for sure I will mark the caps if I take it apart

if I end up having to take the block to get machine work done what is the limit for decking the block? Do I have to check my piston protrusion? Decking it seems like an easy solution to a consistent RA and flatness.

 

Yeah, you need to check the protrusion. Decks usually don't need that much material off, maybe 0.002", but depending on the amount removed, their are shaved pistons from Mahle in some sides. Some machinest like to do that anyway to make sure there is valve clearance for a Stage 2 cam.

Easy solution, that depends on the shop.

It's pretty hard to FUBAR these caps, each mated pair has a unique break pattern, so it's very appearant when the cap is reversed or on the wrong rod.

You need to have a copy of the International service manual, and having the Ford manual along side it doesn't hurt. The better instuctions are in the International Service Manual, the Ford manual is better for giving you torque values every step of the way.

I had a notebook with me every step of the way with both manuals indexed in there.

 

thanks Jack! Well see what happens once I get the engine pulled in a few weeks and start the tear down process. My main thought was if I need a machine shop to repair any damage I may as well have them deck the block square and true. I think I’m going down the rabbit hole. Lol

 

If you have to have block work done expect to also put fresh cam bearings in it.
At that point you can do things like a stage II cam.

 

yeah for sure man. Are the rod bolts hard to replace? Are they captive in the cap? Do you see a need to have them reconditioned? Honed and resized? New bushings?

 

I'm new to the 6.0 as an owner of two trucks now but to me, having worked on a few vehicles over the years as a tech at a couple Ford dealerships (just because I type that DOES NOT MEAN that I think I know it all, I'm just typing that to state that I have experience working at a couple dealerships and working on quite a few vehicles over the years), I don't know why you would invest so much time into a project like this and not replace the rod and crankshaft bearings as well. Obviously, every little bit adds up but for $124 for rod bearings, $85 for main bearings, and $25 for cam bearings, at around $235 or maybe a little more (depending on what brand and where you get them), by the time you spend at least $3k on a decent set of heads, $400 plus for head studs (unless you can find a brand new set on Facebook Marketplace or Craigslist that someone is getting rid of for less), and whatever the costs are for everything else you have listed (another $1000 or more possibly?), why wouldn't you invest such a small amount more for something like rod or crankshaft bearings? The place I got pricing for the bearings was Diesel Dynamics for reference. I'm sure there are plenty others that are comparable. Anywhooooo..........

You're gonna have at least $4000 to $4500 or more invested without the bearings. For $250 more, why wouldn't you do it?

Since you mentioned pulling the engine completely out, it's obviously going to be an easy task with the engine removed. To me, I think that part is a no-brainer. But, I understand that others with more knowledge and experience with these engines may feel different.

I'm just going off of some of the things I've done in the past working on various vehicles.

In a "sort of way", I'm kind of in the same predicament as you as I have to decide what I want to do with one of my trucks that has a coolant issue. Although I need to do more diagnosis to determine if it truly is a head/gasket issue (among possible other things along with this), I'm unfortunately already figuring it's going to be requiring an engine teardown of some sort.

And at that point, I'm with you when it comes to the "rabbit hole" situation.

Heck, since you're pulling the engine, why stop with what you mentioned? Why not just order a long block without turbo and call it a day? Better yet, why not get a turbo as well? At 250k, it's bound to need replacing as well right?

Man, this is a tough one. Of course you want to invest some money to get the truck to last for a while. But, is $5k enough? What about another grand or maybe 2 grand more? Is $7k enough? Obviously it depends on your savings or the debt you want to get into if you choose/want to put things on a credit card or take out a loan to pay for the stuff.

The unfortunate thing is, if you're pulling the engine, why wouldn't you replace the HPOP and then any internal components that need replacing as well? How about the low pressure oil pump? It's only $150 or maybe a little more or less depending on brand. Since these engines rely primarily on oil pressure to run properly (or at all really with the exception of fuel obviously), why not replace the oil pumps as well to make sure things are running smooth? But again, "rabbit hole".

My concern would be, let's say you invest $5k or $6k into heads, ARP head studs, pushrods, gaskets, and whatever else you have in the list below, now what if something else that you didn't replace takes a dump and causes an issue with the engine? I'm not sure what that part or component would be but just trying to spit ball.

-- (I'm just gonna copy your list here) --

new cylinder heads
Studs
Felpro gaskets
new push rods
new lifters
rear main seal/cover gasket
bed plate seals
oil pan/adapter seals
valve cover seals
oil cooler
reseal the HPOP piping with new O rings
EGR delete

I'll admit, I'm a cheap butt when it comes to a lot of things. At the same time, I'm probably going to have a hard time not changing a lot of internal things of an engine if I'm doing a teardown. At least not if it's things that are relatively inexpensive to replace in the grand scheme of things. I mean, if we're talking replacing the pistons, crank, and cam, then maybe I'm not doing those things if I can help it. But things like rings, bearings, bolts (if needed) and some other things may not be out of the question. At the same time, I think it depends on what is "typically" going wrong that needs replacing.

In this case, are the factory rod and crankshaft studs or bolts more than adequate to continue service or should they be replaced as well? If it means keeping your rod from flying off the crankshaft or the crank from walking and doing other things obviously not good, is $500 a bad investment? I don't know. Just throwing things out there. For all I know, the internal bolts have never been known to ever be an issue unless something really weird happened so this may be a bad example.

But if you're in there, why not do rings as well?

I don't know. If I'm pulling the engine, I think I'm doing a complete teardown and cleaning everything up. Pretty sure anyway. I would have a hard time justifying spending all that time removing the engine, tearing it down part way and then spending all that time to put it back in and not taking pistons out to clean the as well as clean the grooves and see if there are bad carbon deposits and so on. But, at that point, I just as well replace the rings because that price is pretty low when you're getting to that point. If a piston is bad and a wall is scored or something bad, then that's that. But if you can get away with just cleaning the pistons and fresh set of rings can be had for a couple hundred, why aren't you doing them at that point?

But again, rabbit hole.

I'm half tempted to get the heads off my truck since I have a set of head gaskets (I guess they are Mahle from Sinister diesel so I'm not sure if those are good or not) and ARP head studs. But, if I get the heads off and find a few hairline cracks or worse ones, then what? Do I try to put the heads back on and put the head gaskets on and drive it like that for a while or put heads on? For me, I also have an oil consumption issue so, I've got other things I have to consider. You probably don't have that so perhaps your issue is a lot simpler than mine. (Possibly)

I think if you're pulling the engine, you really have to consider what the costs are to do it all or at least most of the internals short of actually replacing the crank, cam, rods, pistons, and so on. But of course, it's not our money so there's that. It's easy for us (me) to sit here and say "oh yeah, you better do this and that" when we aren't having to pay for other things. I think it probably depends on how long you plan to keep it and how you want to use it as well. If you're looking to get another year out of it, then maybe it's not a necessity to spend a lot. Or, if you only use it to tow a few things a month or every other month, then maybe not a big deal.

 

I will definitely do bearings. The real mystery is the camshaft condition and bore condition those will decide what I need to do. I would like to hot tank the block it up real good along with the pistons if the bores are useable. My concern now is if I have the block decked true and square will I have too much piston protrusion? I wonder if the machinist could shave them .010 or so to gain some clearance back especially if I want to run a larger cam like a stage 2.

 

Yes, a good machine shop can mill the top off of your pistons. Or you can order new ones, if doing an over bore, with a recessed top height. My block and heads had minimal decking done, about 0.003" on each surface, and going with a stage 2 cam, I had acceptable amounts of piston protrusion and valve to head clearance. I love the Stage 2 cam. She seems to run much smoother. And power comes on earlier in the RPM range as well. Of course, some of that is the ECU programming along with 155cc/stock injectors.

If you have over 250k miles on that engine, your cam and lifters are prolly about to let go anytime anyway. That's what caused my issues. A bad lifter roller bearing taking out the roller and damaging the cam lobe trapping heat in the piston and causing the compression ring to fail. And that was at 189k miles. B.

 

Bruce gave you the rundown on decking the block and solutions. The cam and lifters cannot be visually checked for a fatigue failure issue that can happen short after the rebuild. If the engine is going to gone though, a new cam and new lifters go in. End of discussion. The cylinder bores are another story. They can be measured and can be visually inspected.

Have the shop put in new cam bearings, it's 15 minutes of work.

 

Well I made some good progress today in the span of about 3 hours and 30 minutes I got a lot done.

still need to pull the turbo then work on disconnecting my up pipes. Tackle the AC compressor, remove the torque converter nuts, remove any miscellaneous wiring, starter wiring, remove the fuel/oil filter housings. Then support the transmission and remove bell housing bolts then engine mounts.

we’ll see how long it this all takes but I’d pulling the engine out is a 7-8 hour affair for a newb like me.


Starting tear down

Front bumper radiator and inter cooler removed

Transmission cooler and condenser removed

Removed ficm and working on the turbo

 

They come out easy.

 

TooManyToys awesome version 6 bracket almost done. Nice kit and well thought out.

 

Jack check your text messages.

That does look nice. On your things to get list I would add a condenser along with a new dryer and orifice tube.
Then get a can or two of A/C flush and clean out the lines and the evaporator. The condenser is impossible to do
the way it's built does not let you flush all the lines. The PAG oil when exposed to air turns corrosive. At least that
is the info I got and I was working at a major manufacture of A/C systems.

 

Yeah I will replace the condenser, dryer, and orifice tube. How hard is to flush the system? I have the rear AC system too. Never had any AC issues its always worked amazing. What lines do I flush?

 

With the rear system it will take a bit more work.
I did mine with one of those little tools that you fill with the flush and them
blow it trough the lines to blow out all the old oil and any other contaminates.
Does your system have a second orifice tube for the back or does it use a valve?
Basily you need the flush and a compressor and a flush kit like this thing.

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