The 3V heads are a completely different cylinder head,and use a radically different plug.
EVERY vehicle I own/drive is a modular, and not a single one has had a single problem with a plug in over a half-million miles-close to a million miles if you count the work truck and my 3V truck.
'98 F150-260K miles
'97 T-Bird-250K miles
'01 Navigator-165K miles
'01 F150-223K miles
'05 F250-75K miles
If this head design were such a big issue, then the dozens of race cars I work on/around with 30+psi of turbo of supercharged boost would be "blowing them out" them before they get off the line.
JL

 

Well after reading 5 pages of this topic i noticed it was 159 pages long! boy did this guy ever open a can of beans? We do concrete for a living, poured walls, foundations etc. We have all ton trucks except for my 1999 Gas superduty its a f250 5-speed. We have a 1996 F350 Singlewheel 7.3 with 450,000 Hard working/pulling miles (manual tranny got stuck in gear this week but its the original one) and we got a 2004 F350 dually with only 140K. As far as pulling stuff around town the Gas truck does fine, but if we are traveling to a job that is several hours away then the diesel is a must. Gas is a great work truck but if your traveling with a heavy load then i say a diesel. The gas truck is my daily driver because its cheap to maintenance and still pulls good.

 

No. The 6.0 PSD does not have an in cylinder pressure measuring device. The V10, and virtually every gasoline engine since 1995 has a knock/ping/detonation sensor, some have two or more. These sensors can detect so little detonation that the computer would normally start pulling timing well before any pinging becomes remotely audible. The "HEMI" Guys are running 10.5:1 compression, 89 Octane recommended, and most people run 87. Much higher compression then the modular series, and yet these engines experience no detonation? Why, because the computer properly compensates.

So that is two failures on Fords part then. 1: Factory ignition timing curves that readily cause pinging with the recommended, and 2: Lack of proper programming in the computer to pull timing when it occurs - and if Ford purposely designed/programmed the computer to allow some pinging, then it is a design flaw of the heads if the threads can be stripped out so easily under "acceptable" combustion activity.

Either way you try to spin it, it is a design fault on Ford's part.

If this is such a little issue, is that why there is a guy who actually runs a successful business traveling around the country repairing 2v modular heads? Is that why there are many people on here that have been around cars/trucks all their lives, know what sounds the engine should be making and should not, and still have blown out plugs? Is that why my neighbor has done two helicoil repair jobs on modular engines before?

 

You need to read up more on the modern "hemi". It's 9.6:1 - The 2009 uses 10.5:1, but also has variable valve timing.

Pinging is not what causes plugs to go phoot

Have you ever wondered how many modulars have been produced to date?

One guy running around the country? Yeah, that's about the size of it.

Because of the millions produced, even a .01% failure rate makes his decade

 

I know plenty about the new Hemi, and yes the 2009+ 5.7s use 10.5:1 compression. The variable valve timing is mainly for emissions reasons and idle quality. It lets them smooth out the idle with "lumpier" cam profiles. It can also let them achieve a pseudo-EGR effect by keeping the exhaust valves open well into the intake stroke.
My point still stands however, the 6.1 Hemi is/was running 10.3:1 compression, the 08 and earlier Hemi 5.7s ran 9.6:1, and now the new 09+ 5.7s run 10.5:1 and not one of them has a "spark knock" issue, even on 87 octane. The computer can properly compensate and retard the timing. Yet according to Johnny Langton, the old 2v V10s with measily 9:1 compression seem to have a big enough pinging issue that drivers have to let out of the throttle, because the computer can't compensate?

The thing about pinging/compression/etc is mainly to prove that no matter which way Johnny tries to spin it, the spark plug ejection primarily is a Ford design issue.

My comments were directed at Johnny Langton. I don't know what actually causes V10 plug ejection, but I personally don't believe it to be excessive detonation.

Enough have blown plugs that he can make a profit traveling around the country. Enough have blown plugs that 3/5 people I know with Fords or who have friends with Fords have either heard about or personally experienced a plug ejection.

 

Krewat, according to Johnny, pinging is what causes the plugs to shoot out. Lead Head was responding to his quote.

So what causes the plugs to shoot out if it isn't a design flaw. The only motor I have ever heard of this happening to is the V-10. A mechanic shop I personnally know has fixed many of these engines from this problem.

Also, why is the engine pinging? Poor fuel choice (octane rating)? Computer programming problem? Pinging is very bad and will cause holes in pistons or bent connecting rods. All racers know this.

 

I hope you continue to have success with your modulars. I hope mine never has any problems either. I think we had this same exact discussion in another forum though. This was where I replied that a design flaw does not mean that EVERY SINGLE ENGINE EVER BUILT will shoot a plug. It just means that they are MORE PRONE TO SHOOTING PLUGS THAN OTHER ENGINES! Go read the 5.0, 5.8, big block, 6 cyl, etc forums and see how many threads you can find on spark plugs being shot out of the head. Then go read the 2v modular forum and see how many you can find. Not every 6.0 out there has had problems either. Would you argue that there are no design flaws with it as well?

 

What's your thoughts on the intake that came on your 97 Bird? Any design flaws with it or was that operator error as well?

 

I think the reason they expell plugs is mainly because the are in too tight or too loose. Other factors could be;1. Failing to clean dirt/grit of of the hole when replacing plugs which could cause partial destruction of the delicate and few aluminum threads. 2. Using any foriegn substance on the threads which would cause a faulty torque reading. 3. Waiting untill 100k+ miles to change plugs which could have caused corrosion leading to compromising the entegrity of the delicate and few threads in the head. 4. Using oil, neverseize, etc which could cause a spin out of the plug. While neverseize is a substance that causes easy removal in the future that is exactly what you don't want. Dry is best, keep it clean and torque to 14 ft. lbs.

 

After school time? You've got to be kidding me. Seriously? Someone disagrees with you and you assume they have to be a child? Go take a look at this website and see how many people are talking about having to pay over $3,500 to get their tritons fixed after their plugs blew out. Consumer complaints about Ford Engines - Spark Plug Defect There are over 300 pages of complaints on that one site alone.

Maybe you should take some of your after school time and follow your own advice. Several people in the modular forum have said that they have had multiple plugs blow out on the same head, even on the same plug that they had fixed previously. The only way to "fix" the problem is to put a set of 3v heads on it, but the last time I checked they had their own spark plug issues. One can't keep plugs in and the other you can't get them out. At least once you put head studs and an egr delete on the 6.0 you don't have to worry about them anymore.

 

Now that is funny.

 

Funny but pathetic.

 

The one that Ford issued a TSB about and repaired FOR NO CHARGE well beyond the standard vehicle warranty term?
JL

 

Pinging is part of the problem.
The OEM programming is a factor as well-by never allowing open-loop-the engine stays in a state of being "on the edge" all the time.
JL

 

Whether it was replaced free of charge while under warranty isn't the issue(take a blown spark plug to ford and see if they fix it for free). The issue is that the first edition tritons had their fair share of problems too. Some of which were minor and some of which caused complete engine failure and massive recalls(sounds a lot like the 6.0).

I have or have had about 10 fords that have the tfi module on them. Only one of them had a problem. By your logic there was no design flaw with those either since I didn't have a problem with every single one of them. The one that had a problem just so happened to catch on fire sitting in my driveway and burn to the ground. Not every single vehicle with the cruise control switch problem has caught on fire either. So no design flaw there either, huh?