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I also do remember there being like three washers that have to go in a certain order.
The order is shown in my photo below, where left to right parallels inboard to outboard, or innermost to outermost.
Originally Posted by Hyakkimaru
The bearings feel tight so depending on how they look when I pull them out I might just pack them.
Not possible. You may not even have an ABS hole.
Originally Posted by Hyakkimaru
I'm also tempted to buy one of the packer tools so I don't have to get so greasy.
Not needed or usable for the front wheel bearings in a 4WD that are a unit bearing assembly.
If you can pull a unit bearing apart, whoever you work for needs to pay you more, and whoever crosses you had better mind their p's and q's, as their fate is doomed with your brains and brawn.
Originally Posted by Hyakkimaru
What about the axle seal? Is it pretty easy to change?
You'll need to buy or make a seal installer. Yes, the tech folder.
Originally Posted by Hyakkimaru
It's not leaking at the moment so should I even take the hub apart?
What's not leaking? The wheel ends? Leaking isn't usually how unit bearing failure manifests itself.
But speaking of leaking, your front axle pumpkin shows evidence of leaking, as it is dry on top, yet wet from the front pinion seal downward. It is hard to tell if the leak is from the pinion seal or is blow back from the front cover, but before you loosen a single bolt from your truck, you might want to pull the diff cover off of your new to you axle and see how much lubricant remains inside, and inspect the inside while it is open. Is it full of white gooy emulsion from water penetration? (axle breather hose is missing), Is it bone dry? Is it sludged? Or did the honey colored gear lubricant pour out of it like the elixir of youth? What does the wear pattern of the ring gear look like? If that axle needs attention, wouldn't you rather attend to it now, while it is already out of the vehicle, and while you still have a 2WD vehicle assembled to go get parts with?
Originally Posted by Hyakkimaru
The manual locks are also very stiff. Are they supposed to be like this or are they supposed to be smooth?
Hard to answer a subjective question like that, as what is stiff or smooth to you may be different than what is stiff or smooth to another person's feel.
It is not an unreasonable idea of yours to leave the unit bearings alone, but you can tinker with the hub locks without much consequence, and without needing a seal installer. Cleatus12 already explained simply using snap ring pliers, and the photo above (from the Tech folder) shows the order.
It seems probable that you've already obtained a factory service manual, for free, from FTE's Inspector General:
Despite my familiarity with these trucks, I still paid more than $300 twenty year ago dollars for my own copy from Ford, in print and on disc, and I will read it again every time I undertake a service procedure. The answers to many of the issues you have asked about or errantly assumed are found in the service manual, which is always worth a review when undertaking a project like this, even if just for torque specs and orders of assembly.
Some questions are not answered in the service manual, however, and that includes questions like these:
Originally Posted by SkySkiJason
I’ve always had to change the steering gear. Maybe the E99 is different?
Y2K probably knows.
Originally Posted by Hyakkimaru
Turns out my steering gear is leaking anyway. Will probably just replace it anyhow. Can you even reseal them? My steering is still tight just leaking.
But the e99 had a 32 spline four-wheel drive Pittman arm. They switched to 36 splines in March of 99. That's the only reason I figured I would be fine with the factory steering gear just because you can buy a four-wheel drive pitman arm with 32 splines. O'Reilly's and advance couldn't get one but AutoZone shows it on their website. But if I'm going to replace the steering gear anyway I will get the 36 spline updated version. Maybe Y2K can enlighten us
Up to March 1999, the F-250/350 4x4 and 4x2 were serviced with the F7UZ-3504-GBRM steering gear (with 8 splines between blocked teeth, which equates to 32 splines).
After March 1999, and before May 31, 2002, the F-250/350 4x4 and 4x2 were serviced with the YC3Z-3504-ABRM, (with 9 splines between blocked teeth, which equates to 36 splines),
There is a caveat: some F-250/350 4x2 only (but not F-450/550 4x2) may have continued with the 32 spline, depending on where and when manufactured (USA / Mexico / Brazil).
Yes you can reseal the steering gear box. Ford sells an input shaft seal kit and a sector shaft seal kit, as well as a number of other internal parts individually to rebuild steering gears, which is what the vendors who paint the sector shaft cover in various bright bold colors presumably do, albeit it is anyone's guess where they actually source their seals and parts from, although I find that places like Xingtai Xiou Import & Export Trading Company tend to have significantly less expensive pricing on steering gear sealing kits than Ford does... so I imagine that rebuilders in the business have figured that out too.
The order is shown in my photo below, where left to right parallels inboard to outboard, or innermost to outermost.
Not possible. You may not even have an ABS hole.
Not needed or usable for the front wheel bearings in a 4WD that are a unit bearing assembly.
If you can pull a unit bearing apart, whoever you work for needs to pay you more, and whoever crosses you had better mind their p's and q's, as their fate is doomed with your brains and brawn.
You'll need to buy or make a seal installer. Yes, the tech folder.
What's not leaking? The wheel ends? Leaking isn't usually how unit bearing failure manifests itself.
But speaking of leaking, your front axle pumpkin shows evidence of leaking, as it is dry on top, yet wet from the front pinion seal downward. It is hard to tell if the leak is from the pinion seal or is blow back from the front cover, but before you loosen a single bolt from your truck, you might want to pull the diff cover off of your new to you axle and see how much lubricant remains inside, and inspect the inside while it is open. Is it full of white gooy emulsion from water penetration? (axle breather hose is missing), Is it bone dry? Is it sludged? Or did the honey colored gear lubricant pour out of it like the elixir of youth? What does the wear pattern of the ring gear look like? If that axle needs attention, wouldn't you rather attend to it now, while it is already out of the vehicle, and while you still have a 2WD vehicle assembled to go get parts with?
The breather was still there until I dropped the axle without disconnecting it first. I didn't see it. Up above I stated that I was going to change the fluid before I put it on. Any TLC that needs to be done is going to be done before I put it on the truck.
Hard to answer a subjective question like that, as what is stiff or smooth to you may be different than what is stiff or smooth to another person's feel.
Just gonna clean and degrease them.
It is not an unreasonable idea of yours to leave the unit bearings alone, but you can tinker with the hub locks without much consequence, and without needing a seal installer. Cleatus12 already explained simply using snap ring pliers, and the photo above (from the Tech folder) shows the order.
It seems probable that you've already obtained a factory service manual, for free, from FTE's Inspector General:
Despite my familiarity with these trucks, I still paid more than $300 twenty year ago dollars for my own copy from Ford, in print and on disc, and I will read it again every time I undertake a service procedure. The answers to many of the issues you have asked about or errantly assumed are found in the service manual, which is always worth a review when undertaking a project like this, even if just for torque specs and orders of assembly.
I have acquired a owner's manual but not a service manual. However, Sous has on and off posted pieces out of it when necessary
Some questions are not answered in the service manual, however, and that includes questions like these:
Up to March 1999, the F-250/350 4x4 and 4x2 were serviced with the F7UZ-3504-GBRM steering gear (with 8 splines between blocked teeth, which equates to 32 splines).
After March 1999, and before May 31, 2002, the F-250/350 4x4 and 4x2 were serviced with the YC3Z-3504-ABRM, (with 9 splines between blocked teeth, which equates to 36 splines),
There is a caveat: some F-250/350 4x2 only (but not F-450/550 4x2) may have continued with the 32 spline, depending on where and when manufactured (USA / Mexico / Brazil).
This is what I was saying earlier about the e99 4x4s having a 32 spline when they first came out. This is what tells me that I shouldn't have to replace my steering box, just get a e99 pitman arm correct? As long as my truck has 32 as well. I bought a 33 mm socket yesterday so I will take the nut off sometime this afternoon and count the splines.
Yes you can reseal the steering gear box. Ford sells an input shaft seal kit and a sector shaft seal kit, as well as a number of other internal parts individually to rebuild steering gears, which is what the vendors who paint the sector shaft cover in various bright bold colors presumably do, albeit it is anyone's guess where they actually source their seals and parts from, although I find that places like Xingtai Xiou Import & Export Trading Company tend to have significantly less expensive pricing on steering gear sealing kits than Ford does... so I imagine that rebuilders in the business have figured that out too.
My steering is still tight, I also have not cranked down on the adjustment at all, hence the reason I don't want to replace the gearbox. If it is pretty easily resealed I would like to just do that and save that $300 for something else that I'm sure I can use.
Thank you we're taking me time to write all of this good sir! As always your information is very helpful!
You’ll want to look for oil leaking out of the axle tubes. This would indicate the axle shaft seals are bad. Replacing these requires removing the axle shafts and differential carrier as the seals are near the differential.
There are dust seals out at the ends of the axle tubes, but they are almost always trashed. It’s easy enough and inexpensive to replace them, but the new ones often have a short service life.
More important are the knuckle seals, aka vacuum seals that are driven onto the stub hafts with the special tool Y2K referenced. These seals are what locate the axles in the center of the hub and axle tube. When worn, they will allow the axles to move up and down inside the axle ‘C’, where the u-joints are located. Stick a big screwdriver or a pry bar between the u-joint and the ‘C’ and see how much play there is. It should be pretty tight. If it moves more than 1/4” or so up/down, you’ll need to replace these seals. It’s been posted that the 7.3 oil filter can be used as a tool to install the seals, but I have the tool if you want to pay for shipping to borrow it. If these seals are allowed to get bad enough, the axles droop and can bind in the locking hubs and will allow the axles to spin with hubs unlocked. This damages the thrust washers and takes out the needle bearings located inside the unit bearings. Since these bearings have no inner race and ride directly on the stub shaft, when they get fubar’ed they damage the stub shaft and it will need to be replaced.
Those bearings are the ones you will grease with a needle after removing thrust washers in the stuff you’ve read about. If you are doing ball joints, all of this will be disassembled and greasing is simple/intuitive.
If your unit bearings have a hole for ABS sensor, I recommend you remove the sensor and fill that cavity with high temp bearing grease. @ArmyLifer makes a tool for this. I am careful not to pressurize this cavity when filling with grease.
When you have your Windows computer/laptop ready, post in the thread linked below and I will get you the instructions on how to download and install the Ford Service Manual. FTN made a tips and tricks thread too, which is referenced in the instructions. This is a great resource to have on hand and I actually travel with it, just in case.
As for greasing and servicing the locking hubs. Less grease is better... A thin film on the greased surfaces that allows for parts to slide and move as they should is better than a glob of grease creating a problem. Do not over apply grease in the locking hubs.
You’ll want to look for oil leaking out of the axle tubes. This would indicate the axle shaft seals are bad. Replacing these requires removing the axle shafts and differential carrier as the seals are near the differential.
I will check for leaks when I get home and post pictures
There are dust seals out at the ends of the axle tubes, but they are almost always trashed. It’s easy enough and inexpensive to replace them, but the new ones often have a short service life.
Sounds like something you have to replace all the time anyway so I will probably run and get it from the auto store.
More important are the knuckle seals, aka vacuum seals that are driven onto the stub hafts with the special tool Y2K referenced. These seals are what locate the axles in the center of the hub and axle tube. When worn, they will allow the axles to move up and down inside the axle ‘C’, where the u-joints are located. Stick a big screwdriver or a pry bar between the u-joint and the ‘C’ and see how much play there is. It should be pretty tight. If it moves more than 1/4” or so up/down, you’ll need to replace these seals. It’s been posted that the 7.3 oil filter can be used as a tool to install the seals, but I have the tool if you want to pay for shipping to borrow it. If these seals are allowed to get bad enough, the axles droop and can bind in the locking hubs and will allow the axles to spin with hubs unlocked. This damages the thrust washers and takes out the needle bearings located inside the unit bearings. Since these bearings have no inner race and ride directly on the stub shaft, when they get fubar’ed they damage the stub shaft and it will need to be replaced.
I will try the pry bar trick when I get home and see how much play is in it. The ball joints feel tight but I don't have a tire on it so it's hard to wiggle around and feel the ball joints. I should probably replace them anyway because the truck was in a wreck. But they look fine.
Those bearings are the ones you will grease with a needle after removing thrust washers in the stuff you’ve read about. If you are doing ball joints, all of this will be disassembled and greasing is simple/intuitive.
If your unit bearings have a hole for ABS sensor, I recommend you remove the sensor and fill that cavity with high temp bearing grease. @ArmyLifer makes a tool for this. I am careful not to pressurize this cavity when filling with grease.
I don't know if there's a hole for the ABS or not but I will check when I get home I would like to go ahead and replace all of the mentioned seals before I put the axle in as preventative maintenance. Is there somewhere specific y'all get all these seals? Especially the axle shaft and the knuckle seals. Those seem to be the buggers that you don't want to change every 10,000 miles. And I'm sure there's probably write up for all of these jobs on the PSD tech folder correct?
I only use SPICER seals, etc and get them from Ventures Truck parts.
I would not change anything as preventative maintenance because the parts aren’t cheap or easy to replace. Specifically ball joints. The wreck is unlikely to have hurt them. You’ll need the weight of truck to check if they’re bad and changing them after axle is under truck is not any more difficult.
I only use SPICER seals, etc and get them from Ventures Truck parts.
I would not change anything as preventative maintenance because the parts aren’t cheap or easy to replace. Specifically ball joints. The wreck is unlikely to have hurt them. You’ll need the weight of truck to check if they’re bad and changing them after axle is under truck is not any more difficult.
So if it's not leaking don't mess with it. Gotcha.
Just got home and checked the knuckle seal as you were talking about with the pry bar. With a foot and a half pry bar I was able to get a 1/4 of movement up and down. It looks like the diff has been leaking where the drive shaft goes into the back of the differential from the transfer case. Everything else looks dry.
You don’t need much pressure to check knuckle seals. If they’re bad, it moves easily. Sounds like they will be fine.
That leak is possibly a bad pinion seal. I would be inclined to clean it up and make sure the vent tubing is clear and just run it. Sometimes they leak because mud dobbers build a nest in there and plug vent. This allows pressure to build in the axle and force some oil out.
Since the axle only spins when hubs are locked or t-case is in 4wd, it sees very few miles in most applications. I use 4wd all the time, but only for 10ft at a time to get back onto the pavement or drive up a loose driveway like in front of my bathhouse to avoid tearing it up.
You don’t need much pressure to check knuckle seals. If they’re bad, it moves easily. Sounds like they will be fine.
That leak is possibly a bad pinion seal. I would be inclined to clean it up and make sure the vent tubing is clear and just run it. Sometimes they leak because mud dobbers build a nest in there and plug vent. This allows pressure to build in the axle and force some oil out.
Since the axle only spins when hubs are locked or t-case is in 4wd, it sees very few miles in most applications. I use 4wd all the time, but only for 10ft at a time to get back onto the pavement or drive up a loose driveway like in front of my bathhouse to avoid tearing it up.
With the longish pry bar I was able to move them but, by hand I wasn't able to move them. I just got done rebuilding my locking hubs which didn't take very long. They were definitely a little seized and move much easier now. It was kind of a pain to get one of them apart because it was so stuck together. Overall wasn't too difficult. I am going to start taking the calipers off because they are locked up. I have the brake lines that came off of the other truck, the ones that were longer but, after we dropped the axle I didn't realize the brake lines were holding and they held up a decent bit of weight for a few short minutes while we were jacking the axle back up and taking the bolts loose to pull the brake lines back off. They might still be fine, or the insides could be messed up because it had too much weight on it, I'm not sure yet. I'm sure I won't use four wheel drive as much as you do but I would rather do this and have four wheel drive than to rebuild the front end of the truck anyway. I am going to order my track bar and sway bar bushings today.
I'll check back in a little bit. I'm going to go take calipers off.
Joel was worried that the inside of the axle might have been messed up because the wheels did not want to turn but, look what I found. Also I believe the calipers were sticking. Took the calipers off and the wheels spin freely, and both locking hubs work properly.
There's a little bit of rubber floating around on here but it is not wet. Is this the knuckle seal you were talking about?
When you have your Windows computer/laptop ready, post in the thread linked below and I will get you the instructions on how to download and install the Ford Service Manual. FTN made a tips and tricks thread too, which is referenced in the instructions. This is a great resource to have on hand and I actually travel with it, just in case.
As for greasing and servicing the locking hubs. Less grease is better... A thin film on the greased surfaces that allows for parts to slide and move as they should is better than a glob of grease creating a problem. Do not over apply grease in the locking hubs.
When I get done playing around in the yard and whatnot I will go inside and shoot you a message from my computer to that forum. I did just that a light film of Grease over everything.
Whoof. I only just caught up with this thread. You work fast dude! If you stick with standard wheel and tire sizes and aren’t lifting the truck crazy high, those unit bearings should serve you well. If not, I think I have mentioned previously that we love to spend other people’s money on here. Dynatrac’s Free Spin conversion is a nice bit of kit.
FWIW, up until this year my 37” tires meant I was replacing unit bearings on a yearly basis. I used el cheapo Irish unit bearings that had a 3-year warranty. I got 5 years’ worth of free replacement unit bearings until the parts store guy cottoned on. I have now restarted the process with AutoZoo (as Sous calls it) unit bearings but the Moog ones they sell have actually held up.
Whoof. I only just caught up with this thread. You work fast dude! If you stick with standard wheel and tire sizes and aren’t lifting the truck crazy high, those unit bearings should serve you well. If not, I think I have mentioned previously that we love to spend other people’s money on here. Dynatrac’s Free Spin conversion is a nice bit of kit.
thanks!
Im sticking with stock tires. Unless there's a good option that would look better and still be reliable. I'm sure I will replace everything later on anyway. I want to get the axle bolted to the truck before I put to much money into it to make sure it all works. Btw what brand and viscosity fluid should I use in this diff?
