Well Dave you missed a fun tidbit at the show today as I fell over backwards. We were chasing the shade, moving our chairs every 30 minutes or so, and ultimately ended up in the grass near the school building. There was some mulch and I set my chair down in it, not realizing the back legs were in about 4 inches of soft mulch but the front was much firmer, so as I sat down the chair just toppled over backwards and smacked me right to the ground. You know the old joke, if you aren't sure if you are old, fall down. If people laugh at you then you're young, but if they panic and run to help you, you're old. Well nobody was laughing, at least not at first. Luckily only my pride was hurt!

I tackled the brakes, again, and this time I have to say I think I may have gotten it right. I wrestled with it for 45 minutes, loosened it and moved it as much as I could. I could get needle nose on it but nothing else, and it's near impossible to tell if you are turning it or not because the tool blocks your view. So I wedged a small pry in between and forced it apart just enough to fit my finger & thumb and then counted my turns, half at a time, and I am pretty sure I got 3.5 turns on the pushrod. A fight to get it back into place (specifically, a fight to get it in place far enough to get the nut started on the drivers side stud) but once I did, I was able to snug it all back down. I got inside and pressed the brakes, feels much better. Just a small amount of movement at the top before you feel the firmness of the pedal. I did not get to test drive it though as it was dark and my wife is parked behind me, but I feel like I got it where it is supposed to be.

This is all the room I can get; the front of the assembly is wedged up against the shock tower!

Of course I've scratched my new vacuum booster but you can't make an omelet without cracking some eggs.

 

I had a good laugh about the chair and you couldn't blame it on drinking
Also glad you did not get hurt and this is the main part.

Good to hear you may have the brakes working good just need a test drive to confirm.
Monday I got to call about sending my booster out for rebuild this way I can move the car out to do some much needed cleaning to make room to work on the Javelin.
Dave. -----

 

My test drive yesterday went well and I was very pleased with the brake pedal feel. But I don't think my test drive went far enough because later in the day I had plans to convoy up to Knightdale for a funeral, but I only made it as far as Taco Bell before I started smelling the heat and the brake pedal started getting tight. So I let it sit and cool off while I had some lunch, but when I came out the pedal was tighter than ever and the car didn't even want to roll. I forced it down into the parking lot by the hardware store but I didn't have time to mess with it. I got a ride home and just took my pickup to Knightdale. Then after the services I went home and my wife drove me up to get the Mustang, brakes felt fine the whole way home until the very last turn, I could feel the pedal getting tight again. So I was 99% sure at that time that I adjusted the rod too far out and it's not letting the master relax enough for the brake fluid from the rear lines to return to the reservoir.

So, I took it apart again last and turned the pushrod IN approx. 1 turn. Maybe 1-1/4 turns. Hard to judge exactly, but I hope it's enough. Then I fought it to get it back into place, and now I will need to go on another test drive today. A longer one for sure. On the plus side I am starting to get good at fighting that master in and out.

 

John, after your disc brake conversion saga, I'm now convinced I will just keep my drums on the jeep and refurbish all the parts. I'm hoping to start on the bike and or Jeep over the winter. Not sure I will have to budget to do both. We'll see.

 

You would think buying a kit specifically made for my car would take care of 90% of the drama, but really it didn't. But I have to say the power discs feel so much better than my manual drums.

I went to power discs on my 69 F100 a long time ago, but I used a hydroboost unit from a 2004 F450 to power the master. No kit there, just scratching my head, figuring things out, and fabricating, but the stopping power is nice!

This was 2015 when I put that together. Master cylinder is from a 1979 Lincoln.

 

Well my test drive this morning was another failure, I only went 3-4 miles, in a big square never being too far from home. But the brakes started smelling hot, I could feel the brakes tugging against the car, so I turned off into a side street to let them cool down. After about an hour I came back and drove home, felt fine, but I wanted to get them hot to the point of sticking again so I drove around the church parking lot a couple of times, then down the road about a half mile and back. The brake pedal didn't get tight but I noticed it was pulling really hard to the right whenever I press the brakes. It had not done this before. When I got to my driveway I jammed the brake pedal and sure enough, the right front locked up skidded in the gravel while the other 3 wheels just rolled. So I don't understand why that is happening and what would cause it.


When I got in the car, I found a stowaway that had come in through the open window.


I put my adjustable bias valve at 5 full turns from "all the way counter-clockwise" which is approx half. I figured that was a good starting point. But until I can at least get the brakes functioning properly it seems like a waste to adjust it.


I verified my plumbing is correct, against the diagram from Force-10 brakes.

 

Man, what a pain in the rump. Hope the cat was ok.

 

The only reason I can see only 1 wheel locking up is the others have air in them or the fluid boiled and would not let them work right.

The next time you go for a test drive take a wrench with you to loosen the master from the booster.
When it gets tight loosen the bolts a little at a time to see if the brakes release and if so then yes that rod is too long.

I would get the rod worked out before I tried to bleed the brakes this way you know it was not boiling brake fluid why only 1 wheel locked.

Also have you tried to reach out to the place you got the kit from to see what they have to say about all this trouble you are having?
There has to be a reason why that them may not have put on the papers like cutting the dust shields to clear the calipers.
Dave ----

 

James, she likes to hang out with me but I didn't think it was a good idea to take her on my test drive, so I made her get out. I think maybe I hurt her feelings but nothing else

Dave I think you and I are on the same wavelength there because I could think the only reason why one side on the front locks up without the other is that one side must have air in it or something. Andre noticed one of my lines is too close to the exhaust so it could also be boiling and maybe increasing pressure.

I pulled the master off again and turned the pushrod in one turn. So now it's basically back where it was on Friday / Saturday. The brakes no longer lock up as this is far enough back to allow it to relax enough to let the fluid return. But that means my pedal has a couple of inches of travel before it fully engages.

After putting everything back in place I felt underneath just to check for wetness and all the lines were dry except for the one all the way in the back. That one goes to the passenger side front, which was the one that had locked up when it got hot. Also in hindsight it was the one that I got air from on bleeding both times. It was wet and the steering box underneath was also wet. So I gave it another crank with the flare wrench.

On the test drive after this, I went a few miles further, brakes never locked. Andre went around the car and noted the fronts felt warm but the rears did not, so suggested I adjust the bias valve. I went one full turn in to give the rears more pressure. Next test drive, even further, they did not got hot, never locked. In front of my house I jammed them for a hard stop with my hands off the wheel and it stayed straight and felt like all 4 gripped. All 4 wheels felt warm, not hot, so I think they are each doing their share of the job. So aside from my pedal travel everything seems to be working good.

I zip tied the brake lines to clean up the routing and get everything away from the exhaust.

 

If it makes you feel any better, the pickup pedal is lower than I would like it to be and everything came from the working parts truck before it rolled over.
Mine seams to be working ok as the brakes start to work up near the top but just takes more travel to get it to stop if that makes sense?
After my last bleeding the pedal dose feel more firmer and in testing in the drive will lock them up where before it would not.

I think if you feel it is safe to do so put some miles on the system then check it over, adjust the rear brakes if needed and rebleed and see how it feels / works.

OH ****!
I just thought of something.
You went from manual drum brakes to power disc and you are still using the manual pedal not a power pedal and I bet that is where the problem is.
Every power / drum to manual disc, drag car, and manual disc to power disc, pickup truck, the pedals were different where the pin for the rod connects from the pivot.
This could be why the pedal is funky for you. I take it the kit did not have anything to say about that or you would have done that too.
Wonder if that is why Baily had problems with the rod and the light switch hook up?
Something to look into.

No that is not the problem with my truck as I know this and why everything from the parts truck was used.
Never had a problem with the drag car brakes.
Dave -----

 

You bring up an interesting point that I had not considered before. This kit was marketed as being for a drum-to-disc upgrade, so I would assume it's designed to go with the drum brake pedal assembly. But a quick search does confirm that a 1966 Mustang with disc brakes would have the pin lower in order to provide more travel. Maybe that does explain one difference? As for the brake light switch, the problem was that the new rod was fatter behind the hole than the old one and was therefore already under pressure causing the circuit to close and making it very difficult to get into place. When it's your foot pressing against it with all the power of a leg muscle, no big deal, but trying to hold that same amount of pressure with your fingers is much much harder.



When I went googling for images to find the different rods to show you the difference, I came across that neat adjustable one which would give me PLENTY of adjustment room.

 

The pedal thing Dave brought up makes total sense. I was thinking the same thing. You swapped out everything else except that. My guess is that adjustable rod is your ticket to disc brake sweetness. Hope it works.

 

Well I got some news, after my test drive the fitting was still wet with brake fluid. I got sick of the cheap flare wrench I had been using and it was the only 3/8 flare I had, so I went and got a new set from O'Reilly, much thicker and better grip. I was able to get a good 3/4 turn on the fitting so it was definitely not tight. Makes you wonder how it got so much pressure that it had caused the wheel to lock up? Unless excess pressure made it slip a thread? Just thinking out loud. So Andre came back over to help me bleed again. Did one side then checked again, still a little wet, so I put the wrench on from underneath where I could see it, and had him crank on it from above. He can't see it but in a better position to put ooomph into it. No more leaks there, but while I was underneath and watching for leaks,he was pumping the brakes, and I noticed another fitting that was weeping. So I gave it a nice 1/2 turn, and no more wetness from any. Then we finished bleeding and he said "John the brake pedal feels 10 times better" so I am happy to make some good progress. But I did not get a chance to test drive it yet as I had promised my wife to take her car shopping all I had time to do was wash my hands and change my shirt. Hopefully this will be a nice firm pedal with hard stopping power.

Went to the VW dealership to see Tiguan's and this was the same dealership that Bailey works at, he came to say hi and told me that he replaced the leaking caliper on his 79 Vette on Tuesday then took it for a test drive, no more leaks and the brakes were nice and firm with hard stopping power. So the Corvette is figured out, the Mustang is (maybe) figured out. And even though it took all afternoon, we finally left with what my wife wanted.

 

Congrats on the new car looks nice when do we go on the road trip

Good to hear Baily got his Vet brakes fixed. Is he still a member of the club and maybe we will see him at a show with it?

Also on your brake challenge and making head way. Maybe that last little bit of work & bleeding did the trick, fingers crossed.
Did you order that adjustable rod or going to hold off till the test drive?
I am guessing if you dont test before Saturday the test will be to Jordana's?

As you know the wife's Subaru had the CEL and a traction light come on the other day.
My cheap $125 scanner only showed a "little EVAP" leak so I checked the gas cap and it was tight.
Wife said it had been a few days since she got gas so that was not the cause so I am thinking being a 2013 a hose has a crack somewhere?
But why the traction light?

You and Korey's Caddy pointed me to Crossroads Auto and they took the car in late Tuesday and had it back to us around noon Wednesday.
No lights that I see but they told her, I think as she did not know all the things they said, that all the fluids in the front / rear differentials and transmission needed to be changed.
She said go for it and they did it in 1 day. They also changed the anti freeze and she said she did not know about that but I dont know of any of the fluids ever being changed so it needed it.
I am guessing the CEL & traction come on when they need to be serviced and a better, more money, scanner shows this?

I did not look over the paper to see what all was done and nothing was said about the EVAP leak so maybe that was left over a while back from a loose gas cap as the wife puts gas in her car and I know she dose not like to put caps / top os things so why would the gas tank be different
We will see what happens with time, but I am happy with them on the turn around.
I did see online that they do safety / smog testing and forgot to ask as w will need a place to have that done being my place is closing

Oh before we went away for the weekend I had the oil changed in the Crown Vic. I first went to the clubs sponsor Auto Solutions and they wanted me to leave the car as they did not know when they could get it in.
This was about 9am so no they did not get to change the oil. I went to a quick change on 42 or is it 36 or veterans parkway, across from the Ale House.
No one was in line right in & out and I did not even have to get out of the car but I did as it just did not feel right sitting in it with work being done.
Mary thought it was too far to take her car to them or Pitstop and why we did not use them for her car.
Dave ----

 

I just got back from a test drive, and the brake pedal feel is so much better, and it stops great and the brakes never got too hot. I did maybe 15 miles, mostly on 210 and the little backroads near my house. When I got back I ran my finger underneath the proportion valve where all the fittings connect and felt a little oily in the back corner, but I couldn't be 100% sure if it was residue from yesterday that I didn't clean off good enough, or is it new? So I wiped it again and will go out for another drive later.

I did not order that adjustable brake pedal rod, but I do like and I do want it. It's just a question of do I need it (probably not) and am I willing to crawl back under the dash to remove the old one and put it into place (maaaaaybe....).

Yes Bailey is still a member, but he doesn't attend meetings anymore. He said leaving work in Cary (so far out on 64 that's practically closer to Apex anyway) then rushing home to Fuquay to get changed, then drive all the way over to Smithfield, was just too much. Plus if I remember right, neither him or his wife ever ate. They don't care for the buffet and prefer to get a pizza on the way home. lol. So not attending any meetings, but yeah now that the Vette is roadworthy I think he will be taking it out to cruise-in's. He has 2, the 77 and the 79, and I get confused about which one has which problem, and we did brakes on both of them, but one of them he wants to keep as he likes it but the other he bought mostly with the intent of getting roadworthy and then flipping it for a profit. But it will be a lot easier to sell if you can drive it to MoJo's and show it off with a "For Sale" sign.

That was weird that tranny & differential fluid caused a traction light. Modern cars... Hopefully that was all it needed and will be ok. I never heard of that causing a CEL to generate! My scanner "should" show the code even though it won't know what the code means, so I use it to get the code, then go to my phone and type it in to search.