>
>
>>You also get to meet Adolph Hitler, Nero, Attila the Hun, and a >whole bunch of other nasty fellows. But don't worry, I doubt they >will have time to pester you since they will be weeping and gnashing >their teeth alongside you, crying out for even a drop of water to >wet their tongues.
>
>I got news for you, Hitler was a christian, so by your
>arguement, as long as he was repentant you will be dining
>with him in heaven.
>
>

Good one You got me there. I was making an assumption based on their lives. Of course only God knows the heart and thus who really is a Christian. I can only go off a persons example and confession and make my best judgment. What evidence do you have that Hitler was a Christian? Did he die a Christian? Perhaps he had a freak conversion to true Christianity as he dropped dead, but it seems to me that he was a false Christian at best. Actually, I think his atrocities were fueled by the "theory" of evolution. Some say Darwin died a Christian. I could be suprised at whom I get to dine with, and with whom I don't get to dine with. I am hoping my father will be there. He was a staunch agnostic, but in later years did listen to many sermons and allowed visits by my pastor. His favorite argument was that the religions were like a choice between Ford, Ch**y and Chrysler. We sure had some heated discussions.

 

Also, doesn't Christian mean "Christ like"? I would not call very many people Christians nowadays. I don't recall ever meeting anyone "Christ like"! I would, however, like to, but I don't think one exists. Even the Pope has his faults.

 

I took some classes in college on Nazism, and the culture was heavily steeped in christianity, in fact they used teachings of many of the antisemetic christian leaders (i can't remeber exactly who) to forward their idea of the arian race.
In fact the swastika was a christian symbol that was disgarded after it had been used by the *****.


TP
this has been a great debate, and a welcome exchange of ideas with someone of an obviously different point of view. enjoy your faith.... I will continue searching.

 

ok heres another 0.02 of mine thats a total of 0.06 already!!! lol

I just wanted to jump in again and say I am very glad to see we(as FTE members) can discuss a hot topic like this without any name calling personal attacks!!! Makes me proud to be part of a great group like this

<<ok continue with discussion >>

 

I think the site, and it's members, are "EVOLVING"!

 

Quote: I got news for you, Hitler was a christian, so by your arguement, as long as he was repentant you will be dining with him in heaven.

Correct me if I am wrong (and I may be). But didn't Hitler take his own life before the Allies got to him? I was taught by my church elders that if one took his or her own life by way of suicide, then they got a one way ticket to the hot place.

Graffe.

 

Yup, that's what they say. Suicide = eternal damnation

 

>I took some classes in college on Nazism, and the culture
>was heavily steeped in christianity,

Come on, not any Christianity I've ever heard of. And I've heard and studied quite a few.

in fact they used
>teachings of many of the antisemetic christian leaders (i
>can't remeber exactly who) to forward their idea of the
>arian race.

Anti-semitic Christians? For goodness sakes, Christ was a Jew! By definition you cannot be a Christian and be anti-semitic at the same time.If they were anti-semitic, Those "Christian leaders" were NOT CHRISTIANS!


>In fact the swastika was a christian symbol that was
>disgarded after it had been used by the *****.

Wrong. No where has it been used as a Christian symbol. It was a symbol the Finnish used in their armed forces as well as being an American Indian symbol. The ****'s referred to it as the "broken cross" and their religion replaced Christ with Hitler. Hitler was no Christian.

I believe your college course must have been designed by some revisionists or something. Maybe someone TRYING to tie Christianity with Nazism. Anyone who's ever studied the teachings of Christ and Christianity knows this argument is entirely bogus.
>
>
>TP
>this has been a great debate, and a welcome exchange of
>ideas with someone of an obviously different point of view.
>enjoy your faith.... I will continue searching.

Yes, it is a good debate. I am enjoying it.

Chuck

 

while Hitler may not uphold current christian values, it is clear when reading his writings that he believed he was a christian, in addition he used the prevailing antisemitism amongst european christians to bolster his position, and obviously *******ized some of these believes and feelings to further his own agenda.

case in point the following is from mien kampf- hitlers most famous writing:

"The best characterization is provided by the product of this religious education, the Jew himself. His life is only of this world, and his spirit is inwardly as alien to true Christianity as his nature two thousand years previous was to the great founder of the new doctrine. Of course, the latter made no secret of his attitude toward the Jewish people, and when necessary he even took the whip to drive from the temple of the Lord this adversary of all humanity, who then as always saw in religion nothing but an instrument for his business existence. In return, Christ was nailed to the cross, while our present-day party Christians debase themselves to begging for Jewish votes at elections and later try to arrange political swindles with atheistic Jewish parties-- and this against their own nation."

(Hitler demonstrates the common anti-Semitic view that Jesus was an Aryan rather than a Jew, and glowingly described him as "the great founder of the new doctrine"

I will have to check my facts on the swaztika info, but I did quite a lot of reading on the subject of ***** and the holocaust, everything from ely wiesle (spelling?) to some of the revisionist crap. I am not trying to say that Hitler represents christians in anyway, only that he believed he was a christian.

 

Since we are discussing God and faith I thought it would be good to hear what the Bible says the gospel is. I put this together many years ago using only Bible passages as text:

[B]All have sinned and fall short of the glory of God (Romans 3:23). There is none righteous, no, not one (Romans 3:10). For we all are as an unclean thing, and all our righteous acts are as filthy rags (Isaiah 64.6).

The wages of sin is death (Romans 6:23a)--everlasting punnishment (Matthew 25.46) in Hell fire, where their worm does not die and the fire is not quenched (Mark 9:47,48)--but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord (Romans 6:23b).

God has shown His love for us in this, that while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us (Romans 5:8). He bore our sins in His own body (1 Peter 2:24), poured out His soul unto death (Isiah 53:12), and washed us from our sins in His own blood (Revelation 1.5).

The blood of Jesus Christ, His Son, cleanses us fro all sin (1 John 1.7); for in Him dwells all the fullness of the Godhead bodily (Colossians 2.9). He that believes on the Son has everlasting life; and he that believes not the Son shall not see life, but the wrath of God abides on him (John 3:36).

 

Let me start by saying this, I'm not the smartest person in the world, but I know more than most 17 year olds.....

I've always had a great interest in science and find there to be rational theories in evolution, but I'm sure there are also holes. I do not see why one who believes in evolution must be a denouncer of god? Why would god not want us to change and adapt to our newly created environements with our newly found intellegences? It only makes sense and I would think is an argument for a higher power. We were logically coded to adapt......

Moving on, if nothing can be created from nothing and God created everything, what created god? We are not only possibly hard wired to believe in a higher power, but are also hard wired to only think in certain perspectives. For example we base everything on a 3 dimensional world, because that's what we see and "what we live in". Take this for example, it is believed, possibly proven for all I know, dogs only see in 2-d. Now if we could only see in 2-d perhaps we would think the world a totally different place, and would have no understanding of why the earth is spherical, and that we spin around the sun etc. etc. because presumeably we'd have no way of telling.

What is was leading up to with all of that is this, the reason we probably have no understanding of where we came from is because our minds are possibly not able to comprehend the processes it would take to make us what we are today, this for me is very hard to express in words, but i hope my above statements have given enough explanation that you can understand what I'm saying. There is a theory known as string theory which i have very little if any understanding of, but i know it states that there are something like 17 different dimensions in our universe. Try to think of time as a dimension, as well as our position in the universe as another dimension. Imagine being asleep and waking up and it seeming like you just fell asleep (we have all done this). Now imagine being at work and watch those same 8 hours crawl by. This is because in our minds everything is relative. Relative to what we are doing, relative to how we feel etc. etc. Now imagine our time system was never set up and there was no sun light, we wouldn't have any constructive element to let us know when to do things how long to sleep and so on. We would have no concept of time, but does it still pass in the same fashion? Or is there really no such thing as time? If the universe is infinite how do we know where we are in relation to infiniteism? If it is not infinite, what is after the universe's fringe? How do we know we are not living on a proton of a bigger atom so to speak? Basically all this babling was said to make you realize that we can't comprehend where we came from and where we're going. We set up systems that allow us to have some kind of structure to our lives because like my Grandmother says, "in a hundred years no one will care about what you did and who you were."
Einstein also believed in time travel, I haven't a very broad background on this subject so i won't go into it and say something that is false. But I believe he basically says that time can be reversed by connecting two points in space, if space is emptyness we could basically make a rip in it and be somewhere else at the same time or something like that...... too perplex for my physics knowledge at the moment.

Einstein was quoted as saying that the more he learned the more he believed in a higher power. This coming from such a brilliant man that we're still proving his 50+ year old theories right today. What was it that caused him to have such a strong reasoning for belief in this higher power? When presumably most physists believe in the "Big Bang" theory.

 

btw sorry for such a long post it is a little unfinished but i figured it got the gist and was long enough lol.

 

someone please reply id hate to think i wrote all that for nothing, im interested to know if what i said makes sense or if im crazy lol

 

Holy cow!!(Get it)Long thread.

Example of faithIn My eyes)
Men enter into twin buildings 100+ stories tall engulfed in flames. Few walk out. Thats faith to me. Faith in yourself, fellow man, training,future of your family without you and for many god.

For the Hitler - Christianity thread read "Hitlers Pope" by Cornwall.
Then find a similar title by Rothschild? Its interesting.

If you do read it. Eugene should of denounced Hitler as early as "31". Taken the heat maybe even ended up a saint a little earlier than anticipated. Could have saved millions of children and women from a horrible death - would not have stopped the war though.

Those that think these are bad times read about what went on in the rest of the world over the centuries. Heck, Hitlers modern mans #1 dark spot #2 us nuking japan but thats there fault not ours...Geez these are good times in comparison.

Why are people that believe in carbon dating and dinosaurs liberals?
I will always question authority yes authorities are human. That includes the current church authorities handling of "bad" priests.
Are they considered liberals or conservatives - hypocrites?
Why can I fish but not hunt on Sunday's?

Good luck,

Ray

 

Haven't we already proven that Homosapians have been here for about 10-14,000 years at least? I mean the sphinx is at least 10,000 years old.