Gas vs PSD
Elder User
Joined: Apr 2009
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From: Spokane, WA
Nah, they are both 4.10, 5 speed, regular cab, xl trucks with the same size tires and weight.
Engine torque can be part of the equation as long as you are comparing them in the same gears and at the same speed/rpm because at that point the one with more engine torque is also producing more hp. Since gearing will be the same and wheel rpm the same, the one with more engine torque(and hp) will be producing more tractive force. The reason engine torque doesn't matter in this comparison(except off the line for the first 3,000 rpm) is because of the drastic difference in gearing and rpm ranges.
Honestly, I am not too impressed with the 6.2 off the line even with the 6 speed and 4.30 gears. Comparing it to my 2v 5.4 with both in 1st gear and turning 4,500 rpm the tractive force is 6,929 for the 6.2 and 7,112 for my 5.4. The 6.7 has seen a massive increase in low end power AND gets the 6 speed tranny while the 6.2 at its best is worse off the line than a 2v 5.4 with a manual.....
Engine torque can be part of the equation as long as you are comparing them in the same gears and at the same speed/rpm because at that point the one with more engine torque is also producing more hp. Since gearing will be the same and wheel rpm the same, the one with more engine torque(and hp) will be producing more tractive force. The reason engine torque doesn't matter in this comparison(except off the line for the first 3,000 rpm) is because of the drastic difference in gearing and rpm ranges.
Honestly, I am not too impressed with the 6.2 off the line even with the 6 speed and 4.30 gears. Comparing it to my 2v 5.4 with both in 1st gear and turning 4,500 rpm the tractive force is 6,929 for the 6.2 and 7,112 for my 5.4. The 6.7 has seen a massive increase in low end power AND gets the 6 speed tranny while the 6.2 at its best is worse off the line than a 2v 5.4 with a manual.....
Postmaster
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 3,524
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From: CA Bay Area
Define what is steep for you? Where I live -steep is when dropped brick rolls all the way down. I did own a house with driveway so steep, that my VW had the speed margin between 15 and 20 mph to take it. When I took it too slow >>> the engine would die 1/2 way up.
When I took it too fast >>> the approach impact would lower the car to wedge the front bumper into the pavement.
When I took it too fast >>> the approach impact would lower the car to wedge the front bumper into the pavement.
Posting Guru
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 2,313
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From: Sunny, Snowy, CO
Define what is steep for you? Where I live -steep is when dropped brick rolls all the way down. I did own a house with driveway so steep, that my VW had the speed margin between 15 and 20 mph to take it. When I took it too slow >>> the engine would die 1/2 way up.
When I took it too fast >>> the approach impact would lower the car to wedge the front bumper into the pavement.
When I took it too fast >>> the approach impact would lower the car to wedge the front bumper into the pavement.
Postmaster
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 4,724
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From: Rogersville, TN
Go back and look at what we were talking about when I said hp is all that matters. We were comparing how an engine pulls at different rpms, not against another truck with different gearing and rpm ranges where tractive force comes into play. I said my 5.4 pulls better at 4500 rpm than it does at 2500 rpm because monsterbaby said his truck pulls better at lower rpms. The 6.2 would smoke my 5.4 in any comparison you want to do except pulling out from a dead stop. Anytime you want to come ride with me and see how good a manual tranny will get a load moving just let me know. It's a world of difference between the automatic.
Elder User
Joined: May 2010
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From: WV
I'm not saying the Dodge will make up the lost room, I'm just saying there may be points were it will gain on you, untill the Dodge shifts into the same gear.
Elder User
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 650
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From: WV
Do they have the mirrors all the way out like they do here?!!! I know one of these days, I'm gonna get one of those mirrors with my work truck one day. I have a nephew that told me that having the mirrors out is suppose to be cool. I told him that having the mirrors out when not towing is the sign of a bleepin' idiot.
Nothing like seeing some jacked up truck with one extended mirror and the other one missing.
Elder User
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 685
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From: Spokane, WA
Go back and look at what we were talking about when I said hp is all that matters. We were comparing how an engine pulls at different rpms, not against another truck with different gearing and rpm ranges where tractive force comes into play. I said my 5.4 pulls better at 4500 rpm than it does at 2500 rpm because monsterbaby said his truck pulls better at lower rpms. The 6.2 would smoke my 5.4 in any comparison you want to do except pulling out from a dead stop. Anytime you want to come ride with me and see how good a manual tranny will get a load moving just let me know. It's a world of difference between the automatic.
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Elder User
Joined: May 2010
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From: WV
I believe the manuals have a low gear that is about half the size of the automatic 1st gear. The manuals 2nd gear is equivalent to the the auto's 1st gear. This would give it huge pulling power from a stop verses any auto, modern or late.
Postmaster
Joined: Oct 2006
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From: SE Texas
JL
Elder User
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 685
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From: Spokane, WA
Agreed, but not enough to make up for the huge hp/torque disadvantage. So maybe the first 5 ft, which would be imperceptible to the human eye. LOL
Postmaster
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 4,171
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From: SE Texas
A 5.4L with just 350 ft lbs:
350 x 5.79 x 4.10=8308.6 ftlbs to the rear wheels.
A 6.0L with 570 ft-lbs:
570 x 3.11 x 4.10=7268.07 ftlbs to the rear wheels.
Yes, the manual trans 5.4L will get the load moving easier than the 6.0L with a Torqshift. Your engine torque means NOTHING with gearing that MULTIPLIES the torque.
JL
Elder User
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 685
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From: Spokane, WA
Do you not understand torque multiplication?
A 5.4L with just 350 ft lbs:
350 x 5.79 x 4.10=8308.6 ftlbs to the rear wheels.
A 6.0L with 570 ft-lbs:
570 x 3.11 x 4.10=7268.07 ftlbs to the rear wheels.
Yes, the manual trans 5.4L will get the load moving easier than the 6.0L with a Torqshift. Your engine torque means NOTHING with gearing that MULTIPLIES the torque.
JL
A 5.4L with just 350 ft lbs:
350 x 5.79 x 4.10=8308.6 ftlbs to the rear wheels.
A 6.0L with 570 ft-lbs:
570 x 3.11 x 4.10=7268.07 ftlbs to the rear wheels.
Yes, the manual trans 5.4L will get the load moving easier than the 6.0L with a Torqshift. Your engine torque means NOTHING with gearing that MULTIPLIES the torque.
JL
And no he would not take my 6.0 either, with 3.73 gears. Remember I have a 45rwhp tow tune, so like 60 at the engine or whatever.
Postmaster
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 4,171
Likes: 12
From: SE Texas
JL