TOOOOOOOUUUUUUCCCCCCCHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!DDDDDDOOOOOW WWWWNNNN!!!!!!!!!!!

GGGGGGOOOOOO!!!!!!!! 66666666xxxxxxx99999999!!!!!!!!

Simply, it’s running well on manifold vacuum. I replaced the Standard Ignition pickup for the NAPA unit. My first clue we were onto something is when the engine immediately started and initial timing was not thrown way advanced from my initial set point of 12*. I set initial at 16* and encountered hot-start issues so set it down incrementally until those issues went away. While doing that I ran some ignition curves. When I was done I ended with:
875 RPM idle, manifold vacuum
Initial (vac advance plugged) 12*
1200 RPM 24*
1800 RPM 28*
2400 RPM 32*
3000 RPM 36*

I’m satisfied with this for now.

So all that’s left do do at this point is install the PCV system you shared, and clean and tidy the engine compartment. That is, until the freakin’ rain stops long enough for some test runs and setting the vacuum advance. Hopefully THAT won’t turn into another data-burning long thread, lol!

The other thing I want to do is put together a summary of everything that I have learned and discovered since post #1 nearly 4-1/2 months ago. The purpose of which is to hopefully help someone, someday, somewhere avoid a fraction of the time and expense I’ve experienced chasing what turned out to be in the end, pretty basic problems!

 

(Quote)......TOOOOOOOUUUUUUCCCCCCCHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!DDDDDDOOOOOW WWWWNNNN!!!!!!!!!!!

GGGGGGOOOOOO!!!!!!!! 66666666xxxxxxx99999999!!!!!!!!
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >

So after ALL this when you said the above, his handle is "6x8" not 6x9. Extremely interesting read. So good that the last bag of popcorn went cold and stale because I was reading so intently and I forgot to continue eating it.

Look at the extensive help from someone (6x8) on a vehicle that was not a F series and you posted just as a happen chance for an answer. One of the many things I like about the forum. Kudos to both of you for sticking with this to the end. (Hopefully the end) hope I didn't jinx it.

 

Here he is, The Main Man : https://giphy.com/gifs/ussoccer-danc...OpJRJMhRPGqUsE

 

I was so excited I elevated 6x8 to 6x9, lol! Wonder how many other times I’ve done that. 🙄

I couldn’t agree with you more. This community forum welcomed a non-native species Ranchero into the space. Every interaction I’ve had in both this and the Super Duty section has been nothing but positive.

There were a number of contributors with helpful suggestions pointing me where to go, what to look for, and how to do it if needed. At the great risk of leaving someone out I’d like to recognize both redroad and 77 HOS for their interest and help early on.

The person who truly stands out and to whom I owe a debt of gratitiude is, of course, 6x8. If not for his alternate witty encouragement and a kick in the a$$ when needed, I would have given up way before now and had the Ranchero worked on by someone else (for the 1st time for as long as I can remember). Instead, with his help and guidance the problem was not only licked, but I learned a ton that will be with me for the rest of my days; practical knowledge that I will put to use. It wasn’t cheap in terms of time or money but as 6x8 said somewhere in the bowels of this thread, education seldom is (paraphrased).

As a token of my appreciation I will be making a contribution to this site in 6x8’s name, giving him Gold Membership privileges. FF$! 😂

 

Chillbumps I still have missed alot I need to read back thru bit so so so glad this is fixed. The past few weeks I'm lucky to have a few mins every few days to check FTE, when I did there was one thing I was looking for every time and it was a conclusion to this thread.. I'm still not sure what the answer was ill have to go back thru to catch up........but I know this much.......

Coach 6x8 is the man!!!!!!!!!

Couldnt ask for ant more detailed or dedication with his assistsnce he provides. Way above and beyond. Coach 6x8 has too helped me thru a learning curve and issue with a HEI dizzy. Not as complicated as yours but still there to help anyway possible. 6x8 is a good friend and really cares, not just one of those guys that wants to talk about himself or how much he knows.

6 x 8 Thank you!!!! For being 6x8 III see Ya in my thread soon as I can get back to it.....still got a question I been holding for months.

Goseahawks......i hope that rain stops soon and you can grin ear to ear driving around trouble free now

 

This is the first thing I saw yesterday, and to say it made my day is an understatement. Fantastic news !

My apologies to NAPA for suggesting that their pickup coil would fail, before you even tested it.

My apologies to Go Seahawks Winning Team! for going all negative towards the end.

I agree with you for not buying an Echlin pickup when it looks exactly the same as the NAPA, and who's to say that a NAPA pickup wasn't put in the Echlin box.

I had actually started to think that in 2021 it is impossible to get a good quality pickup.

I had also started to think that you might never be able to get 10L limiters.

It's a huuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuge relief to see that the NAPA pickup works.

Your solid state ignition works, and it works just as well as an HEI or MSD combo would.

I prefer HEI simply because parts are easily available and a lot of nasty wiring gets removed from the engine bay. Purely cosmetic !

While everything is fresh in your head, make a list of the part numbers you used for future reference, and put your wiring diagram somewhere safe.

I have the same valve covers as you. The PCV valve uses a small ID hole, whereas the PCV breather side uses a larger ID hole.

I forgot to mention that the nipple on the breather needs to be the same OD as the fitting on the lower air filter casing. Hmm, bit late now.

Make a note to ensure it is clean with each service that you do.

Your timing curve numbers are incredibly linear. Nice !

I'd expect you to get pinging at W.O.T., but if your driving style is mainly cruising, you should be ok. (Total all in +/- 42* at +/- 3,800rpms)

Set your idle rpms to 800, and advance your vacuum advance as far as you can without partial throttle pinging.

I'm not sure if you'll feel the pep you were after, but you should feel everything is smoother, and maybe discreetly 'peppier'.

I experienced hot start issues once, from time to time, but it became a thing of the past when I rebuilt the ''remanufactured'' starter motor with quality parts. FWIW

Rancheros are the little brother version of the F series trucks, so of course you'll be treated as family in here in the FTE world.

Problems are always pretty basic when we have the knowledge, but until we have the knowledge they are impossible to deal with. (We all know that. LOL)

LOL, many thanks for the Gold Membership privileges, and FFS stop swearing.

@ 77 HOS, I was beginning to think that I'd totally f$$ked up your thread. Glad to hear that I didn't.

LMAO @ the cold and stale popcorn.

In 2 hours from now Mrs 6 by 9 and I are off for a few days to enjoy room service. She's chuffed with her promotion. LOL

Laterz.

 

I had 2 NAPA/Echlin pick up coils fail right out of the box.

 

That doesn’t give me a lot of reassurance of long-term reliability. 🙁. Time will tell. It’s almost worth buying a spare, trial fitting it to be certain it works, then stuffing it in the glovebox.

 

The beginning of this thread was 4 months and 339 posts ago. A lot has transpired in the interim with different problems (real, imagined and self-caused) along the way. Here I’ll provide a recap with the intent of helping someone avoid some headaches and unnecessary expense.

Post #1 describes two problems that appeared simultaneously: 1) a backfire at around 2,000 RPM, and 2) the engine will not run with vacuum advance connected. I’ve always had a healthy skepticism for coincidence. Since both problems appeared at the same time I ‘assumed’ without any other consideration that the problems were connected by a single cause.

As it turns out, they were not. This was the first coincidence. The backfire was caused by bad HT leads while the vac advance issue was caused by a bad distributor pickup.

It took me 4 pickups while observing their electrical and mechanical behavior when both functioning and non-functioning to confidently say: a bad pickup is THE cause for an engine to misfire and/or die when vac advance is connected if it is running well while disconnected.

There were things (coincidences) along the way that led to disguising the true cause before finally figuring this out once and for all.

Consider the following:
1) the very first time I tried starting the engine after replacing dizzy centrifugal springs, the reluctor caught the pickup wires and torn them up. I had somehow reinstalled the original pickup (that had been working fine for years) incorrectly. If that hadn’t happened I wouldn’t have had the vac advance problem caused by its defective replacement and this thread wouldn’t have been started.
2) I pinned the blame on the dizzy, not the pickup. I ordered and received an Autolite rebuilt exchange from Rock Auto. A condition of receiving the core credit was their receiving the used core with all electrical components attached. The female electrical plug on my pickup had been cut off to facilitate a hard-wired installation. To circumvent a reason to not receive the core credit, I exchanged pickups before sending the old dizzy back, i.e, the old dizzy was returned with the pickup that came with the new one. If I had kept the new pickup that had come with the new distributor that may have been the end of things assuming the new pickup worked. Another coincidence to keep things going.
3) Frequently if not always, when I replaced stators I set rough initial timing by lining up the the reluctor arm for cylinder #1 with the center of the coil on the pickup, while the timing pointer was lined up with 12* advanced on the harmonic balancer. From the very beginning I was struck by how that setting changed when the engine was started. I saw as high as 55* advanced at idle after setting the rough initial at 12* as described. I learned that the big advance swing from the rough initial was sign of a bad pickup. This was confirmed twice. All the bad pickups had resistance within tolerance. i.e., tested good but were not. Had I known either of these things before the thread it would not have been started.
4) I learned that all components of an electrical system must be connected for accurate voltage readings. No realizing or understanding that cost a lot of time while chasing an elusive 6v to the coil when it was there the whole time. That said, that shot in my own foot led to a much deeper understanding of this ignition system specifically and ignition systems in general.

When all is said and done I have a robust 1974 solid state ignition system: new distributor, ignition control module, coil, HT leads and plugs. It turns out the dizzy and ICM were unnecessary. The old coil was functioning but had a good amount of corrosion going on in the socket so needed to be replaced in any event.

The parts I used were:
Autolite rebuilt distributor D4008
NAPA ignition control module TP35
Standard Ignition coil FD 471 (points style, not FD 476 electronic style)
NAPA pickup MP700SB

Pickups I purchased that were bad out of the box were:
Standard Ignition LX204 (2 of 2),
and Master Pro 2-6187.

So that’s it. The end to a long but successful thread. If anyone comes across this and it helps you with a problem, add a line, it would be great to know. Or if there’s a question I can try to help answer, ask away.

See ya ‘round!