Hypermilers thread
Zombie Survivalist
Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 14,809
Likes: 3
From: Rock Springs, WY, USA
i feel like the odd man out. my 84 averaged 16-17 mpg on I-80 through wyomin and nebraska. i clocked the first tank, all up all hill, all the way to empty (switched tanks when it started to miss), at 75+ mph. it got 16.1 mpg. i might add, that i wasnt babyin it, just seein what it would do. the rear tank holds 19 gallons, and it took me 306 miles. to add to that, i started that tank at 6,500 feet. climbed 40 miles to 6,700 feet, drove around town for bout an hour and a half, then hit the highway, and didnt have to switch tanks until after i had made it over the last, steepest pass that peaked at 8,700 feet. as a last bit, its runnin 3.55 gears with 315/75 S/T coopers.
as a final note, dave, i know all about the moose pump (blown84 on oilburners.net) and have been plannin to get one for this truck long before i even had it. shortly i plan to get a set of headers for it. (Headers for Ford, Mustang, Pinto, Bronco, Cougar, Ranger, exhaust parts for home built do it yourself automotive headers.) and one of these days when i get some ambition worked up, im gonna take the front end apart and re-clock the cam so that its strait up. i dunno how far IH retarded it, but i will find out, and if it does half for this old diesel what it does for the gassers of the era, ill probably do a back-flip. (for reference, re-clockin the cam in a late 70s 460 from 6 degrees of retard to strait up adds 60-90 hp.)
as a final note, dave, i know all about the moose pump (blown84 on oilburners.net) and have been plannin to get one for this truck long before i even had it. shortly i plan to get a set of headers for it. (Headers for Ford, Mustang, Pinto, Bronco, Cougar, Ranger, exhaust parts for home built do it yourself automotive headers.) and one of these days when i get some ambition worked up, im gonna take the front end apart and re-clock the cam so that its strait up. i dunno how far IH retarded it, but i will find out, and if it does half for this old diesel what it does for the gassers of the era, ill probably do a back-flip. (for reference, re-clockin the cam in a late 70s 460 from 6 degrees of retard to strait up adds 60-90 hp.)
Thread Starter
|
Lead Driver
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 6,900
Likes: 3
From: Campbell River, B.C.
I've never heard of reclocking the cam on one of these engines. 400 and 460 big blocks yes, but never on a diesel. The valve to piston running clearance is VERY close on these engines. Do you have anymore info on the camshaft being retarded?
Zombie Survivalist
Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 14,809
Likes: 3
From: Rock Springs, WY, USA
Thread Starter
|
Lead Driver
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 6,900
Likes: 3
From: Campbell River, B.C.
Ok, I vaguely remember some of that discussion now. Although I'm not sure if that means its safe to reclock the cam (or by how much). Just be careful is all I can say.
Thread Starter
|
Lead Driver
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 6,900
Likes: 3
From: Campbell River, B.C.
Here is some more of the conversation:
uke: Well you just asked a whole mouth full. The camshaft is one of the most important parts of the engine it will make the engine make power in higher rpms or lower rpms depending on how its configured. On a conventional engine N/A usually the more lift and duration you have the better the engine preforms @ higher rpm but with a diesel engine, turbo charged that is, Usually the rpms are lower and the torque is made lower there for the time that the valves are held open during operation or travel of the piston is less cause the engine is being force fed air,turbo charging, instead of relying on vacuum.
Now this is where you need to pay attention to where your valves open and close. On a turbo charged engine before the end of the exhaust stroke both the intake and the exhaust valves should be open for a given amount of time, valve over lap, creating what they refer to as scavenging. This is when the charge air from the turbo is pushing out any remaining exhaust gases before starting the intake stroke usualy the intake valve stays open more than the entire downward travel of the piston (180 degrees of crank shaft rotation) say the intake opens @ 10 degrees BTDC exhaust stroke and stays open until 35 degrees after BDC intake stroke or 35 degrees into the compression stroke.
Right here is where what engine types differ.
Most conventional engines are still letting charge air into the cylinder during the upward stroke or compression stroke, like our engines IDI's, this cause more heat and cylinder pressure at TDCC Where as other engine types close the inlet valve before the intake stroke has ended thus letting the charge air expand in the cylinder. And when a volume of air that is already compressed, from the turbo, and is let re-expand quickly during the downward piston travel it becomes cooler decreasing the amount of cylinder pressure and heat in the combustion chamber. When this system is used it is necessary to have a larger quantity of charge air to make up for the air expansion in the cylinder Therein lies the problem and possibly some solution to the IH IDI turbo engines.
Because the 7.3 IDI inlet valve closes @ 42.8 degrees ABDC , from what i was told, the inlet air is crammed in there to the point where its probably being pushed back out of the cylinder due to the length of upward piston travel.
More then likely if the inlet valve was closed before the bottom of the intake stroke then you could have more charge air less emissions and a better balanced engine;Sweet
Hope that helps
To which I said:
Its not the whole conversation but that is the part relating to the camshaft being possibly retarded. Full link here, but I think registration is required to view.
Cam question - Oilburners.net
uke: Well you just asked a whole mouth full. The camshaft is one of the most important parts of the engine it will make the engine make power in higher rpms or lower rpms depending on how its configured. On a conventional engine N/A usually the more lift and duration you have the better the engine preforms @ higher rpm but with a diesel engine, turbo charged that is, Usually the rpms are lower and the torque is made lower there for the time that the valves are held open during operation or travel of the piston is less cause the engine is being force fed air,turbo charging, instead of relying on vacuum. Now this is where you need to pay attention to where your valves open and close. On a turbo charged engine before the end of the exhaust stroke both the intake and the exhaust valves should be open for a given amount of time, valve over lap, creating what they refer to as scavenging. This is when the charge air from the turbo is pushing out any remaining exhaust gases before starting the intake stroke usualy the intake valve stays open more than the entire downward travel of the piston (180 degrees of crank shaft rotation) say the intake opens @ 10 degrees BTDC exhaust stroke and stays open until 35 degrees after BDC intake stroke or 35 degrees into the compression stroke.
Right here is where what engine types differ.
Most conventional engines are still letting charge air into the cylinder during the upward stroke or compression stroke, like our engines IDI's, this cause more heat and cylinder pressure at TDCC Where as other engine types close the inlet valve before the intake stroke has ended thus letting the charge air expand in the cylinder. And when a volume of air that is already compressed, from the turbo, and is let re-expand quickly during the downward piston travel it becomes cooler decreasing the amount of cylinder pressure and heat in the combustion chamber. When this system is used it is necessary to have a larger quantity of charge air to make up for the air expansion in the cylinder Therein lies the problem and possibly some solution to the IH IDI turbo engines.
Because the 7.3 IDI inlet valve closes @ 42.8 degrees ABDC , from what i was told, the inlet air is crammed in there to the point where its probably being pushed back out of the cylinder due to the length of upward piston travel.
More then likely if the inlet valve was closed before the bottom of the intake stroke then you could have more charge air less emissions and a better balanced engine;Sweet
Hope that helps
Well crap! maybe a custom cam is in the works for me after all, Russ. Didn't realise the stock cam was a smogger retard like the ford big blocks.
And here I was thinking these engines were untouched by emission devices. Turns out the enemy was from within all along.
Had no idea that the scavenging effect often described in the detroit 2 strokes borrows over to these 4 stroke engines.
Great breakdown of the theory there, spencer!!!!
And here I was thinking these engines were untouched by emission devices. Turns out the enemy was from within all along.Had no idea that the scavenging effect often described in the detroit 2 strokes borrows over to these 4 stroke engines.
Great breakdown of the theory there, spencer!!!!
Cam question - Oilburners.net
Fleet Owner
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 20,337
Likes: 798
From: Mi'kma'ki
Wow, you've got my attention now! Thats roughly a 14% bump! Have to see the next tank just to be 100% sure but if you were spilling fuel, I'd say its over 90% sure as is.
According to my geaky calculations (I'm lisping right now - *wipes off monitor*), that could push my 24 MPG over 27.........
According to my geaky calculations (I'm lisping right now - *wipes off monitor*), that could push my 24 MPG over 27.........
this tank includes
a. the one pass side fender shirt.
b. fuel turned down one flat. (zero signs of smoke now even with the peddle to the metal and kicked down in 2nd revving over 3k+ up hill with a couple ton on back,like my old ip.)
im on the road to success now baby.
https://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/g...vehicleid=1301
Thread Starter
|
Lead Driver
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 6,900
Likes: 3
From: Campbell River, B.C.
FTE Stories
Ford Trucks for Ford Truck Enthusiasts
AEV FXL Super Duty - the Super Duty Raptor Ford Doesn't Make
Brett Foote
Lobo Vs Lobo: Proof the F-150 Lobo Should Be Even Lower!
Michael S. Palmer
Ford's 2001 Explorer Sportsman Concept Looks For a New Home
Verdad Gallardo
10 Best Ford Truck Engines We Miss the Most!
Joe Kucinski
2026 Shelby F-150 Off-Road: Better Than a Raptor R?
Brett Foote
2027 Super Duty Carhartt Package First Look: 12 Things You NEED to Know!
Michael S. Palmer
10 Most Surprising 2026 Ford Truck Features!
Joe Kucinski
Top 10 Ford Trucks Coming to Mecum Indy 2026
Brett Foote
5 Best / 5 Worst Ford Truck Wheels of All Time
Joe Kucinski
Lead Driver
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 6,938
Likes: 13
Ill chime in here. The truck in my sig gets 17.7 overall average, so far my high has been 21.4 on open highway doing 60, 65 mile drive drops about 1600' theres some good uphill grades along the way too. I dont by any means baby it, in fact i keep being told " you cant hot rod that old diesel or youll blow it up", but i cant resist the sound of the pipes lol. Only thing i can figure is 3.55 gears and the 35s. Oh and speedo isnt adjusted so its actually getting a little better but i dont know by how much. Damn sight better than the 9mpg the old 400 got and alot more power to boot. One big motivation was fuel mileage and everyone said i wont get over 15, but the other was a very threatening rod in the 400. Id love to see what a engine in good shape would do in my truck, when i pulled this one the bottom end was a block of ice, i thawed her out, sprayed some WD40 on everything to keep rust off and been running ever since, about 16k if memory serves. Best i can tell from the donor drivers seat and odometer the motor had 269k on it when i pulled it after sittin 2.5 years
Fleet Owner
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 20,337
Likes: 798
From: Mi'kma'ki
17.03 MPG this time David! i stuck to 45 MPH max even in the 55 zones.
man,i owe you a lot for my success with helping me aero out this brick walled dump bed.it's really going well.
im going to have a couple real fender skits made up now.im gunna take the advice from eccomoders and drop 'em to level with the tool boxes.
im getting less and less concerned with appearance after watching my fuel gauge hang on so much longer.
on another note,i just installed a variable rate E-fan controller,so now rather than the monsters kicking in and running on full,they just start out real,real low and easy and creep up higher with the temps.
i installed a light to watch the power.it's pretty dang cool.green is off,and then it turns yellowish orange,and gets darker in color as they draw more power,and then red is full.so far red only happens if i tell them to, just testing things out.i was loaded real nice today and no sign of coming even close to a red light.
so this will help some too im sure.
i wanted to make sure these fans would work before i spent a big chunk on a good quality variable rate controller.this thing is really nice!!! took a long time to get it from Brain over at delta current controls this time,but man i just knew it would be worth the wait.
man,i owe you a lot for my success with helping me aero out this brick walled dump bed.it's really going well.
im going to have a couple real fender skits made up now.im gunna take the advice from eccomoders and drop 'em to level with the tool boxes.
im getting less and less concerned with appearance after watching my fuel gauge hang on so much longer.
on another note,i just installed a variable rate E-fan controller,so now rather than the monsters kicking in and running on full,they just start out real,real low and easy and creep up higher with the temps.
i installed a light to watch the power.it's pretty dang cool.green is off,and then it turns yellowish orange,and gets darker in color as they draw more power,and then red is full.so far red only happens if i tell them to, just testing things out.i was loaded real nice today and no sign of coming even close to a red light.
so this will help some too im sure.
i wanted to make sure these fans would work before i spent a big chunk on a good quality variable rate controller.this thing is really nice!!! took a long time to get it from Brain over at delta current controls this time,but man i just knew it would be worth the wait.
Lead Driver
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 6,938
Likes: 13
on another note,i just installed a variable rate E-fan controller,so now rather than the monsters kicking in and running on full,they just start out real,real low and easy and creep up higher with the temps.
i installed a light to watch the power.it's pretty dang cool.green is off,and then it turns yellowish orange,and gets darker in color as they draw more power,and then red is full.so far red only happens if i tell them to, just testing things out.i was loaded real nice today and no sign of coming even close to a red light.
so this will help some too im sure.
i wanted to make sure these fans would work before i spent a big chunk on a good quality variable rate controller.this thing is really nice!!! took a long time to get it from Brain over at delta current controls this time,but man i just knew it would be worth the wait.
Fleet Owner
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 20,337
Likes: 798
From: Mi'kma'ki
yeah.i swapped to electric cooling fans back in 2011-02-20 though.when i went to plow for the first time,i discovered the trucks fan clutch didn't work,so rather than replace with yesteryear's energy hog,i thought it best to upgrade then.im running the dual ford windstar cooling fan assembly,which simply bolts on in place of the stock shroud with little fabrication.
what has changed is how they run now.rather than kicking on fun steam ahead,they only spin enough to keep the engine cool now with a variable rate controller so they draw much less when running than before.the updated controller was installed about mid tank.
http://www.dccontrol.com/introf2.htm
what has changed is how they run now.rather than kicking on fun steam ahead,they only spin enough to keep the engine cool now with a variable rate controller so they draw much less when running than before.the updated controller was installed about mid tank.
http://www.dccontrol.com/introf2.htm
Thread Starter
|
Lead Driver
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 6,900
Likes: 3
From: Campbell River, B.C.
Nicely done! My numbers took a hit recently since I've been leadfooting around. I cringe just thinking what the next fillup will be like (17 and change on the front tank, and just under 12 on a short single tank average for the rear). Anything above very low throttle/RPM seems to hurt pretty hard. I'm tempted to bump the timing slightly since rooting out a bad injector recently. I think that was the reason I kept having a dead glow plug.