The only way that we could count the engines sold in other markets is if they actually had Dodge and/or Ford parts on them, and they clearly don't, because these engines have to meet different requirements in the LD truck market that they don't have to adhere to in the medium duty market, so engines sold in other markets are completely and totally 100% irrelevant.
If you are going to judge reliability on what the engines they make for semis do, then we should base the 6.0 on the longevity of Ford engines, because if you're going to relate Cummins engines in semis to the ones in Dodges, then we can relate a 300 I6 to the 6.0...Doesn't work, does it? Neither does comparing the engine in the Ram to the ones in semis, they're not even comparable, not even the same thought behind designing them, so again, they're completely irrelevant.

If it was a dud, then it wouldn't be the best selling diesel ld pickup in the market, and Ford would have already replaced it. Cummins is clearly the only reason Dodge sells any trucks, and with their repeat buyer rate, they're not exactly roping the customers back in, so the Cummins needs to start doing something more than they are doing, because the truck with the PSD still tows more, hauls more, and gets comparable mileage.
Now, if it was a "dud", they'd already have a new engine in it's place, but emissions restrictions are going to be tighter in 2007, and Ford is going to use a completely new diesel to meet these requirements, rather than revamping something they were already using. The 7.3 wasn't a dud, and they replaced it, so where did you read that Ford had decided that the 6.0 was a dud?

 

So the Cummins had a success rate of 196%? How is it twice as relaible as 98%?

 

According to Fordvehicles.com the PSD in 2005 has 325HP and 570Ft lbs and according to dodge.com the CTD has 325 horsepower and 610 pounds-feet of torque. I realise the two figures are close, but even still I am not seeing how Ford will tow more.

 

The 05 f series is rated with more capacity.

FL Ive told you before. Just because 97%, recently downgraded, of the trucks are still on the road doesnt mean its the original engine. Or that the engine is reliable in the least. The average person would have 110k-165k miles on the original psd. Thats not a lot of miles in the world of diesels. If I can run a gas engine to 300k I expect 500k from my diesel.

The 6.0 is responsible for costing ford quite a bit of market share. I wouldnt go braggin on that engine too loud.

 

That 98% is merely how many are still registered. It says little about reliability, considering that Dodge and GM probably have a similar figure. Nobody has yet proven otherwise. Also, reliability is much more involved than simply the life expectancy of the motor.

Frankly, this figure is pointless to anyone who thinks about it. How many vehicles that are 10 years old or less are parked due to mechanical problems. Most newer vehicles are fixed and kept on the road even with major mechanical problems. Almost all newer vehicles that are "parked" vehicles are that way because they were wrecked.

With that in mind, possibly Dodge drivers do not need to worry about engine troubles. As a result, they do not drive like a bunch of pansys, and wreck more often.

 

But most of that market share has jumped to GM rather than Dodge. IMO I tend to agree with you about the 'C' being the most reliable JD Powers seems to also agree. But in order for the Dodge to gain a considerable amount of market share they need to put a 5 speed auto behind that thing.

Just my .02

 

That's what I'd say, keep the cummins rowing through the gears(5-6spd auto) to keep the sweet spot always in the right spot. Also, I'm trying to keep in mind that this isn't about the old 12 valve Cummins where you can make the rpm go higher than most new diesels. That may be why a 6 litre "feels" faster, it's kept in that higher rpm hp range.

For some reason the Dodges ('94-02)do go thru the ball joints, track bar and drag link a little too often. On that note, the '03 & up have been updated with beefier steering joints.

I'm not supporting buying a Dodge here, just drive a truck you enjoy driving. Some day I will.

 

Just don't feel like you can't support Dodge/Cummins in an open forum. I'm sure you have more to say, and you shouldn't feel like you can't. You would Not be a Troll if you did support Dodge in a Ford vs. Competition Forum. People here are more grown up than that.

 

The purpose of this forum is to make intelligent comparisons of other makes against Ford. They do not have to be in favor of Ford but they must be reasonable in any matter or direction. THAT is what we do here, we all need to remember this is a Ford site so many will always side with a Ford .

 

Id say we have a nice forum here. I think Im going to go over on the Dodge truck forum and start a thread on how Fords superior to Dodge. How powerstroke does itright.Man those guys over there are not near as nice as over here. Theyll let you know how they feel and its not good. Despite all the negative puiblicity surrounding the 6.0 and the intense diesel competition Ford still owns the diesel market in trucks. I know off one guy that bought a Dodge that had a superduty 7.3 before. I asked him how the truck is doing. He said its alright. He really misses his superduty though. He said its just so much better then the Dodge in many ways. He is seriously thinking about getting a superduty again. Several other friends of mine have traded there 7.3 in and got the new 6.0. We all know that Ford has the better truck overall.Yeh we all know the 6.0 has had some problems but Ford has the most loyal truck people out there. On the superduty side I think the retention rate is 90%.

 

I will commend this forum. they "generally" accept the reasonable. Even if they don't side with it. If you do say anything about ford or gm on a dodge site, they will rip it down to nada. I guess in the diesel atleast. The same is true about ford in a gm site. We generally rip on Ford hard. Cummins gets the most respect in all diesel forums. Each manufacture has had spots where they are humbled. Each has their braging rights. I mean when you look reasonably at the manufactures, the F150 is a tough truck to beat in that class I think although the gm holds a high mark in that area also. The auto tranny with a diesel I think currently goes to gm. If you want a diesel with a stick, get the cummins.

Fords PSD i feel has left a lot to be desired in reliability, and gm has had the piston slap and dodge's drive train I still think is rotten. They all have the + & - s and something no one ever wants to tell you. They all want to think their manufacture has the best in everything, which isn't true.

Right now I think the least of the problems is the piston slap issue of gm that occures in the gas motors. Using oil in the 8.1 seems to be nit picky. We all know it happens but this is my .02

 

Do you have gms dmax sales figures?

Cummins sales are up 30%. Those sales are coming from somewhere. Last year was the best year they have ever had. According to the limited information I was able to find. Cummins was only 40k units behind ford. Far cry from the 200k units they used to be behind.

 

You are wrong about the Dodge forums. I belong to two of them. (dodgetalk, and allpar) both of which are extremely tame, and almost 100% free of brand bashing. I don't see near as much brand bashing on the two Dodge forums as I do here. Thats not a bash against FTE. Heck FTE is the first forum I come to before heading over to the others. There is so much good discussion, and good debate here. Nothing wrong with that. But to say the guys at the Dodge forums arn't as nice as the guys here isn't fair. Unless you are a member at one, and are there frequently (like me) you sgouldn't say things like that.

Back to the matter at hand.

We all know that Ford has the better overall truck? How can you prove that? Is that even proveable, Or just opinion? I think its just opinion. If you said Ford has an overall more capable truck, that would work. But which is "better" than the other is opinion. People think the Dodge is better because of the Cummins. Some think the SD is better because of the comfort, and ride. Its all what you prefer. When speaking of todays trucks, one is not better, or superior to another. They are all equaly good.

Just my 0.2.


Best as always.

 

I don't think any one of them is so much better than the others in any "general" senses. Body metal, frames, rears, seats, radios, glass, overall structure integrity, etc. Each has it's own outstanding "non general" attributes. Ford and GM can say this about auto trannies, and gas motors. Dodge can definately claim the Cummins diesel as its main trump card, and GM also to a lesser extent with the duramax. I dint want a diesel but if I did, it woulda been a Dodge with 6speed. Notice I said "Dodge", I dont think their truck is any better or worse than the others in any general senses.

 

Well its nice to thinks Dodge is on equal footing with Ford. Have you ever owned a superduty. I do. And I drove a friends Dodge and believe me there is no comparison. Without Cummins Dodge wouldnt sell one HD truck. People buy the truck for the cummins. Thats it. Like I said the superduty is the best truck on the road today. Bar none. I tell everybody who has a Dodge.or Chevy Get a real truck. A Ford. End of discussion. If you guys ever own a superduty believe me Dodge and Chevy cant compete. 90% of superduty owners get another one. Hey it tells me people out there no nothing else can match it. Ford blew away the competition 5 years ago with the superduty and nothing comes close to it. Now with the new model year it trounces the competition. Why fool with junk get a Ford.