1. I bet you don't own your own business (and never have)
2. You are one of those that wants everything a cost (without an understanding of what it takes to deliver the product)
3. You should consider Chevy (you seem like a Chevy guy )

 

I think you're off base. First off, Spam clearly has experience with the 2015 F150, and raises some valid concerns. Him and I had a lengthy discussion on the outgoing Super Duty vs the 150 / new Super Duty. Secondly, he bought a brand new Ford Super Duty. People are allowed to express their opinions on this board. Let's give him credit for continuing to buy Fords and enjoy the constructive criticism.

 

Expressing one's opinion and Constructive criticism is one thing Trover, saying "The entire dealership system is corrupt as ****" is something all together different.

 

Yeah, it is a sweeping statement. Some dealers are completely corrupt. Others seem fine.

 

1.) Actually, I do own my own business. This one isn't even the only one I've had.
2.) I do not expect everything at cost. I think that's what you were trying to say. I do have an understanding of what it takes to deliver a product.
3.) I'm definitely not a Chevy guy. I don't know why you'd think that. While I have owned a few GM vehicles over the years, I've had two GM trucks. I didn't have particularly good luck with them. I've had four F-150's and one F-250 Super Duty. I've had far more Ford trucks than Chevrolet's and generally prefer Ford as brand. I also bought a 2016 Mustang GT recently and compared it to the Camaro.

Thank you. I think its one thing to come in and say x product sucks without any justification. I think I've acknowledged where the new trucks are improved and where I don't think they have.

Perhaps corrupt isn't the right word. Morally ****ing bankrupt is probably a better description of dealership tactics and behavior. I didn't want to go there, but fine. The dealership system is bull**** and it always has been.

Have you ever wondered why car manufacturers don't sell direct to the consumer? Did you know that Tesla sales were blocked in Texas because they had no standing dealerships? The car dealership network and the laws that were passed back in the day to protect the car industry is what I am referring to.

Watch this and then get back to me about how my sweeping statements about the car industry and dealerships are wrong:


The same video from it's original source:

The Real Reason Car Dealerships Are the Worst ? truTV.com

Discussion on the topic:
https://www.reddit.com/r/cars/commen...al_reason_car/

Here are the big take aways from the above: Essentially the car dealers treat people as they do because they can and there isn't a ****ing thing we can do about it. Car dealerships block direct sales and even prevent newcomers from establishing dealerships in their geographic regions. Dealerships work hard to hide vehicle costs and take the consumer for everything that they can. I'm not just talking about add on sales, but their tactics. I've had dealerships tell me that the finance company won't finance a particular vehicle unless I get an extended warranty, or some bull**** addons. My example above of the dealer trying to get me to pay $1,500 a month for 72 months on a $65k truck is the best example I can come up with. I've got a co-worker that's black. We were talking about cars and the buying experience. She told me that almost every dealership she's ever been to asked her for a ****ing credit application before letting her test drive a vehicle. She actually thought that was normal. I had one dealership try that with me once and I told them to pound sand.

I've seen dealers tell people that a vehicle needs x service at xx,xxx miles which wasn't true. I've seen them say things were broken that weren't. There have been several news reports where dealerships and independent service centers told customers that they needed service and there was video evidence showing that the work wasn't done. This discussion could go on and one. In part the manufacturers hold some responsibility for this, but its an industry that works people over and tries to screw them more than any other I can think of.

You can try and defend the dealerships all you want to but the fact remains that the dealership system and the laws designed to protect it are bull****. I will agree that some dealerships are better than others. Sometimes it comes down to certain dealership franchises, or brands. I've seen bull**** pulled at Ford, GMC, Chevrolet, Subaru, Toyota, Honda, and one or two other brands. I've been told that the experience is different at BMW or Lexus dealers but I wouldn't know as I've never tried to buy from those brands.

I could type out individual dealership horror stories spanning two decades and more than a dozen vehicles. I'll spare you guys the details and let the video above speak for itself. Feel free to fact check what was said in it too for yourselves.

I will argue that there are a few individuals who work in the dealership system that will give you a fair deal and treat you right despite the majority of the dealership system being devoid or what most people would consider good moral standards. When you do find a good dealership or good people in the industry, you need to I have no problem with product markup. I have no problem with corporate greed. What I don't like are the dishonest sales tactics and misdirection that dealerships use to confuse people, lie to them and ultimately try to take them for everything they can. Dealerships will treat you vastly different based on how you dress, the color of your skin or your gender. I've seen it too many times. While I believe a lot of this **** happens in many industries to a degree, the car dealerships don't really disguise it that well because they don't have to. If you want to buy a car, you have to deal with them. Its that simple.

 

Sounds like we need an affordable car act. Government mandated pricing. Any hack can open up a shop anywhere and for the purchasing challenged the government can open a website with 250K high paid government employees will sell honest information and facts all the while dishing out guaranteed government pricing at government operated exchanges on a government designed website and free government assistance for those who can't afford the top of the line vehicles the working guys have to pass up because they still have to pay for the houses and kids educations and try to afford medical coverage all at the same time.

 

We need something.

Still, I like the idea of a fixed price with maybe a 2% profit on all. Then the dealer with the best customer relations & service shop will get the buisness.
Also I am quite fine paying invoice and letting dealer walk away with just the hold back, hell I "ordered" the truck from FORD, he is a middle man and didn't have to do a damn thing to sell anything. He walks away with the hold back for some paper work and washing the truck! Seems fair to me. I am also a small buisness owner that depends on service not product.

 

I don't know your business but I hope you do well and truly wish you the best. But, how would you like it if big brother came in and said "This guy bought his windows from Pella" You have to install them for XX dollars. No negotiation, no discount, no premium. And technically you ordered your truck from a dealer, not from Ford. I cannot buy a chainsaw from Stihl. When I buy a new saw it is at a manufacturer's list price. Discounts can only be personal through the store owner. I cannot buy a TV from the manufacturer (there are a few exceptions and then the price is always list price.) Try to buy a bottle of Heinz Pickle Relish from the manufacturer. Then go to the store and find out you paid 2.00 an ounce more than it is at the big supermarket. I am not fond of dealers and I also am not fond of defending a controlled system but I can imagine many worse scenarios of purchasing from a non certified dealer and then not having anyone to perform maintenance or recalls. Take the truck back to the factory because the seat belt might not retract? Maybe this is not the best system but screams for reform usually push service and quality down to the level of the least common denominator.

 

I don't think 2% is a reasonable profit margin. They wouldn't be able to keep the lights on or pay the staff with a 2% profit margin. I know I'm the guy who bashes dealerships for ripping people off, but any retail business has substantial operating costs. You can't operate on profit margins that thin.

 

My partner at work is shopping for a new car. A local, large dealership told him they would not sell him a car unless he financed with their bank only. I thought money was money no matter where it came from. He left said dealer and went to his credit union. Just another warm, fuzzy dealer tale.

 

That would be illegal in most states. Might be worth a call to the State's Attorney General office.

 

That's crazy but believable because dealers are going crazy with lies and doing what they want. It's getting worse or maybe I'm just learning now