Steve, I remember they used to always carry two engine paints; Ford Blue and Old Ford Blue, with the darker one being "old". I thought that was wrong, as the blue in untouched parts of my 1966 289 was lighter than the untouched blue parts in my mid 70's era Fords that I had owned before. Most spray paint companies now seem to have just simplified it down to one shade for Fords. I guess the specific shade only matters for purists, or for when you really want to make the colors match! I gave up on that dream long ago

Fuzz, I think originally the thermostat would be 180 or 185. For me, I prefer the engine to run cool. As long as it's hot enough to get heat in the winter! As far as the sending unit in my housing, that is for the fan switch. The original outlet from the 60's didn't have any threaded ports so I had to buy one from an emissions era 302. Currently I have a 200 on / 185 off switch, but in looking back at my notes from years ago I had originally used a 185 on / 170 off switch. So I just ordered a new one with that setting. I have an electric pusher fan underneath the hood latch behind the grill, and the switch will control it, and also I have a lead going inside to a switch under the dash, so I can turn it on manually. Usually in traffic, or during a parade, I will make sure that is on. But in normal driving it's not supposed to come on.

 

Or people with OCD. Mine never did match and was repainted from it's original block which was an 81/82 and they never primed it. So it's been an unsightly mess. So much that I took a mostly running engine down to this...to do a ring job, valve job (and glad I did, lemmie tell ya), head gasket, and probably most of all to paint . Finished product should be coming soon!

 

Well it's going to look beautiful! The hard part will be keeping it that way

 

I finished my radiator / water pump replacement Thursday night / early Friday morning. I worked on it during my night shift, wherever I had a break or took my lunch, I went out and wrenched. The hardest part was getting the electric fan mounted to the front of the radiator, just because there isn't much room to get your hands in there. My knuckles are all raw from squishing up against the radiator fins. lol.

After verifying no leaks, I headed straight to my friend Andre's because I had promised him I would show him how to do the timing chain on the 302 engine from the Mazda truck, and he also wanted my help to reinstall the heads. I swear when he called me the day before he had asked "do you have a set of torx?" and when I said yes he asked me to bring them. Nope, he said / meant torque wrench, so I had to go back home and get that.

Our first snafu was when we removed the old timing chain, I had a flat tip screw driver behind both sides of the cam gear and was wiggling it out, and something fell to the floor. It was part of the engine block; the ear that the timing cover mounts too and the water pump bolts go into! I thought maybe the block is ruined and worthless now. But we drilled it out (still another 1/2 inch of iron before we made it into the water jacket) and then JB welded the ear back on. Using a threaded rod through the broken ear and into our newly drilled and tapped section, I think it will hold up.


The next thing was the head gaskets. He thought they gave him the wrong set because there's only water coolant passages on the back of the heads. I told him that is the way it is supposed to be for a 302 Ford, but he showed me the old gaskets and they had holes in the front and back. I am very confused.


Why does the original head gasket have coolant holes on both ends?

Back to the 66. The new radiator is the same size as the old one, both are aluminum. The old one didn't leak, it was just a matter of the passages having little rust chunks in them. So I decided the best thing is to try and save it.


The new radiator is the same as the old one. Direct fit.


I poured a container of Evapo-Rust into the old radiator. My plan was to let it sit for 24 hours, but due to staying busy all day Friday and then going to dinner late in the day, it actually ended up soaking for 36 hours.

I back-flushed it after draining out the Evapo-rust. Previously I used a female-to-female adapter made for flushing cooling systems, and it reduces the flow to avoid over-pressuring the system. I didn't use that this time, just water hose connected to my a fitting and straight in, so the backflush this time was at 40psi of water. I did see a lot of fine gritty rust on the cement afterwards, so I think I must have at least gotten some out.



Fresh clean cooling system, the car is all set to go. I'm ready for the car show Saturday, except that the rain forecast looks terrible.

 

On the head gasket dose both the block and heads have coolant ports or just the block?
The old gaskets may have been done that way so they could be installed any way as so gaskets have a front / back or left / right side to them to match ports.

New gaskets marked front or top?
Dave ----

 

The new gaskets only have coolant passages in the back, and to my knowledge all Ford windsor series are this way. Otherwise as soon as the water enters the block it would go upwards into the head in the front, straight across the intake manifold to the thermostat outlet and leave from there. So blocking off the front is how Ford designed it force the water to flow all the way through the block to the back, then enter the head and flow all the way to the front to reach the passage to the intake. I posted that pic on the SBF 289/302 Windsor group on facebook, and the theory that seemed most prevalent was that the passage actually blew out from heat & pressure. Look at how cleanly cut the water passages are on one end, vs how roughly they appear on the other. That, or either a previous owner working on the engine was replacing head gaskets and thought he should punch those out to allow coolant flow there.

For the broken mount on the block, here is how it looks now after allowing the JB weld to cure for about 36 hours. A little sanding to smooth it out and it seems like a nice flat flush fit for the timing cover.

I had wrapped the threaded rod in pipe tape hoping that the JB would stick to that, not the rod itself, but no such luck. It didn't want to budge and I wasn't going to force it and break it. So it's in there permanently!

 

So after doing so much on the Mustang cooling system then spending much time at my buddy's working on his Mazda truck / Ford 302 project, my own F100 was feeling neglected and she was showing me by leaking oil on both valve covers. Luckily an easy fix for both; several loose bolts!



I don't have heat in this truck and in fact for at least 3 years it never even gets hot. I'm guessing I bought a FAILSAFE thermostat and it must have gotten hot and locked itself open. I know the cooling system is due for a flush so I was thinking just tackle everything at once. Wow was this coolant RUSTY!



After draining the system and rinsing it, I refilled with clean water and dishwasher detergent and went for a 40 minute drive. When I drained that, it looked like blood.


The radiator and water pump were both installed back in 2003 or 2004, and I was thinking it's been long enough that maybe I should replace both of them. The radiator I used back then was from a Bullnose, it was dirt cheap (I think I paid $59 on ebay at the time). And to be honest it's never given me any problems, it does well at keeping the engine cool. But it's only half what it should be.

The tank has half blocked off and the core is only about 1 inch.

A new one just like the one in it now is $103.


This one says it fits 85-97 F150. It's like the one I have now; 1 inch core.

One like mine, but wider (for an F250) is $179


Same Bullnose style, but with a 2 inch core. Twice as wide and it says it fits 83-97 F250.

One that is made for my style of truck is $190


This would look something closer to original. I probably would not use the fans though, as my 93 Taurus fan blows away all aftermarket fans.

Once I make a decision on the radiator I can start working my way through the cooling system. One thing for sure, I want to put a filter in there to help keep the coolant clean. I bought a filter setup to use, like I had discussed with Dusty several months ago. I haven't installed it yet, I still need to figure out where to mount it and how I want to plumb it.

I'm trying to find a good place, on the inner fender, or the firewall. Plus I don't know if it should be even with the heater hoses, higher than the rest of the system, or lower than the rest of the system.

 

No one makes a radiator for your truck with out the fans as I think it would be cheaper.

That is some nasty looking coolant, poor truck LOL

On the filter I would not go above the hoses as air would get trapped in the filter.
So as long as it stays wet I would mount it where the filter can be changed easy.

Going to do more flushing and once some what clean run the Evap-O-Rust thru it for a bit like the Mustang?

Before the Mt Olive show I tighten up some heater hose clamps on the heater core shut off valve that was leaking at the Wilson show.
Was a pain as there was not a lot of room, could only get a wrench on the clamp and a 1/4 turn at a time but think I got it.

Need to wash the truck before this weekends show as it got dirty in the rain on the way to the Mt Olive show.
Dave ----

 

Without the dual fans kit, I could only find them for $180. So I save $10? Seems like it's better to buy the kit and then either not use the fans and store them up in my shop for use "someday, some time" or maybe just install it and see how it does, knowing I can go back to the Taurus fan any time I want.

Yes I have a fresh gallon of evapo-rust plus the 2 weaker already-used gallons from you that I flushed the Mustang with. But I figure I would keep flushing with water and detergent until it is somewhat clean. I just ran it for 30 minutes and opened the cap, it is completely red again. I am guessing I might need to do this 2 more times before moving to the evapo-rust.

I still haven't decided which event to go to on Saturday. I kinda like the idea of the parade, but I wish it was a little closer. I mean Selma is not THAT far but I like to stay a little closer to home if I can. I was thinking either way, no matter what I do, I might ride by the church car show and donate some canned food for their pantry. That way I can say hi to Dave Allen and give him some fold-out flyers for the club.

Hey Dusty are you around? I want to know if you mounted your filter higher or lower than the cooling system. Dave made a good point about getting air trapped. But if it's lower then when you change the filter the whole system drains out. Anywhere I put it, it's in the way of something!

 

For the extra $10 I would also go with the fan one and do as you said to use or not.

I am thinking of going to the church show.
Not because it is close but it helps people that need food..
I know the school helps the school but it is only the school..
Food helps everyone school or not..

I also had seen it for years but never got the chance to go so this may be the year LOL
Dave ----

 

Take some pictures for me if you don't mind! I think Monty will be there in his dune buggy as well as David A and Dick. I hate to miss seeing Dick because I wanted to find out the latest on his fuel delivery trouble with the 58 Fairlane. I planned to go by there and make a donation but now I don't think I will have time to do that because I'm going up to Selma for Railroad Days parade.

 

I haven't posted anything about my F100 cooling system clean-out and upgrade, I've been so busy I have not been able to give it much attention. I did however flush out that third round of dishwasher detergent. It was still rusty but not nearly as bad as the previous two times. So after a good rinse, I drained it and added evapo-rust. I intended to drive it for at least 1 hour over a 24 hour period, but here it is going on the 3rd day and I haven't ran the engine for more than 5 minutes! Between work, the car club meeting, and prep for the car show, I have been doing 1 thing behind the other. Tomorrow for sure I need to drive it at least for a while and then drain it and rinse it clean.

All those big plans I mentioned, I am going to hold off on. Not only for the expense, but also because every time I think about it, I add something else to the list! Now, in addition to the new radiator, water pump, and thermostat, I want to replace my trans cooler and power steering cooler. Since they both are affixed to the radiator this is the best time to upgrade. And when will I have a better chance to do the timing chain? Knowing my engine is a 73 which is known for a nylon timing gear, I know this is something I should tackle. As old and worn as this engine is I bet I have a ton of slack in it.

So it seems like a lot of money to throw at it, and right now (2 weeks away from a trip to Myrtle Beach) I would rather not spend the money. So I guess I will finish cleaning out the cooling system and replace it with fresh antifreeze, continue to buy the items I need, and then probably take a week or so in the Spring to remove everything and replace with new. On that note, the first thing I bought was a thermostat which already came in. I'm paranoid about buying the wrong one, since Cleveland's need a specific type and the parts store is famous for giving you a generic one for a 351w, I decided to take the advice of my Cleveland Engine Group on facebook and buy one from T Meyer. Apparently he's the go-to guy for Cleveland stuff. Well, a thermostat is $35 and block plate is $25, so I just spent 60 bucks on a dadgum thermostat! I figure that's $15 for the thermostat and $45 for the peace of mind. lol

 

If you have not drained the Evap-O-Rust I would leave it in as long as you can and run it up to temp a few times and even around the block a few times.
If you cant get to it for a week or 2 so what it just works on the rust more as I cant see it hurting anything ...... well I guess freeze plugs could get thinner but they were thin to start with before the flushing.

What is this $25 block plate that you got with the Stat?
Dose it work with the Stat as I cant picture it???

I can see how it just snow balled into a bigger job ..... Well I am here so why not do .......
And being you are going away I can see putting it off a bit.
There is a way to check the play in the timing chain if you want I can tell you when we meet Saturday.
Dave ----

 

Well I know what Niko did to check timing chain play; move the crank snout until the rotor started to turn, then stop and turn the crank backwards until the rotor again started to move. Then subtract the 2 figures, and if I remember right he had 17 degrees of slack. I know as old an worn as my engine is that will need to be replaced by now. Plus, in those early days of emissions, Ford had 4 degrees retarded ground into the cam, so with a new timing chain it trues it up to 0 so actually get a little better performance.

With the Cleveland, the thermostat area has 2 levels. When it opens, it stretches downward and blocks off the lower flow, therefore making coolant in the lower chamber have to traverse through the engine and carry more heat away. When cold, it is opened so it lets coolant flow directly to the thermostat. This means the engine reaches operating temperature sooner. If you use a regular thermostat, it never blocks off the lower coolant passage, so the engine actually runs hot. The engine itself is hot, even though the coolant coming from the upper hose is not nearly as hot. It's similar to what Ford did with the 302/351w head gaskets, whereby it forces coolant to flow all the way to the back of the block, and then from the back of the block all the way to the front of head. And if you installed them wrong, then coolant never circulates to the back of the engine. So with the Cleveland, Ford did this with the thermostat instead. But it's been a pain in the you-know-what ever since! 351m and 400 are the same design, here is a pic I found on the internet.



I drove the truck around today for about 45 minutes. Enough to get it up to operating temperature and cycle a few times while I had lunch, and then again when I went grocery shopping. When it burped out of the overflow it was some nasty black crud!


So this is what evaporust looks like after 4 days in my engine!

I'm glad you said you didn't think it would hurt to leave it in longer, but I already drained it by the time I read that. I don't think it matters now because I believe the evapo-rust has already used itself up completely! I may get 2 fresh containers and do it again before the radiator and water pump replacement.

 

Ok Fuzz I know I was asking you about helping Andre and myself to cobble together a usable distributor, so let me give you the run down. We've got 3 distributors currently that are all the same basic thing; a cheap off brand "ready to run" SBF setup with an electronic ignition module mounted to it. Previously I know I might have said it had an HEI module, but I was mistaken. So lets call these distributors A B and C.

A. This was a working, known good, distributor that I installed back in 2014. During engine removal, the chain from the hoist was too close to it and ripped the vacuum module off the mount. Andre preferred to replace it with a new distributor anyway to go along with his theme of replacing every maintenance or wear item.
B. This was a brand new distributor that worked when we first installed and fired up the truck, but only ran for a few minutes then died. We thought maybe the module was bad, so we stole the module from distributor A, but no change. Then we noticed the center contact thingy from the inside of the distributor cap was missing and could not find it. Our theory was that it may have worked its way loose, fell down inside, and been crushed & messed up the internal workings of the distributor. We removed it and noticed that it has a definite "feel" when turning it, compared to A and C which spin smoothly and freely. We wanted to take it apart and put the good vacuum module onto known good distributor A. There are very small clips to hold it in and it all goes in a specific order, and basically when we got to the vacuum module we were able to figure out how to remove it, and did the same for distributor B, but we couldn't figure out how we would ever be able to get the vacuum module thingy onto the peg it sits in, so in frustration we gave up and ordered new distributor C.
C. This was yet another brand new distributor that we got to replace A and B. It fired right up and ran fine and we were able to tune the truck to make it quite peppy. It felt good, it ran good, everybody was happy. Only day later, Andre says the truck is kind of a dog now on acceleration and not running like it was. Idle is fine but definitely kind of hesitation / sputter when you give it gas. On further checking, we found that the vacuum module is bad. On A and B, you can suck on the module and feel that it holds vacuum and you can see the little arm move inwards, but on C when you suck you just get air.

So that was when I reached out to you; we'd like to take good distributor C (or A) and put good vacuum module B on it. That should give us a good working distributor. However since I spoke to you, I reached out the seller that I purchased B from and told him what happened, and he said he would have the manufacturer send a replacement. So distributor D is on the way! However it you can help us, we both want to learn / watch how to make these repairs. And then I guess it will just be a spare distributor to sit on the shelf for the time being (but with Andre's luck it may end up going back in the little pickup again in a few months!



A and B are both in various states of disassembly and sitting in a box in my carport.



C is still in the motor and driveable, it just doesn't run that good and burns a lot of gas. We don't know when D is going to arrive.