E brake with disc conversion?
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Lead Driver
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 7,188
Likes: 384
From: Near Los Angeles
those calipers are WAY too complicated for my liking... no wonder they fail so often...
what you were saying about the way the calipers are mounted is basically that one is at like 9 o clock facing the wheel, and the other is also at 9 facing the wheel? so one points towards the front and the other towards the rear, and the bleeder ends up on the bottom if you mount them at the same angle? if thats the case, couldn't you just you two of the same side and have the bleeders end up on the correct end?
what you were saying about the way the calipers are mounted is basically that one is at like 9 o clock facing the wheel, and the other is also at 9 facing the wheel? so one points towards the front and the other towards the rear, and the bleeder ends up on the bottom if you mount them at the same angle? if thats the case, couldn't you just you two of the same side and have the bleeders end up on the correct end?
The ebrake cable arm is on a threaded shaft. Each is threaded a different direction. If you used two rights or two lefts, one would be turning the wrong way. There's nothing wrong with mounting one in front and one behind the wheel. When Caddy did it, everyone prob. thought it innovative. Now it just looks wrong because of style, popularity. When you lock your brakes to avoid the nuns, no one will know!!
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Lead Driver
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 7,188
Likes: 384
From: Near Los Angeles
I'm probably boring you guys to death here, but if anyone is bothering to read this, I leaned two interesting things today.
1.) It is impossible to get a replacement seal for the ebrake assembly. The computers at the Caddy dealer show that entire assembly as a one piece 'spring'.
2.) If you buy a rebuilt unit, there is no way of knowing whether they replaced that seal. THAT COULD BE WHY SO MANY OF THESE STINKING CALIPERS FAIL. THAT SEAL IS OBSOLETE!!!!!!
1.) It is impossible to get a replacement seal for the ebrake assembly. The computers at the Caddy dealer show that entire assembly as a one piece 'spring'.
2.) If you buy a rebuilt unit, there is no way of knowing whether they replaced that seal. THAT COULD BE WHY SO MANY OF THESE STINKING CALIPERS FAIL. THAT SEAL IS OBSOLETE!!!!!!
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Lead Driver
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 7,188
Likes: 384
From: Near Los Angeles
I'm considering scrapping the project. Further research has shown that the e cables will work if you use bronco cables, welding on 3" plate to oem ebrake junction plate. Or mount both cals on the same side....
I'm thinking I'd rather run over the nuns, lol.
I'm thinking I'd rather run over the nuns, lol.
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Lead Driver
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 7,188
Likes: 384
From: Near Los Angeles
Here is some important maintenance information about the rear Cadillac Calipers:
If you are using Cadillac ElDorado/Seville rear calipers there are some important things you should know. One of the biggest advantages of a disc brake system is the fool proof self adjuster. Not so with this rear GM system. The rear calipers adjust off the parking brake. The parking brake is incorporated into the caliper. You must set the parking brake every time you park the car. The rear caliper pitons utilize a one way clutch inside the caliper piston. When the parking brake is applied the clutch senses when there is .030" or more clearance between the friction material and the rotor on the inboard side. When there is more than .030" the clutch turns inside the piston adjusting it out keeping the rear brakes adjusted. If you do not set your parking brake every time you will start to lose brake pedal (low and spongy) and the adjuster mechanism will not work any longer. Also: never use rebuilt calipers on the rear because the rebuilt units use the old pistons and the pistons were the reason the caliper failed in the first place.
If you are using Cadillac ElDorado/Seville rear calipers there are some important things you should know. One of the biggest advantages of a disc brake system is the fool proof self adjuster. Not so with this rear GM system. The rear calipers adjust off the parking brake. The parking brake is incorporated into the caliper. You must set the parking brake every time you park the car. The rear caliper pitons utilize a one way clutch inside the caliper piston. When the parking brake is applied the clutch senses when there is .030" or more clearance between the friction material and the rotor on the inboard side. When there is more than .030" the clutch turns inside the piston adjusting it out keeping the rear brakes adjusted. If you do not set your parking brake every time you will start to lose brake pedal (low and spongy) and the adjuster mechanism will not work any longer. Also: never use rebuilt calipers on the rear because the rebuilt units use the old pistons and the pistons were the reason the caliper failed in the first place.
Lead Driver
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 6,993
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From: Costa Mesa, CA
F-205 restorer - you are putting a lot of time and effort into clarifying the el dorado/seville brakes which will be good for people researching using these things later - thanks.
On a side note for those of us who are still looking at other options, my post before seemed to go un-noticed so I'm bringing it back up. I've been meaning to look into a driveline break but haven't had the free time to start yet. Are they even worth looking into for this type deal?
On a side note for those of us who are still looking at other options, my post before seemed to go un-noticed so I'm bringing it back up. I've been meaning to look into a driveline break but haven't had the free time to start yet. Are they even worth looking into for this type deal?
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Lead Driver
Joined: Mar 2008
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From: Near Los Angeles
TSM sells Caddy Calipers NEW. Not rebuilt. And that means that someone has access to those new seals. Stinking dogs. And they cost $300 a pair, loaded. I guess that is not bad when you consider that rebuilt from A. zone is almost $100 per, unloaded, if you pay the core, and that is without the spring or ebrak bracket!!
TSM also sells the pinion ebrakes. They have photos. My guess is they are major mulah.
TSM also sells the pinion ebrakes. They have photos. My guess is they are major mulah.
Elder User
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 927
Likes: 3
From: Lake Point, Utah
I've thought about the driveline E Brakes before...but my only concern was if you lost a driveline...no way to use Trans (Assuming stick) to hold truck or the E-Brake due to it being only on Drive line...but still a good Idea..and probably fairly easy to do...I love the ones on My Mom's 2000 Explorer...Mini Drums inside the rotor hat...dual purpose and works great!
Lead Driver
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 6,993
Likes: 15
From: Costa Mesa, CA
It's all about the divorced setup Dave - I'd run it on the intermittent driveshaft on the crew.
Now the supercab is a different story, but it will have an auto with a gate shifter so I can leave it in park or chock the tire if that's a must.
Now the supercab is a different story, but it will have an auto with a gate shifter so I can leave it in park or chock the tire if that's a must.
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Lead Driver
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 7,188
Likes: 384
From: Near Los Angeles
vat tu du?
So now I have a set of partially rebuilt calipers. The ebrake seal looks perfect and accepts no pressure, so it may be good.
Does anyone know of a company who specializes in seals?
or from what company TSM gets it NEW caddy calipers?
Does anyone know of a company who specializes in seals?
or from what company TSM gets it NEW caddy calipers?
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Lead Driver
Joined: Mar 2008
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From: Near Los Angeles
I have found a Company who manufactures seals. I am going to visit them with the seals I need, taking the parts they go in with me, and hopefully, will be able to get what I need there.
Reusing a 33 year-old seal just didn't sit right with me. Every time I stomped on the brakes it would have come to mind.
Nor could I bring myself to cut loose with $330 for a set of new calipers from TSM. I love to save money, and if it takes a bit of running around to do it, so be it.
Reusing a 33 year-old seal just didn't sit right with me. Every time I stomped on the brakes it would have come to mind.
Nor could I bring myself to cut loose with $330 for a set of new calipers from TSM. I love to save money, and if it takes a bit of running around to do it, so be it.
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Lead Driver
Joined: Mar 2008
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From: Near Los Angeles
Part of doing this project was to find quality "riveted" pads for the rear, like I have in the front.
Holy crapola! I never knew it would take an act of congress to get riveted pads!! When I pulled the calipers from the j.yard, I took the pads with me since they looked new, and were riveted. But they wanted $2.00 apiece for them, and I thought that was too much for used pads. Now it has taken me about 6 hours of searching just to find riveted pads for the Caddy calipers.
JC Whitney!!! Believe it or not. 1JA 101153. It is Raybestos part #SGD 122. $25 to my door!! ...the pot of gold.
Holy crapola! I never knew it would take an act of congress to get riveted pads!! When I pulled the calipers from the j.yard, I took the pads with me since they looked new, and were riveted. But they wanted $2.00 apiece for them, and I thought that was too much for used pads. Now it has taken me about 6 hours of searching just to find riveted pads for the Caddy calipers.
JC Whitney!!! Believe it or not. 1JA 101153. It is Raybestos part #SGD 122. $25 to my door!! ...the pot of gold.
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Lead Driver
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 7,188
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From: Near Los Angeles
JC whitney took too long to deliver, so I went with the front pads for the same year caddy from Summit. Even the Kevlar and Ceramic pads were bonded, not riveted, so I got the Stainless Steel pads. They are the same part number for the rears, but for some reason they do not sell the rears...probably because they are the same. I will find out.
I also found the ebrake seals that do not come with any of the rebuild kits. I had to go to a special place that makes nothing but seals. So I should have the parts all rounded up soon, and will be posting photos of the swap.
For the brackets, Greatlakes said I only had to tell them if the bolt pattern on the backing plate is square or rectangular. I know the ebrake cables will be a challenge, but I will cross that bridge when I come to it. I will post all the progress in photos.
I also found the ebrake seals that do not come with any of the rebuild kits. I had to go to a special place that makes nothing but seals. So I should have the parts all rounded up soon, and will be posting photos of the swap.
For the brackets, Greatlakes said I only had to tell them if the bolt pattern on the backing plate is square or rectangular. I know the ebrake cables will be a challenge, but I will cross that bridge when I come to it. I will post all the progress in photos.
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Lead Driver
Joined: Mar 2008
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From: Near Los Angeles
Ebrake mechanism seal. Eureka!
After driving all over S. California looking for the stinking seal for the Caddy el dorado calipers, that none of the kits give you, which sits on the ebrake mechanism, I finally found it. A company called ABS Power Brake, in Orange, CA., has them. They have a website by the same name, and you can order them online. I paid $5.00 ea., and picked up a 10 psi residual valve for $15.00. Their telephone # is 714-771-6549.
Now I can reassemble the calipers and move forward with the conversion. I'm glad I did not reuse the seals, because I could really feel the difference with the new ones. Thirty years in brake fluid will soften things a bit....
One more bit of info: Do you know how difficult it is to find riveted disc pads? JC whitney has them $25 to my door, but it takes about 14 days!! Checked Summit. They had them. Photo showed they were riveted. Called the tech department. "Yep, they're riveted." They arrive, and they're bonded!!
Since they're going on the rear of a 1 ton, I thought riveted would be wise. What a hassle. I'm starting to think the $300 for new loaded calipers from TSM would have been cheap.
Now I can reassemble the calipers and move forward with the conversion. I'm glad I did not reuse the seals, because I could really feel the difference with the new ones. Thirty years in brake fluid will soften things a bit....
One more bit of info: Do you know how difficult it is to find riveted disc pads? JC whitney has them $25 to my door, but it takes about 14 days!! Checked Summit. They had them. Photo showed they were riveted. Called the tech department. "Yep, they're riveted." They arrive, and they're bonded!!
Since they're going on the rear of a 1 ton, I thought riveted would be wise. What a hassle. I'm starting to think the $300 for new loaded calipers from TSM would have been cheap.
