Yeah, ok, I understand the catch 22's.

Maybe throw in another quart, sort out the brakes, and then haul a$$.

I think when the rings are seated, you've taken several anxiety pills, and you've sat on some of FB's nails to distract you, (LMAO), then you can look at things in detail.

I was going to ask if you are sure that the vacuum advance works, as a f$$ked diaphragm would cause a low vacuum reading, but that would be one of the ''look at things in detail'' later.

Maybe the low vacuum is indeed caused by the rings not being seated yet !

Probably best to observe things after the ring seating. Observing now is probably premature and misleading.

At one point did you say you fancied an HEI distributor ?

 

That's a good possibility. And no... No HEI for me. Not so sure about those things. Duraspark works just fine for me - even the Chinaspark works alright for now.

 

Here is a page out of the 1971 shop manual. The D0OF-U would be a pre-smog 400. This would be a points distributor but the advance numbers would remain the same. Keep in mind that this is in camshaft degrees. Normal idle vacuum at sea level idling in gear is 15 inches for a 400 with a stock cam. Don't know your altitude but you will lose about an inch for every one thousand feet above sea level. The best way to check the vacuum advance on the engine is with your timing light and a hand held vacuum pump that way you can apply specific amounts of vacuum and plot the curve.
Sorry about the pictures. I hate this new format.

 

So from what I can see, I need to check what my timing curve is at by setting the rpms at the following stages:

500, 750, 1000, 1500, 2000, 2500, 3000

Then record my inches of Merc for each of those stages, and plot it on a curve. Sound about right?

 

That is the way you check the centrifugal advance curve. Do that with the vacuum disconnected. You cannot check the vacuum advance curve with engine vacuum because that is a load sensitive system. Without a distributor machine the only way to check it is with the engine idling at a speed lower than the beginning of the centrifugal advance. Then with the vacuum line disconnected from the engine use a hand held vacuum pump with a gauge on it in combination with your timing light to plot the amount of advance you get for each 5 inches of vacuum you pull on the can. I don't know which can is on your distributor sometimes they are stamped with a number. The one pictured is for a 1997, F700 with a 429. The 4 stamped on it means it will only pull in 8 crank degrees of advance. Your distributor should have a 10 or 12 degree can on it, and shouldn't start moving until you have around 5 inches of vacuum on it.
These Ford cans are somewhat adjustable with an allen wrench but that has to be done on the road in real world conditions.

 

I'm confusing you with someone else with regards to the HEI. LOL !

Nope ! That doesn't ''sound about right'' at all.

Vacuum is one thing, and the timing curve is another.

Use vacuum readings at idle to determine the engine's state of health. That's it !

(Yes, playing with fuelling and timing raises and lowers vacuum, but so does adjusting looser and tighter tappet pre load for example, and who measures vacuum when doing that !!?? )

Refer to post 267, and see page 3 of the attached. You measure the ignition timing at the 500rpm intervals, not vacuum.
(I forgot to state that the vacuum advance should be disconnected and plugged when doing the timing curve. )

Make sure you understand from the attached that the 'total timing' , a.k.a. all in timing, is the idle + centrifugal timing, and that it has a limit at which it stops advancing. (governed by a limiter.)

Make sure that you also understand that the springs determine the speed with which that timing comes in.

The vacuum advance can be fine tuned, if required, AFTER the above timing has been dialled in.

Or put another way, the total timing is set so that there is no pinging at WOT, and thus maximises power,

Vacuum timing is set for no pinging at cruising + light throttle, and thus maximises fuel economy.

On both of those, advance the timing until there is pinging, then back it off 1 degree at a time until there's no pinging.(During the 'fine tune, test drive' stage )

Hmmm, if your Duraspark is anything like my Motorcraft dizzy, then dialling in the timing is a p.i.t.a.

(That Motorcraft went in the bin a while back ! )

Sorry Crop Duster, but those pages are a waste of time as they refer to an OE engine.

Aaron, forget about your timing until you've seated the rings.

If the timing is out, and doesn't ping, it doesn't matter.

If it pings, back off the dizzy, a tad, by hand.

Initially, You won't even feel if the timing is out by a few degrees.

 

I agree with FMJ on all points....especially with the timing...

Don't try to get things done yesterday......you've got the rings to seat first, then you can play with, and plot, your total timing. That'll take some time and it would help if you had an assistant to make a mark on a Cartesian Plane when you say YO! every 500 RPMs.....

For the time being, if you're not runnin' too hot and she's purrin' when you rub the fur, leave her be and run the Bejesus outta her!

So, I'll just kick back and read your stuff......mebbe I can learn something about .............sulking?

 

Just incase anyone was wondering whatever happened to the refresh. Took a side-track to figure out my serpentine system a little better. Also waiting on exhaust tubing to keep the Po-pos and neighbours happy.

Here's a video of the truck running with the serp system complete. Also posted this on my other thread.


I'm waiting for my buddy to get back from his vacation to post up the video of the first start-up.

 

278 postings? No wonder this thread took forever to read through!

The Hot Rod guys at Roadkill Garage also discovered disintegrated cam bearings when doing a quicky 3 day rebuild on a 351C:


. .

 

Make that 280 haha

I do remember seeing this episode before they started holding their hand out on youtube/motortrend. I would have easily traded those cam bearings for mine lol.

Just as a small update, I had some overheating issues with the serpentine system I installed. Turns out it was a lower rad hose collapsing when the motor was under heavy load (heavy foot driving conditions)

Got it all solved with a pair of lower radiator hose springs, just installed last night and test driven.

Now the temps sit somewhere around the "NOR" in "NORMAL" on the gauge. Even in stop-and-go traffic, temps don't get that high.
Oil pressure is sitting at a nice 20 - 25 psi at HOT (heavy foot driving conditions) idle.
Serpentine belt system is working very well - power steering and alternator working as they should.
Transmission operates very well, with the hottest temps getting up to 240F after heavy heavy foot driving, but quickly fall back to 220. Temp sender is directly off the OUT line, so those temps are approximately what the inside of the case sees.

 

They re-used those cam bearings... should have pulled them and put back in 180 degrees rotated, since cam bearings only wear on the bottom part...

Your 3 Day Overhaul took a little longer than theirs... LOL!

Glad you went TMI pistons... the fuel savings alone should eventually pay for the overhaul... plus the power boost...

 

Okay... so a small update.

Changed my oil from Joe Gibbs BR30 Break-in oil to Joe Gibbs HR2 Hot Rod 10W-30 (lots of zinc!)

Didn't think much of this... looked normal to me. Until I saw the oil filter... lol


Comparison photo.


Pulled the oil filter and drained as much oil as I humanly could... holy moses that's a lot more fine metal than I thought! But I did put 200 kms (150-ish miles) on the motor after initial break-in
Here's the bottom of the oil filter and what the majority of the oil coming from the filter looked like... yuck!


I cut the filter with a sawzall... so a lot of that fuzzy stuff is filter fluff and not metal. All of the metal inside the filter was very fine.


I must say... I was quite surprised by how heavy the first filter was. There was a lot of metal inside that thing.... took a few trys to dump all of the used oil out too because it was a bit on the thick side from all the fine metal.


Pulled the #1 a spark plug to check how everything was burning... didn't bother checking the rest, but I will soon. Gap was still 0.44, right where I left it.


Not motor related... but I found a white buffalo on the weekend too
Oh... and some factory box rails!


So I checked timing... 13* BTDC (initial - exactly where I left it). Checked with vacuum advance disconnected and plugged on both sides (dizzy + manifold).... and something strange occurred...
Got a friend to hold the motor steady at 3500rpm... showed me 11* BTDC... I kept telling myself that couldn't be right... so I checked it again... and again... and again... Still 11* BTDC at 3500 rpm without vacuum... What gives?!?!
Reconnected the vacuum, pulled the motor up to 3500rpm... Showed 33* BTDC....

Sounds like mechanical advance isn't operating as it should???
I wasn't expecting to see a DROP in advance when the vacuum was disconnected and the motor was revved up....

Time for the Chinaspark to go in the trash and buy a remanufactured Duraspark? I'm at a loss here...
I don't have a fancy timing light... but should that matter?

EDIT: I am also waiting for Crop Duster to say "I told you so" lol.

 

Did you change oil after you ran in the cam? If you did then that would be enough metal to make me be concerned. If you did not then you will have a bunch of cast iron fuzz from the cam, lifters and the cylinder walls. But all new engines make metal for a little while. The only thing I see in your pictures if the color is coming through true is what looks like copper. Any large amount of copper can mean a bearing has gone through to the base metal. I ignored some copper flakes in an aircraft engine once. It not only cost me the engine but it also cost the airplane that the engine was bolted to. The best way to check those filters is to separate the canister from the base where it is crimped together then cut the paper pleats from the base with your pocket knife then unfold the pleats and observe what is in them. They actually make a special can opener to cut oil filters open.
I think we had a conversation about those Chinese and Mexican Durasparks in the past, so you know what I think about them.

 

I did not change the oil after initial break-in. I drove it for 200 kms (150 miles) before changing the oil. The pictures above are from my first oil change (break-in oil -> to -> Joe Gibbs Hot Rod 10W-30).

Copper? Which photo are you referring to? I didn't see any copper flakes when I pulled everything apart - nothing shiny, nothing yellow/gold coloured. Only the dark small flakes you see in the photos.
Are you referring to the large copper crush washer on my oil pan magnetic plug? That's the only piece of copper I've seen since changing my oil.

Good info about the filter. I'll yank it out of the garbage and pull it apart some more for some closer inspection - I didn't know there was a special way to open those up.

Likely time to invest in a good remanufactured unit from Autoline in Winnipeg, MB, Canada methinks. Rockauto sells their units... shoulda spent the extra $70 for a good Duraspark...

 

No comment about driving 200 kms on break-in oil.

What exactly does ''lots of zinc!'' mean ?
Check with the oil company !!
Too much zinc doesn't do our engines any favours.
+/- 1,100 ppm zinc and +/- 800 ppm phosphorus is what you want.

LOL, when I said your timing curve should be linear, I didn't mean horizontal.

Yup, your mechanical advance is shot. Do the arms simply need lubricating ? Are the springs working ?

I've just become a big fan of the HEI dizzy, and I wish I'd got it 14 years ago already.

Hivoltj recently posted details about one that he got FWIW.

At idle, in neutral, what is your timing with the vacuum adv connected ? +/- 31 ?

A cheap basic timing light suffices.

Your truck should go like a rocket when the timing is fixed !

Nice pics. The copper can be seen in pic 1.