Here is a little story about eminent domain that will chill you, from the Wall Street Journal:

http://www.opinionjournal.com/la/?id=110011006

 

I didnt read all the pages, i just read 1-2 and 8 from here. This what i know so far. The Lakota got payed for the Black Hills from what my history teacher told us. They won't take the money cause they believe the Black Hills still belong to them. So right now they have millions of dallors sacked up in the bank.

As for Russel Means, I think hes all bark and no bite. I mean hasnt he been doing this kind of stuff since the Indian Rights Movement? I live only 50 miles from Pine Ridge so I hear alot of things that go on down there and it pretty nasty down there. They get decent Gov surpport nowadays from what i know. Free shoes, Nice school, and other ones. Most of that money they get from welfare checks is spent on booz. Also to add is that Pine Ridge is a Dry County. So they drive to a little town in NE which only 200 or so yards from the SD border and booz. If i remember right my cousin and I calculated that they buy 200+ 24 packs a day from this little town. If they removed booz from that whole place for a ten or so years they possible turn themselves around. Plus the way they live their life these days is their own doing. We did take away their land and put them where their at these days but the way they act is their own doing.

Just think about the South Dakotans that have to put up with crap everyday.

Sorry for going on. this is just my .02 worth

 

The Black Hills, considered sacred by the Sioux, were ceded to them for all eternity, in a treaty signed by the US Gov't and Sioux Chief Red Cloud in 1869.

When the US ARMY sent an expedition to survey the area (commanded by Lt. Col. [brevet General] George Armstrong Custer) in 1874, gold was discovered.

It wasn't long before the whole area was overrun with settlers, miners, trollops, land speculators...etc.

The Gov't then tried to buy the Black Hills back from the Sioux, they said: No Deal!

The Gov't then forced the Sioux to accept 2 CENTS PER ACRE for the Black Hills!

The Homestake Mine, in the town of Lead (leed), produced well over 2 BILLION DOLLARS worth of gold before the mine was closed just recently.

The Homestake Mine was so named by the Manuel Bros. When they struck a vein of gold, they sold the mine to George Hearst for $75,000.00 and used the "stake" to travel back home to Mexico.

George Hearst, later a US Senator, was the father of William Randolph Hearst, the famous newspaper tycoon.

 

The Sioux case has already been to the U.S. Supreme Court, back in 1980, where they won a cash settlement with interest, which they refused.
http://supreme.justia.com/us/448/371/case.html

 

After reading through everything up to this point:

1. I am thinking of 2 Johnny Cash songs - Man In Black and Ira Hayes

2. Why has no one mentioned the Amish way of life and how they achieved it?

3. What if the Lakota and Russians ARE thinking long-term, of Water Rights?

4. Find & Watch: "North Of 60" Canadian TV series & "Medicine River" a Canadian movie, for insight into Canadian First Nations

5. After what happened with New Orleans they could probably take back their land and not be noticed for at least a month.

6. Someone once said that if Quebec left Canada that the First Nations would take over Quebec and re-join Canada, after that Quebec has been awfully quiet...

7. I forget, my head is overloaded now.

 

Wait one minute here. Before you go on and on about things you cant understand you needed to study what happened at wounded knee to my people. I' am Lakota. This I can not help. No I'm not part of this movement. My father gave up his res. citizenship right before I was born. Try going living on a res. You say this is about thing thats happened way over 100 years ago. My friend have you been to Brule South Dakota? Its just the same now as it was back then.
What freebies does anybody want? You would fight for what somebody owes you. If your boss did'nt pay you I bet you would break doewn the door to the labor board.
So why now? Being a citizen to the res. is alot like being a citizen to mexico. The land touches but you dont have any American right{or at least legally}. With our goverment paying to police the Iracies, killing us w/ high fuel taxes which is raising the price of everything but our salaries. Our goverment is trying to avoid deporting the illegal immagrants in this country. So yea its about payday for some out standing debts this country owes.
Like I said I'm not part of it. My dog is'nt in this hunt. I made my decision when it was my time. Even though I never lived on the res. and I dont know that life I chose to be American, I chose to work 40+ hours aweek to finance a goverment that will work 40+ hours a wek to crap all over me. I chose to pay social secrity that when it comes to my time I will never see and people now that are retiring has to have a lawyer to get their own money back.
How dare you condeme a person for asking for what is theirs?

 

That's true.

First nations own so much land in Quebec that seperatist's would look awful stupid when all was said and done.

The Problem is they seem so Narrow-minded from all the media hype.

The Media causes more problems than it helps..

 

I've seen this type question a few times inthis thread. If its asked in the syntex that I think it is, then no reservations are not created by treaties. Reservation are in the literal form reserved parcel of land to a Nation ect. A treatie was an agreement between bodies of people usely for peace or a sice of fire. Nations where forced to stay on reservations. At least for the Dakotas. They had no choose it was either live here or die. Crazy Horse died cause he would not live on the Reservation. It had nothing to do with his part in the raid at the Little Big Horn.
My father left the res. In 1970. He moved to Miami Florida following a construction company. At this time he applied and received American citizenship and he got a SSI# and started paying taxes. When I was born in 71 he put me on the role' where I remained untell 1990 when I was turned 19 I removed myself. The reservation round about Govern themselfs as long as America agrees with how its done. But as soon as it does something America does'nt like they step in a say no no no. A state troop has no juristion on a res. neither does a marshall but a game warden does. A game warden can persue a suspect on to Indain land and investagate on Indain land.
Lets get updated, some people probally crossed the ice bridge but that not how Indains got here. They have found carbon dating in remains older than the ice bridge in the mounds here in Alabama alone.

 

Tell me one Native American{I hate that term} that personualy accused you of taken their land or said you owed them anything? I pretty sure you can count the times on one hand most likely finger. And that one did'nt know his hair on his head then from the patch around his bung hole.
They where forced on to res. It was either go or die. Have you every heard of the trial of tears? Whats the big deal here. Let these guys get this **** off their chest then you wont hear nothing for awhile. Face it nothing will jump off on this soil. Any off shore support it cut off so no help there. By themselfs their still no good. Look at Aflganstan. WE can put ships around this country and hit their compounds with missiles. Your sitting here complaining about somebody else complaining.
I agree we need to kill welfare. White, Black, Mexican, Japaniese, Koran, Indain, everybody. We need to stop letting people come here to live tax free. But dang freedom of speech is a God given right. Right there beside the freedom of worship.

 

It surprises me that this whole thread is concerned about land. It seems the land is as inportant today as it was yesterday. So I guess that might be fuel to this situation.
Na I dont think so. Why does every assume they have to leave the land? The settlers did,nt leave the land when they signed the decaration of Indapentence. Yea there was a war and I hope this doesnt take that road. All that I find out suggest that they just was to be done with America and have no American influences. Well I dont see this being possible.
As far as they having inports and exports it could happen but no America wont tax them cause they dont tax nobody but Americans remember. 1 thing I know is the most the money they get in Brule is from land the goverment has rented not from welfare. Althoughthere is alot of welfare going in there but alot of it is American citizens living on the res. All the drunks and trash you see on the reservations are'nt reservation citizens.
I kinda wonder if the folklore of the Phionex has any bearing on some of this stuff. Weither its why this idle complaining made big news cause somewhere in the back of someones mind it seems possible or if means or religise leaders might be using this folklore to spark a flame in a decomposed nation.

 

Everything starts with land. Want to build a house? Need land. Start a business? Need land. Raise a family? Need land. Drink water, eat food, hunt? Comes from land. Found a Nation? Need land.

I personally would like to see what this world of ours could build if EVERY nation on earth recalled their armies and elimanated debt between countries, just accept the fact every country owes every other country in a big convoluted circle that no one will ever see their money back.

It was said somewhere that every major power on Earth lasted approximately 200years, U.S. is 231yo? Time for Lakota to rule? Every great navy needs land support...look out Bush or Hilary.

 

hmmm...

"In 1961, the United States Internal Revenue Service announced that since the Amish refuse United States Social Security benefits and have a religious objection to insurance, they need not pay these taxes. In 1965, this policy was codified into law.[20] Self-employed individuals in certain sects do not pay into, nor receive benefits from, United States Social Security, nor do their similarly-exempt employees. Amish employees of non-exempt employers are taxed, but they do not apply for benefits. A provision of this law mandates that the sect provide for their elderly and disabled; one visible sign of the care Amish provide for the elderly are the smaller Grossdaadi Heiser or Daadiheiser ("grandfather house"), often built near the main dwelling. The Amish are not the only ones exempt from Social Security in the United States. Ministers, certain church employees, and Christian Science practitioners may qualify for exemption under a similar clause. The Amish pay other taxes the same as other American citizens."

Yes, it's from wiki: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amish

It seems to me that there is a lot of similarity between Amish and Lakota. A persecuted people with dwindling cultural history, there traditions turned into a tourist trade and there beliefs ridiculed. hmm...

also had a look through this site: http://www.religioustolerance.org/amish.htm

 

Yea land is inportant to a way of life. This I know. I make my living off of land. What I was refuring to is that land is the only picture that most in this thread seem to see. Its as if they can not conceive the idea that a group of people would want to be their own governement. They have to make it into something else.
I know of 4 religious practices that has been infringed on. My father would'nt let me "look at the sun" because it was outlawed. The Ghost dance was also outlawed. My cousin left the res. to live and was killed by a drunk driver. They did an auptopy on her even after our family demanded it not be done. The last rites can not be performed any more.
I guess if you have nothing else to do but set around untell the 1st of the month waiting on a check and getting drunk I reckon you have time to think about this stuff and stew over it. Lakota rule? Wont happen. The governement of this country has it's hooks so deep into this system you will never shake them free. Its not goingto be easy like it was to take over Irac. In our system cutting off the head doesnt kill the "beast". It just grows another one. That little head that you see giving the speeches is'nt the one calling the shots. He just appears to be in charge. You ever why we say "them" "they"? Big Brother is a hidden Board of people that is really calling the shots. I'm afraid it will be inpossible to behead that board or even find out its members. Just like the CIA destroying those tapes. What they going to do about. Put a escapegoat in prison? So!!!!!! Kill him?????? So!!!! Not like it'll be the 1st time. What ever was on them tapes they did'nt want anyone to know. WE have way to many agencies working in our Government. There is no way the "People" will ever gain control of their country? AIM doe'snt have a prayer. All that is left is to become your own country and try your best to survive as long as you can.
Look at Saudi Arabia. That country started out by accident. They have done good for themselves. Of course not much of a chance of that happening over here. There is a chance a body of people if on a piece of land that is fertile could grow its own food and resources for now on. If tree rotation is strictly in forced they could build a fine country w/out lossing all its replaceable resources. Might even export chicken, beef, grain, grain by-products. So far in the last 100 years or longer I can't think of anybody of this country waging war on it. Look at waco, or ruby ridge the government took that fight to those groups.
I can see a point to all this. The Lakotas say aight USA your not going to pay up. Your not goingto do what you said and we're tired of watching our people lay around destroying our way of life. So keep your debt we are no longer a part of your system. So now we can't hold you as a crutch anymore.
I'm reminded of the little Country of Estonia. It has been invaided by just about everbody around it but it's still its sole souvern. It doest inport or export much but it gets by. This could work here. I also wantto throw in right here that the land that the reservations are on is'nt anything special. Thats why at first they was moved around so much. The gov. thought they had put the people on waste land then turned out it had something they needed then pushed them off to another "dump". If I was the White House I would just give it to them. Tell 'em hell your on your own now.

 

In the late 1880's, a Piute Indian living in NV by the name of Jack Wilson had a vision.

Wear a special shirt, and dance in a circle while chanting. This "Ghost Dance" was supposed to rid the country of the white man, and bring back all the buffalo.
The shirts were, so Wilson claimed, "bulletproof."

The Ghost Dance led directly to the killing of Chief Sitting Bull..by Tribal Police, and brought about the "battle" at Wounded Knee.

Troops of the 7th Cavalry surrounded Sioux Chief Big Foot and his group of mostly women and children while they were camped there.

The Sioux were told to give up their weapons, a shot rang out, and all of the Sioux were massacred.

 

Thanks but I know my peoples history. I said I was an American I did'nt say I was lost to my roots.
If you dont understand my point. Its plainly that everything does'nt boil down to land and who stole it or bought it and nobody cares who sold it. All you ever hear is white took the Indain's land. Na the Indains allowed their culture to be stole. Indains where force to become english speaking Christians, to wear paints and seat in a chair at a table to eat their meals. I know your sitting there say so what. Maybe even thinking "I had nothing to do with it". The point? Today our goverment does'nt force immogrants to learn english or the standard system of measure. I firmly believe if you come to America to live it should be a law you have to speak english and know what a damn inch is.
Get over the damn land the Indains did a couple hundred years ago.