I want to emphasize that my post on percentages is a question, not a declaration.

While it is a very detailed question, supported by sampled scenarios, with logic applied from the automotive battery charging industry, it still remains a question.

It is hard to learn what one already thinks they know, and questions help crack the shell around what is thought to be known, to see what else there is to discover.


In years past, Ford has protected the power supply to electronic modules, like the PCM, with diodes. The diodes protect the PCM from flyback voltage spikes and other electrical evils that would otherwise toast the PCM.

There is a loss of voltage through the diodes, perhaps a couple tenths of a volt. So the PCM itself might see less voltage than what can be measured at the battery itself, or at the output terminal of the alternator. Yet the PCM and the entire constellation of modules on the vehicle's network may still have the ability to "see" and monitor actual battery voltage and alternator output voltage, without being powered by that raw voltage.

That is one possible difference between the measuring point options that presented themselves to you.

What do I think about the Banks iDash? I don't have the system, but I do have a story about the seminal idea for that system. Gale Banks himself was standing in the open doorway of my personal truck, around 23 or 24 years ago, and he was reaching in over my steering wheel, gesturing over back and forth over the top of my dash board, talking about an instrumentation suite of a half dozen gauges that could be used to interpret available air density. This was before the Palm Pilot inspired Power PDA. He was talking about round dial gauges, before the emergence of harvesting PID data from the vehicle. So for at least a quarter of a century prior to his creation of the iDash monitoring system, he had been passionately thinking about such a system, because he didn't just come up with the idea while we were chit chatting at my truck. So yes, I would buy into a system like that if I were so inclined, because it is backed by someone who very intensely pursued the idea, for decades, until he succeeded.

 

My '19 is factory set to target SOC of 80%. According to what I see with Forscan. I made no changes after swapping in AGM batteries. Using an OBD2 dongle and app to monitor voltage, I consistently see 14.7v while running. I've briefly seen as high as 14.8 and as low as 14.3, but only for a short time. Even on multi hour road trips, it pretty much sits at 14.7v the entire time.

 

This is a very important observation, made by a member who didn't just casually make this observation, but who dug in deep a couple of years ago, reading all the other threads, and who even started a thread exploring this same question.

This is why I said at the end of 5e in Post #85... "Must not be #5."

And it is why I believe there is ambiguity as to the meaning of Battery Target State Of Charge %.

This ambiguity should be clarified before assuming that one numerical value is better or worse than another.

The meaning, and or the optimal value, might be different between mini-genres... the 20-22 might differ from 17-19. 23+ might differ yet again.

 

I had emailed Odyssey asking if I should make any changes in my 2017 truck and the answer they gave was:
"As long as your alternator is charging the battery at 14.0 to 14.6 volts, there should not need to be any changes made to the computer"
When I asked what the ideal charge was, in a perfect world, for my Odyssey battery the answer they gave was:
"14.3 -14.4 volts"

 

The Everstart batteries were delivered by FedEx today. Thy were well packaged. One was fully charged and one was only 80% charged. First order of business is to top them off before install.




I never thought my simple question would become so complex and generate the responses it did. I want to take a minute and thank all who have posted , and continue to post. It has been very educational for me and I am sure other members as well.

Bob

 

@HorizontalHunter

Your top down photo of your newly arrived Walmart Everstart AGM platinum battery indicates a THIRD case design (which suggests three different supplier manufacturers) for the Everstart Platinum AGM in the Group 65 size.

Before you install the batteries, and while you are topping them up, can you take a few more photos of your new Everstart batteries?

a. Macro close ups of the fine print on any label

b. Any stamped or heat seared case embossments of letters or numbers of any type

c. The construction of the lower half of the case, where it would engage any old style Ford wedge battery hold down cleat.

d. The upper sides of the battery, at the lid to case interface... any perimeter stiffening structures that double as support for strap handles, if fitted.

The unique aspect of your Everstart Platinum AGM Group 65 battery is the fact that it has a recessed swing handle embodied into the lid, compared to the two versions of Everstart Platinum AGM Group 65 batteries shown below.

e. Try to also take some shots matching the angles of the photos below







Be advised that Walmart may automatically pull these images at any time. So interested parties wishing to compare what now appears to be three (3) different versions of Walmart Everstart Platinum AGM Group 65 batteries are urged to copy and save the two images above, before they are replaced with a grey Walmart logo.

The differences in these batteries strongly suggest a supplier / manufacture difference.

One might be made by Varta, which is owned by Clarios, which is owned by Brookfield Partners, who bought out Johnson Controls six years ago.

Another might be made by East Penn Manufacturing, who private labels many different brands of batteries.

And the third might be another PRC state owned battery manufacturer in China, or for that matter, all three batteries may come from different battery manufacturers in China, which has many now.

It will be very interesting to sleuth out the which battery case matches which other AGM battery NOT branded by Everstart or Walmart.

 

While you are waiting for your new battery to charge, and while we are waiting for your hoped for photos, here is more food for thought and discussion, taken from the 2022 Super Duty Owner's manual, specifically selected due to the OP's truck being a 2022 model year (ridiculous to have to change the batteries in just 2 years, but hey, that is why we are having this discussion, and talking about AGM batteries, and Ford's meaning of Battery Target State of Charge in particular).

2022 Super Duty Owners Manual enUSA, Edition date: 2021-03, First-Printing

Battery Management System (Pp 409-411)

The battery management system monitors
battery conditions and takes actions to
extend battery life. If excessive battery
drain is detected, the system temporarily
disables some of the following features:

• Heated rear window.
• Heated seats.
• Climate control.
• Heated steering wheel.
• Audio unit.
• Navigation system.

A message may appear in the information
display to alert you that battery protection
actions are active.

After battery replacement, or in some
cases after charging the battery with an
external charger, the battery management
system requires eight hours of vehicle sleep
time to relearn the battery state of charge.
During this time your vehicle must remain
fully locked with the ignition off.

Note:
If you add electrical accessories or
components to the vehicle, it may adversely
affect battery performance and durability.
This may also affect the performance of
other electrical systems in the vehicle.

To maintain correct operation of the
battery management system, if you add
any electrical devices to your vehicle, do
not connect the ground connection directly
to the negative battery terminal. A
connection at the negative battery terminal
can cause inaccurate measurements of
the battery condition and potential
incorrect system operation.


Note: (P.24)
We may provide information in
response to requests from law enforcement,
other government authorities and third
parties acting with lawful authority or
through a legal process. Such information
could be used by them in legal proceedings.

Data recorded includes, for example:

• Operating states of system
components, for example fuel level,
tire pressure and battery charge level.


Remote Start Limitations: (P.146)

Remote start does not work under the
following conditions:

• The battery voltage is below the
minimum operating voltage.



Questions:
- What is the "Minimum Operating Voltage" (MOV)?
- Is this MOV also settable by the parameters that folks fool with in FORScan?
- Is it described using different language among the screens that reveal those settings?
- Does it relate to Battery Target State Of Charge %?



Note: (P.192)
Your vehicle has a battery saver
feature that shuts your vehicle off when it
detects a certain amount of battery drain...



Questions:
- What is the "certain amount of battery drain"?
- Is this certain amount also settable by the parameters that folks fool with in FORScan?
- Is it described using different language among the screens that reveal those settings?
- Does it relate to Battery Target State Of Charge %?

 

@Y2KW57

Absolutely, happy to. Let me know if you want more. I included an end shot as the carry handle is different and the base is tapered instead of horizontal.

Bob

 

The truck was purchased in November of 2021 and yes it is early to change batteries but the factory batteries are gassing and not holding voltage. No trouble starting but they aren’t holding like they should and I haven’t added anything but a dash cam controlled by upfitter switch #6. Battery saving mode has become a PIA. I also got some strange spurious unrelated trouble codes so I opted for a battery upgrade.

While I don’t think it has a parasitic draw issue I haven’t made any efforts in that direction. It just acts like a bad battery to me and Ford batteries are what they are.

I’m retired and the BMS has plenty of opportunity to reset multiple times a week

Thank you for all your input and insight in this thread.

Bob

 

That is interesting. The 2 Everstart Platinum Group 65 AGM batteries that I picked up from a nearby Wally World last Thursday looks unlike Bob's Everstart Platinum AGM and exactly like the first picture that Y2K shared:


It's interesting too that the "same" battery that Bob just got in also states 775CCA whereas the others like the one I got are 750CCA... I got robbed 25CCA!

On another note, a friend recently put a cheaper, Everstart FLA battery in a car a few months ago. The car has been having some issues so I asked him about the battery, even though it was new. So, he took it out of the car, went to the nearest Wally World and they swapped it out no questions asked... Unfortunately for him, they didn't even test it to know if it was bad, but at least it was a super easy and fast swap!

 

I can also add these images:

Made in Korea:




There appears to be a logo on the label:




And there is a QR style code Laser engraved on the case:

 

The two I just purchased are like the stock photos and are 750cca. They are both dated 12/24

 

Mine are dated 11/24. Makes me wish I would have taken photos of them before I put them in now, but they do look just like yours.

 

HorizontalHunter,
Thanks for sharing the "Made in Korea" picture.
Fish

 

Thank you very much Bob for taking these photos.

As you can already see, your photos have garnered a great deal of interest from fellow members who have just recently purchased Walmart Everstart Platinum AGM Group 65 batteries that are entirely different than yours.

To sort this out further, we know that you had your batteries delivered. Can you please post the Walmart Item #, as well as a UPC (both would be helpful) from your receipt?

Since this is a different battery, there must be a different item number, and must be a different UPC number. If we can collect the same information for all three types of these Walmart AGM Platinum batteries in Group 65, that would be helpful in figuring out which battery is made by which manufacturer. The goal here is to determine which Walmart battery one should seek to buy, where merely the description of Platinum AGM Group 65 is obviously now inadequate to distinguish between the three different versions that Walmart offers.

@chadstickpoindexter If you wouldn't mind also posting the Walmart Item # as well as the UPC number of the 750 CCA 4 year over strap top Platinum AGM's that you recently purchased, that will make 66% of our sought for data complete. Can you please also state if you purchased online or locally in store?

@longhaultransport Can you also do the same?

I will commit to trying to track down the third version, with the 5 year (3/2 free/prorata) warranty, to see if I can scare up a UPC number and an Item number.

Back to @HorizontalHunter

I'm sorry, I prepared the additional requests embedded in copies of your photos a couple of hours ago, but then got hung up on another forum matter, and then had to build a new album for batteries because my Electrical album was too full, so that took a bit of time, and now it is after dark. But here are my additional photo requests, some of which you may have already anticipated and provided with your second set, but like I said, I had already prepared this set below before you posted your second set. Still, there are some photos yet to be taken, that are requested below. Thank you!