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Old Oct 3, 2023 | 11:13 AM
  #331  
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Originally Posted by aklim
Do I have that level of a job? If not, I don't expect such a package.
So a CEO brings so much value in your eyes that he deserves a multi-million severance package but when a worker gets fired he just gets shown the door and you think it is fair because his job is so stressful no one else could possibly do it? We should all just take his job if we don't like it cause that's how it works. No one ever gets hired to a company where all of management is far from retirement and will never leave their position which stalls upward mobility. We should all just take that management job or we aren't worthy of it because if we were we would just take it. If we can't just take that management job it is because we aren't qualified and we need to go get more qualified and then come back and take it.

Is that how it works?
 
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Old Oct 3, 2023 | 11:54 AM
  #332  
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The focus on the CEO salary makes no sense to me. If the CEO takes a 50%, or 75% pay cut, will that mean the strike will end? If not, who cares what the CEO makes? If the CEO made $200k a year, will that somehow solve the problem of the UAW workers who can't live within their means, and are living paycheck to paycheck? It seems like the UAW should pick an argument and stick to it as their focus.
 
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Old Oct 3, 2023 | 11:55 AM
  #333  
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Originally Posted by OBS460
So a CEO brings so much value in your eyes that he deserves a multi-million severance package but when a worker gets fired he just gets shown the door and you think it is fair because his job is so stressful no one else could possibly do it? We should all just take his job if we don't like it cause that's how it works. No one ever gets hired to a company where all of management is far from retirement and will never leave their position which stalls upward mobility. We should all just take that management job or we aren't worthy of it because if we were we would just take it. If we can't just take that management job it is because we aren't qualified and we need to go get more qualified and then come back and take it.

Is that how it works?
Whenever I got fired or I quit, the "bonus" I got was not getting/not qualifying for unemployment insurance that I paid into, because I got fired or I quit... and I have been fired about 12 times and probably quit about 12 times in my working life...

EDIT; I should be a billionaire by now...
 
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Old Oct 3, 2023 | 11:55 AM
  #334  
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Originally Posted by OBS460
So a CEO brings so much value in your eyes that he deserves a multi-million severance package but when a worker gets fired he just gets shown the door and you think it is fair because his job is so stressful no one else could possibly do it? We should all just take his job if we don't like it cause that's how it works. No one ever gets hired to a company where all of management is far from retirement and will never leave their position which stalls upward mobility. We should all just take that management job or we aren't worthy of it because if we were we would just take it. If we can't just take that management job it is because we aren't qualified and we need to go get more qualified and then come back and take it.

Is that how it works?
Your item is worth what someone is willing to pay based on the perceived value. I don't decide that. The buyer does. They see his credentials and track record and if they can't attract him and want him, they pay up to their limit. Not my business.

My business is to make my track record and qualifications good enough to make the buyer pay me what I want.

I don't ask or want a percentage of the paycheck of someone more successful than I and I don't want to share mine with someone less successful than I. We stand alone. This is the story of The Little Red Hen. Everyone wants a piece of the bread but nobody wants to help her make it from seeds found.
 
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Old Oct 3, 2023 | 12:19 PM
  #335  
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Originally Posted by aklim
Your item is worth what someone is willing to pay based on the perceived value. I don't decide that. The buyer does. They see his credentials and track record and if they can't attract him and want him, they pay up to their limit. Not my business.

My business is to make my track record and qualifications good enough to make the buyer pay me what I want.

I don't ask or want a percentage of the paycheck of someone more successful than I and I don't want to share mine with someone less successful than I. We stand alone. This is the story of The Little Red Hen. Everyone wants a piece of the bread but nobody wants to help her make it from seeds found.
So you don't want a percentage of the paycheck of someone else but the CEO deserves it because it is what the buyer wants? I'm sure the buyer wants the CEO to be happy when they fire him for underperforming and hand him a chunk of money from the company's bank account just to make him leave. Everything you are saying only works on paper. The real world does not work like you dream it does. You can get all of the credentials you want and still not be able to get the job at the specific business you want. They have to have a vacancy. You can be qualified to be the CEO but if they aren't looking you aren't getting looked at.

In this consumer driven world far from a capitalism textbook where you are stealing your responses from, companies put out cheap plastic garbage made from cheap labor on the other side of the planet because the companies don't value your labor they value profits over all else. They think your labor to perform any task is too expensive. It is the American way for businesses to keep paying people less until they shut the plant down ruin the economy of that town and go to a 3rd world country for labor.

Go get your credentials and pick the job you want at the company you want cause apparently that is how your world works.
 
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Old Oct 3, 2023 | 12:20 PM
  #336  
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I laugh at the comparison between Japan and US car CEO's. Two completely different cultures. With Japan it is a matter of Honor, yes, Honor does exist. The head honchos of the Japanese companies aren't there for the money, but for the privilege and honor to serve that position. The Japanese culture is completely different compared to US.
 
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Old Oct 3, 2023 | 12:36 PM
  #337  
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Originally Posted by acdii
I laugh at the comparison between Japan and US car CEO's. Two completely different cultures. With Japan it is a matter of Honor, yes, Honor does exist. The head honchos of the Japanese companies aren't there for the money, but for the privilege and honor to serve that position. The Japanese culture is completely different compared to US.
They also get some honor from treating their employees with respect, not just throwaways that cost the company $$$... IMO
 
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Old Oct 3, 2023 | 12:41 PM
  #338  
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Originally Posted by 2021F350
They also get some honor from treating their employees with respect, not just throwaways that cost the company $$$... IMO
True, but that honor and respect works both ways. Something you will never get in the states.
 
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Old Oct 3, 2023 | 12:53 PM
  #339  
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Originally Posted by OBS460
So you don't want a percentage of the paycheck of someone else but the CEO deserves it because it is what the buyer wants? I'm sure the buyer wants the CEO to be happy when they fire him for underperforming and hand him a chunk of money from the company's bank account just to make him leave. Everything you are saying only works on paper. The real world does not work like you dream it does. You can get all of the credentials you want and still not be able to get the job at the specific business you want. They have to have a vacancy. You can be qualified to be the CEO but if they aren't looking you aren't getting looked at.

In this consumer driven world far from a capitalism textbook where you are stealing your responses from, companies put out cheap plastic garbage made from cheap labor on the other side of the planet because the companies don't value your labor they value profits over all else. They think your labor to perform any task is too expensive. It is the American way for businesses to keep paying people less until they shut the plant down ruin the economy of that town and go to a 3rd world country for labor.

Go get your credentials and pick the job you want at the company you want cause apparently that is how your world works.
Thanks for the info, Captain Obvious. Yes, a position has to be vacated or created. I assumed that was understood. Fun fact. If you aren't qualified, it doesn't matter what is open. There are surgeon positions open but for some reason, they won't give me a try at it. Obviously you have to get your abilities ready for the opportunity when it arrives. In the meantime, you take a lower position or does that also escape you?
 
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Old Oct 3, 2023 | 12:54 PM
  #340  
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Originally Posted by acdii
True, but that honor and respect works both ways. Something you will never get in the states.
I agree there. But why not...??? Could it be the greed/drive of many in powerful rolls to say/do things that show the lower pinons that they are overreaching their low status by asking/demanding more than they "deserve" but they themselves deserve everything they got and more, cause they are special...???
 
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Old Oct 3, 2023 | 12:56 PM
  #341  
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Originally Posted by 2021F350
They also get some honor from treating their employees with respect, not just throwaways that cost the company $$$... IMO
Regardless, my company has one way of operating, your company has it's own.
 
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Old Oct 3, 2023 | 12:57 PM
  #342  
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Originally Posted by 2021F350
I agree there. But why not...??? Could it be the greed/drive of many in powerful rolls to say/do things that show the lower pinons that they are overreaching their low status by asking/demanding more than they "deserve" but they themselves deserve everything they got and more, cause they are special...???
You would have to change everything, include the thought process of everyone.
 
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Old Oct 3, 2023 | 03:08 PM
  #343  
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Originally Posted by 2021F350
I agree there. But why not...??? Could it be the greed/drive of many in powerful rolls to say/do things that show the lower pinons that they are overreaching their low status by asking/demanding more than they "deserve" but they themselves deserve everything they got and more, cause they are special...???
If the workers are truly worth more, they should absolutely be paid what they are worth by moving on to a better paying job or start their own companies.

Bitching about pay while voluntarily stays at a job is the laziest form of protest. The wages are set based on supply of suitable workers. If there are workers waiting to get on the payroll, why should companies pay more? It's the same with trucks, manufacturers and dealers have no reason to lower prices if consumers keep getting into longer and longer loans to drive 80-100k trucks on low salaries.
 
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Old Oct 3, 2023 | 03:14 PM
  #344  
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Originally Posted by acdii
I laugh at the comparison between Japan and US car CEO's. Two completely different cultures. With Japan it is a matter of Honor, yes, Honor does exist. The head honchos of the Japanese companies aren't there for the money, but for the privilege and honor to serve that position. The Japanese culture is completely different compared to US.
Japan also has a massive under-class of "temporary workers" that live in dingy apartments, cyber or manga cafes,and cheap cramped short term shared accommodations with communal bathrooms and showers, subsiding on instant noodles and junkfood.

People who preach about how Japanese CEOs make much less than their US counterparts while treating their workers with paternalistic care are just regurgitating talking points of the past.

https://japantoday.com/category/feat...-japans-future

The cliché of jobs for life in Japan has rarely been less true. Fewer than 10% of Japanese companies retain lifetime employment now, according to Diamond business magazine. Reforms introduced by former Prime Minister Junichiro Koizumi a decade ago liberalised the labour market, accelerating the growth of part-time and casual work. Current Prime Minister Shinzo Abe continues supporting that trend.

Since Abe took office in December 2012, the number of irregular workers — often earning less than half the pay of their full-time counterparts with permanent employment contracts — has jumped by over 1.5 million people, according to statistics by the Ministry of Health, Labour and Welfare. Casual and part-time employees number nearly 20 million, almost 40% of the current Japanese workforce.
People should be careful what they wish for.
 
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Old Oct 3, 2023 | 03:15 PM
  #345  
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Originally Posted by twobelugas
If the workers are truly worth more, they should absolutely be paid what they are worth by moving on to a better paying job or start their own companies.

Bitching about pay while voluntarily stays at a job is the laziest form of protest.
You know that's going to take a lot of hard work and sacrifice to get started.
 
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