XLT vs Lariat
Senior User
Joined: Apr 2016
Posts: 274
Likes: 0
Great thread. Curious if anyone knows why you can't get 20" rims on an XLT, they're only available on the Lariat. I saw a '16 on a dealer lot with the 20" rims (Lariat) and it looked so much better than the 18" rims. I went online and "built" a '17 F250 XLT, but no option for the 20" rim.
Tuned
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 272
Likes: 3
You are partially correct. I didn't look at where the discounts were actually coming from but 10k+ off of MSRP at north Texas Ford dealerships is common place on the 2016 Super Duty right now. An example can be found here.
There are two Ford factory incentives right now. One is 3,000 cash back and the other is $500. I am not certain what the second one is for. As I said the other discounts are from the dealerships themselves. They are knocking about $10k off or more in my area. Two weeks ago they offered $15.5k off King Ranch. The week before when I bought my F-250 it was $14.5k off MSRP for all Super Duty trucks up to Lariat trim levels. That's what I got plus I qualified for another offer as well. They can apply discounts for all sorts of ****. There are always student discounts, military discounts etc. Usually these are $250 to $500 off.
There are two Ford factory incentives right now. One is 3,000 cash back and the other is $500. I am not certain what the second one is for. As I said the other discounts are from the dealerships themselves. They are knocking about $10k off or more in my area. Two weeks ago they offered $15.5k off King Ranch. The week before when I bought my F-250 it was $14.5k off MSRP for all Super Duty trucks up to Lariat trim levels. That's what I got plus I qualified for another offer as well. They can apply discounts for all sorts of ****. There are always student discounts, military discounts etc. Usually these are $250 to $500 off.
I wish the online build from the Ford site would show the invoice price. Anyone know how to find out the actual invoice price?
Elder User
Joined: Apr 2016
Posts: 812
Likes: 4
Edit: I am on there right now and the 20" rims are available on the Lariat.
Tuned
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 272
Likes: 3
I'm still pissed that the 20" rim options is available on the XLT. I don't know when I'm going to get a new truck, but whenever it is, I'd prefer the 20" wheels as they look just right, but I'm not a big fan of leather or having to upgrade to the Lariat when an XLT is perfect for me.
Yeah I know you guys mentioned take offs, but if I'm spending $40,000 plus on a new truck, I'd prefer to get it from the factory the way I want it.
Hotshot
Joined: Apr 2013
Posts: 10,121
Likes: 654
From: NH
MSRP is what bothers me. The last truck I bought, my current '03, there was an msrp and an invoice price on the build when I did it online. It was very clear what the dealer paid. I had a dealer play a game the other day with a '16 that I'm looking at. I asked him the invoice price, he showed me some internal paperwork and I was reluctant to believe him. I looked online and the same truck from that dealer is over $700 cheaper online. So whatever he showed me was a crock of ****.
I wish the online build from the Ford site would show the invoice price. Anyone know how to find out the actual invoice price?
I wish the online build from the Ford site would show the invoice price. Anyone know how to find out the actual invoice price?
There was a thread about the early order 2017 trucks when we were all trying to figure out invoice pricing. Someone posted a spreadsheet of invoice costs of all the options. If you could find it, the answers are there.
@Spamfritter,
I did look at the link you posted. It shows almost $13k off the MSRP when all is said and done. The $9k dealer discount is the bulk of it, but that is going to vary dealer to dealer. In reality, the $3500 is it for Ford incentives. Meanwhile, consider this truck is nearly the most expensive 2016 you can buy at over $72k. The highest price trucks always have the greatest discounts. Good luck getting a $9k dealer discount on a 2016 XLT.
Tuned
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 272
Likes: 3
The dealers don't pay invoice. They have a "dealer hold-back" which is I think about 3-4% less than invoice. If you pay invoice, the dealer still makes money.
There was a thread about the early order 2017 trucks when we were all trying to figure out invoice pricing. Someone posted a spreadsheet of invoice costs of all the options. If you could find it, the answers are there.
There was a thread about the early order 2017 trucks when we were all trying to figure out invoice pricing. Someone posted a spreadsheet of invoice costs of all the options. If you could find it, the answers are there.
My understanding is that the invoice price is the price the dealer paid and that the hold back is what they're going to make for selling the vehicle, yes 3% or 4%. That's why they'll sell at or slightly below invoice, because they're still making that 3% or 4%.
That's why I use the invoice price when pricing a new vehicle.
I didn't see that thread you're mentioning with the spreadsheet, was it in this forum? I'll take a look, but if you see it, please link it or pm it to me.
Hotshot
Joined: Apr 2013
Posts: 10,121
Likes: 654
From: NH
My understanding is that the invoice price is the price the dealer paid and that the hold back is what they're going to make for selling the vehicle, yes 3% or 4%. That's why they'll sell at or slightly below invoice, because they're still making that 3% or 4%.
That's why I use the invoice price when pricing a new vehicle.
I didn't see that thread you're mentioning with the spreadsheet, was it in this forum? I'll take a look, but if you see it, please link it or pm it to me.
That's why I use the invoice price when pricing a new vehicle.
I didn't see that thread you're mentioning with the spreadsheet, was it in this forum? I'll take a look, but if you see it, please link it or pm it to me.
The thread was definitely on this forum, I used it. It was started back in mid April on the 2017 board we're in now. It was a Google Docs file.
Tuned
Joined: Aug 2016
Posts: 314
Likes: 11
From: Dallas / Ft. Worth Area
The dealers don't pay invoice. They have a "dealer hold-back" which is I think about 3-4% less than invoice. If you pay invoice, the dealer still makes money.
There was a thread about the early order 2017 trucks when we were all trying to figure out invoice pricing. Someone posted a spreadsheet of invoice costs of all the options. If you could find it, the answers are there.
@Spamfritter,
I did look at the link you posted. It shows almost $13k off the MSRP when all is said and done. The $9k dealer discount is the bulk of it, but that is going to vary dealer to dealer. In reality, the $3500 is it for Ford incentives. Meanwhile, consider this truck is nearly the most expensive 2016 you can buy at over $72k. The highest price trucks always have the greatest discounts. Good luck getting a $9k dealer discount on a 2016 XLT.
There was a thread about the early order 2017 trucks when we were all trying to figure out invoice pricing. Someone posted a spreadsheet of invoice costs of all the options. If you could find it, the answers are there.
@Spamfritter,
I did look at the link you posted. It shows almost $13k off the MSRP when all is said and done. The $9k dealer discount is the bulk of it, but that is going to vary dealer to dealer. In reality, the $3500 is it for Ford incentives. Meanwhile, consider this truck is nearly the most expensive 2016 you can buy at over $72k. The highest price trucks always have the greatest discounts. Good luck getting a $9k dealer discount on a 2016 XLT.
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Post Fiend
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 5,158
Likes: 35
From: North of Salt Lake City
Hmm. Not sure what you mean. If the dealer is actually paying invoice, then sell the vehicle at invoice, they are not making any money. Maybe I'm not understanding you.
The thread was definitely on this forum, I used it. It was started back in mid April on the 2017 board we're in now. It was a Google Docs file.
The thread was definitely on this forum, I used it. It was started back in mid April on the 2017 board we're in now. It was a Google Docs file.
Holdbacks are not secret but all dealers do their best to not talk about them. Deals are always made from MSRP as a base to give the appearance of a discount. Invoice amount is used to give the appearance that the dealer can discount no more. The secret holdback amount is never discussed or revealed to the public because in many cases, it is the only top-line profit they can count on.
Senior User
Joined: Apr 2016
Posts: 274
Likes: 0
there still not showing up for me. All i see is 18'' bright alum/magnetic, which are standard, and the 18" chrome.
Elder User
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 872
Likes: 4
From: Greene, NY
I configured a 176" with the 6.2 yesterday and chose the 20" wheels.. I do think I remember a post somewhere about the Max Tow package not allowing 20" though?
Posting Guru
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 1,053
Likes: 3
From: Corn Country, Kansas
You are partially correct. I didn't look at where the discounts were actually coming from but 10k+ off of MSRP at north Texas Ford dealerships is common place on the 2016 Super Duty right now. An example can be found here.
There are two Ford factory incentives right now. One is 3,000 cash back and the other is $500. I am not certain what the second one is for. As I said the other discounts are from the dealerships themselves. They are knocking about $10k off or more in my area. Two weeks ago they offered $15.5k off King Ranch. The week before when I bought my F-250 it was $14.5k off MSRP for all Super Duty trucks up to Lariat trim levels. That's what I got plus I qualified for another offer as well. They can apply discounts for all sorts of ****. There are always student discounts, military discounts etc. Usually these are $250 to $500 off.
There are two Ford factory incentives right now. One is 3,000 cash back and the other is $500. I am not certain what the second one is for. As I said the other discounts are from the dealerships themselves. They are knocking about $10k off or more in my area. Two weeks ago they offered $15.5k off King Ranch. The week before when I bought my F-250 it was $14.5k off MSRP for all Super Duty trucks up to Lariat trim levels. That's what I got plus I qualified for another offer as well. They can apply discounts for all sorts of ****. There are always student discounts, military discounts etc. Usually these are $250 to $500 off.
Senior User
Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 214
Likes: 1
There was a thread about the early order 2017 trucks when we were all trying to figure out invoice pricing. Someone posted a spreadsheet of invoice costs of all the options. If you could find it, the answers are there.
@Spamfritter,
This might be the information you were looking for from an earlier thread. It is on the F250 but the other trucks can be found using a search.
http://www.fleet.ford.com/edms/conte...00cad98297ba11
@Spamfritter,
This might be the information you were looking for from an earlier thread. It is on the F250 but the other trucks can be found using a search.
http://www.fleet.ford.com/edms/conte...00cad98297ba11
Tuned
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 272
Likes: 3
Invoice is actually what the dealer pays Ford for the vehicle. Holdback is what Ford pays the dealer for selling their car. The holdback amount is not listed on the invoice that the public sees. As stated, it can be small or large depending upon many factors but it is actual profit for the dealer on their financials.
Holdbacks are not secret but all dealers do their best to not talk about them. Deals are always made from MSRP as a base to give the appearance of a discount. Invoice amount is used to give the appearance that the dealer can discount no more. The secret holdback amount is never discussed or revealed to the public because in many cases, it is the only top-line profit they can count on.
Holdbacks are not secret but all dealers do their best to not talk about them. Deals are always made from MSRP as a base to give the appearance of a discount. Invoice amount is used to give the appearance that the dealer can discount no more. The secret holdback amount is never discussed or revealed to the public because in many cases, it is the only top-line profit they can count on.
There was a thread about the early order 2017 trucks when we were all trying to figure out invoice pricing. Someone posted a spreadsheet of invoice costs of all the options. If you could find it, the answers are there.
@Spamfritter,
This might be the information you were looking for from an earlier thread. It is on the F250 but the other trucks can be found using a search.
http://www.fleet.ford.com/edms/conte...00cad98297ba11
@Spamfritter,
This might be the information you were looking for from an earlier thread. It is on the F250 but the other trucks can be found using a search.
http://www.fleet.ford.com/edms/conte...00cad98297ba11
In the meantime, I just looked at that link you supplied and it shows two categories; Dealer Invoice with Holdback and Suggested Retail.
What is Dealer Invoice with Holdback and do we know what the Holdback amount is, in percentage?
What is Suggested Retail?
This is confusing because window sticker or building a truck online only shows msrp.
Senior User
Joined: Apr 2016
Posts: 274
Likes: 0
I just checked again and now the 20" are there. I didnt do anything different, i dont know why they werent showing up before. Oh well.