tune, however it doesn't really increase the crank power output by much just allows some more of that power to get to the ground. Compare the GCWR of the 6.4l 3.73 to the GCWR of the 6.2l with 4.30s you will see the ratings are close.

 

At the nose his trailer isn't that much higher than yours, but it is much more aerodynamic.


Absolutely. It's hp AND tq that makes for a good tow engine. That and where in the rpm band it all shows up.

 

This is starting to look better and better. So, are we allowing tuned trucks to play now?

 

I'd wager that the 6.4 with a tuner would eat that 6.2L for lunch