Stu -

Thanks for the elaboration. The references are helpful. Our glorious industrial history is full of "great ideas" which turned out (after a lot of field experience) not to be. Lead in white paint and gasoline and water pipes being one of them. Not that obvious when it started, but at some point clearly a major lose-lose-lose for everyone involved. Hindsight...

Government regulation is damned tricky I know. If it is on a topic *I* have a dog in the fight with I might get real uppity about it, but then if it is about something I don't know or care about I can dismiss it as "nanny state nonsense". "You can pry these split rims out of my cold dead hands!" And industry lobbyists are a bane...

I appreciate all the help here in sorting through the vagaries and implications of this old truck I took responsibility for. I just hope I can pass that responsibility on "responsibly"... I'm sure for the right price there are plenty of folks who would want this truck, but would not (for example) want to think twice about problems like these wheels. If I can introduce this truck to the wheels on the 49 IH I found (in less usable condition than mine) then maybe we have a winner.

If I take the old rims to a junkyard, maybe take insides to one junkyard and outsides to another so nobody will be tempted to put them back on the road?

- Steve

 

When I got the lock-ring wheels from Les Schwab for mine (TOYO 9.00-20 tube type radials on the front and recapped 9.00-20's on the back) The wheels came from American Wheel in Pasco, Wa. in about 2005 or 2006, they were approx $225 each, blasted and powder coated. And with the tires, It totaled about $2800

I then took the Firestone RH-5's and cut each of them into 2 pieces using my new (then) Harbor Freight plasma cutter so there was no chance anyone could ever put them back together.

If I had it to do over again, I would get 5-lug on 8" 19.5 or 22.5 wheels and tubeless tires......OR change the hubs to the 6-lug so I could use the later wheels.

Cheers,


Rick

The 9.00-20's pretty much fill up the hole but they do not rub

 

Reading this, I've been wondering if it would be better to get a hub adaptor or even new hubs. Since replacements are so difficult I thought it might be easier and cheaper to go with a different bolt pattern.
While I'm a stock guy, I'm also cheap. Getting these trucks on the road safely with low cost is always a strong consideration.
Since the conversation always goes to finding replacements I thought maybe changing hubs or an adaptor is a difficult or unsafe option.

 

Any hubs or even axles that would be a "simple" swap are generally harder to find, and also leads to changing brakes and the chain goes on. It isn't usually found to be more economical or any easier than finding serviceable rims. That said, it can and has been done.
​​​​

 

I don’t know of any cheap fixes. Used 19.5s and 22.5s are still out there, but those of us that know what to look for and have the ability/time to do the searches are accepting that we have to travel, invest in gas and motel rooms, then pay increased prices as yards have become aware of the value these old bolt patterns hold. Then we know our money will be tied up waiting for a buyer willing to pay shipping on top of a fair return on our investment.

Hub adapters can cost as much as new wheels. New repop wheels are available if their different appearance isn’t too big a turn off. Custom wheel companies remain one of the best options, but at a cost.

Swapping hubs for a modern pattern hasn’t been widely found to be an easy fix. A complete rear axle swap works, but nothing I’ve seen cross references front hubs by specs and measurements. Complete front axle swaps aren’t an answer because modern vehicles have adopted internal steering architecture. Stu

 

Maybe this will help. I have 2 8.25 20 highway tread tires that you could use for your steering tires. Mount those on lock ring, and use the military tread for the 4 drw rears , mount those on lock ring type wheels? Let me know if you want to go that direction and I will try to help .

 

Wow this is a long thread but a good read with lots of good information. I’m just starting my restoration of a 1955 F600. I’m in Canada so not sure if the widow makers are as prevalent up here. Hopefully I’m lucky. I can’t help but wonder why no one is looking into a good weld shop that can accurately set up and weld the two halves of widow makers together into a one piece. With sufficient time and care in the setup and prep it seems like a reasonable solution to stay stock. Please say if I’m missing something in the thought process.

 

It is my presumption that simply welding the RH-5 rims together does not allow for the geometries for said tire to be installed. Manufactured one piece rims have different bead seats and drop centers the RH-5 do not.

 

It’s been suggested before, but is unworkable because the rim lips are too tall, and tire beads too rigid, to allow a tire to be squeezed over them. These tires are not like car type tires that can flex during their mounting. The below cross section helps show it.

I believe Canadian trucks are, unfortunately, just as exposed to widow makers as US supplied trucks. Stu

 

I've reached out to American Wheels, they *do* still list the 5x8 x 19.5, 20, and 20.5 as available... when I get a quote on them I'll report here.
I spoke with the IHC B6 guy in ABQ and he will let me know if anyone else inquiring might be willing to split the sale or let go of the rims themselves.

I'm not particularly inclined to drop another 3K or more on rims/tires before I sell this old girl, but it is good to have some options lined up for a potential buyer who will likely have their own ideas of which combination of options (including the rubber) fits their preferences.

Those tires/wheels (and dogs) do look good with your truck!

 

If I ever *do* get some modern aftermarket single-piece rims in my hands I'll do a careful comparison to my Firestones and share it here. The idea that they were built this way in the first place *because* they woulld be too hard to force the tire over seems pretty reasonable. Tho only variation I can think of is that tires have gotten more "flexible" since the 40s and might be installable over these "taller" rims or maybe the installation gear has gotten more powerful in some way. But my experience so far suggests that blunt force was used whenever possible "back in the day".

If American Wheels is engageable, they may already have the answer to this speculation ready to share with us. While *we* are the ones with the most acute demand for non-splits... all the vehicles delivered *with* single-piece rims of this scale will still be looking for modern replacements also?

 

Don't throw away your widowmakers. People that weld much better than me can take the center out and weld them into a new wheel.

 

Brian passed his 18” widow makers on to me for this reason. I’ve been gathering up 18” lock ring rims for a few years with use of the donor centers in mind. Stu

 

 

There was a post a few months back from a guy who welded up the holes of a set of new wheels and redrilled to fit his six hole truck that originally had WMs. He only posted the one time but I thought this would be as good as removing the centers of the WMs and welding them into new rims.