That doesn't surprise me at all and that is also the case with the diesel long blocks as well. With proper lubrication the cylinder bores can be within spec for hundreds and hundreds of thousands of miles.

 

Municpalities and business are taking standard diesel powered buses and equipment and converting them and have in the past as well. Since they are fleet vehicles and return home at the end of the day a bulk tank or a hookup directly to the gas line is what they use to refill them. The bulk pricing helps to keep the cost down.

As of now LPG and CNG makes more sense for fleet applications. If the LPG and CNG infrastructure is expanded it will be more appealing for the everyday citizens personal vehicles.

Just keep in mind a lot has changed in 15 years as far the automotive industry is concerned.

 

Yeah, but not in propane and NG conversions.
You still CAN'T convert diesel to propane
Propane is widely used in Europe, but gasoline cost is about double of the gas and they have propane stations every few miles. Compare it here.

 

Why not. Green Car Congress: Retrofitting Diesel to Natural Gas or Propane

The cost of the conversion is expensive. From the factory "alternative" fuel powered vehicles would be more cost effective.

Also I'm am referring to the US. I could really care less about Europe. The US is not Europe.

 

You are stretching the definition of conversion.
Installing spark plugs in diesel is way more than that.
And again you are talking Europe, where propane cost small fraction of diesel price.
Is it a coincidence that the link to technical info is not working????????

 

What is your definition of "Conversion"?

I am not talking about Europe fuel pricing, I am referring to US fuel pricing. The link shows a Diesel can be converted to use LPG. The link I posted works fine for me, fix your computer.

Here in the US LPG is often cheaper per gallon than gasoline, especially when bought in bulk.

 

http://www.impco.ws/Releases/090904-Eclipse.PDF
Here is technical info from the site you linked. See if it works for you?
You are talking Europe fuel if you link the info about European conversion.
Even propane price might be slightly lower than gasoline in US, considering lower BTU and lower efficiency of propane conversions it will come about equal if not worse cost-wise. So who will spend 5 or 10 grands on conversion to have lousy performance and inconvenience of propane fuel? People hesitate to spend 4 grands for diesel option.

 

Look I should not have to explain this to you however I think we have some language barrier here. It just seems you are having issues grasping what I'm trying to say.

I was trying to explain to you that in the response response below I am referring to the US and what those US municipalities and businesses have been doing and trying. The link I posted was to your response "You still CAN'T convert diesel to propane ". I hope that clears things up a little better. I understand the link I posted mentioned the European region.

Also, I can't open your PDF link. I'm getting "page cannot be found".

 

Than again, re-machining the whole engine is not a conversion by my standards.
We have to agree to disagree
I am technology freak and I read all the materials available about new power plants. From tens of new ideas that have been put on the roads in last generation, the only one that really works are diesel hybrid city buses, that use small diesel/generator running at constant speed to charge the batteries, who power electric motors in bus wheels. Nothing else. Even the electric Tesla car idea looked good till I saw the real car on the street. Can you easily get into the car that has roof-line below your belt-buckle?

 

I saw a Tesla at the local CVS and there is no way I could even get in it.

 

I know that a SD is not a class 8 truck, but that has nothing to do with it, the principle is the same. Imagine a big rig with a 12.0L V8 pulling 50,000 pounds up a hill at 5-6,000 rpm.... how long do you think it would last?

How many 7.3L Powerstrokes have you seen, looked at or driven? I have owned 9, and worked on and looked at and driven countless others.... 2 of the 7.3 trucks I have owned had between 3 and 400,000 miles on them and ran great!

I am comparing the 7.3L motor because it is not the 6.0L fault that it is plagued with problems... you can thank the EPA for that! and with proper maintanance the 6.0L can last a long time, I have heard of several with over 300,000 miles.

The 4.6 motor seems to have problems, there are all kinds of F-150s and expeditions with blown 4.6 motor with no where near 300k. The 5.4 and 6.8 are much better.

Did you mean 93 4.9? if so, those are Excelent motors!!!! I have owned and driven alot of those too, and have had more than one with 300k that used no oil, and several with 250k plus that ran great. I am not picking on gas motors, but for towing and hauling, a gas motor will never do as good a job in the long run. But I totally understand that a diesel is not for everyone.
Correct! if you have to put spark plugs in it to make it work, you just created a spark initiated combustion engine.....a "conversion" would be like converting your diesel to run on veggie oil. No major changes are neccasary to create combustion.

 

The 4.6 and 5.4 will both last just the same. They are almost the same engine and almost every part interchanges.

 

I didn't mean they don't exist, just that I seriously doubt that there is one out there that was as trouble-free as the guy (he posted in the V10 forum) who has 300K on his V10. And I don't just mean 6.0's either, I mean ANY DIESEL. My Dad has good luck with both of his Dodge Cummins, but they had far more than an alternator long before 100K, and they are much, much more reliable than any Ford diesel I've ever seen. OK, turn on the flamethrowers, I've got my asbestos undies on...

 

... IF the engine is designed to rev. No doubt that an engine that was designed for low RPMs will not live long if you rev the snot out of it, but if it was designed from scratch to operate within a certain RPM range, be it high or low, and you run it as intended, it will last a long time. For example, Hondas rev but last hundreds of thousands of miles. 300 ci Inline sixes don't rev, and last hundreds of thousands of miles. Now let's take a Ford 300 and force it to spin 6,500 RPM all day, and it won't be long for this world. Let's also take a 2.4L Honda V-TEC 4 banger and lug it at 1,200 RPM at high throttle angles all day, and watch it self destruct. Likewise with a diesel. A low RPM engine is optimized for that type of operation. A high RPM engine is designed to rev as well. Neither will experience a shorter life if used as designed. Throw a Diablo tuner on a Powerstroke/Cummins/Duramax and force it to run well above it's stock governed RPM and astronomically increase cylinder pressures with aggressive timing and fueling strategies, it won't last as long as if it were left close to stock either. Just like throwing a turbo and a aggressive tune on a Honda to make it produce 500 ft lbs of torque at 1200 RPMs will shorten it's life dramatically too. Just not what it was designed to do.

I am a diesel fan, but I am not exclusive to diesel either. The truth is that both engine types have merit and are able to work hard. Anyone who wants to argue that can take it up with UPS, which has discovered that for total cost to operate (maintenance, fuel, parts, mechanical failures, etc) the old GAS powered straight six 300 Ford powered and 292 Chevy powered trucks are the most cost effective trucks they have in the fleet. Especially impressive given their age. This comes from my diesel loving brother-in-law (Owns 2 diesel VWs and a Diesel Ram), who also works for UPS as a fleet mechanic supervisor. Now admittedly, part of that goes hand in hand with stricter newer vehicle emissions regulations, even on medium duty chassis, but it still goes to prove that gas isn't a pariah in the realm of trucks.

As to the issue of LPG/Propane on diesels:

When I worked at DelDOT we had a few Detroit Diesel powered trucks with an LPG conversion. They did NOT have spark plugs. They used a small pilot injection of diesel to ignite the gaseous fuel which actually provided the bulk of the power. The nice thing is that if you couldn't fill it with LPG you could still run it on diesel. This was fortunate because many times we couldn't fill with LPG because the fueling station we had was very problematic and broke down as often as a photo-copier in a high school office.

 

Then why did you bring it up? Your post below.

"If gas engines last as long, and could pull as well, why don't we see them in over the road and big rig trucks?"


So you think a 12l gasoline engine with a heavy rotating assembly that would be required for a class 8 truck will have an operating range between 5k-6k rpm? Highly unlikely.

Nope he meant what he said, 93' 4.6l and yes the 4.6l modular has been around that long.

Did you notice despite the fuel the old 300 runs on it still made its peak hp and tq numbers at very close to the same rpms as the 7.3l PSD makes its peak hp and tq?

The diesel was "converted" to run on CNG or LPG. Find a dictionary and look up the definition of "Conversion".