_______________________

I believe you need to check the parts carefully ,

The Dark Blue CMP does replace the Gray CMP.

The Gray CMP is 1876735C91,
the Dark Blue CMP is 1876736C91 (Ford part # DU-87 F4TZ-12K073-C),
18767 is the current Ford/International Routing numbers for the 7.3L/T444E,
the 35C91 is the problematic Gray Unit and the 36C91 in the newer Blue sensor with Tinned Pins.

The Dark Blue sensor has a newer sensor inside than the gray unit and it also has the Tinned Pins on the contacts. The Gray Unit has the problematic Fake Gold Plated pins. The Dark Blue Sensor (36C91) does supersede the Gray (35C91), the numbers are etched right in the parts.

Any Powerstroke Engine that has a CMP in it will work with the Dark Blue CMP. The Dark Blue CMP is not just for 1994 to 1996 Engines. I think you need to study the CMP parts first before throwing false info out there.

The Gray sensors should not be used anymore, the Dark Blue is so much better and readily available.

I threw away in the trash the last 6 Gray CMP's I had left over, I would not allow anyone to put them in a truck that was a friend of mine.

 

That's kind of strong bro.

It's not false info if Ed punches those numbers in his parts computer and the database tells him the numbers are still good and haven't been superceded.

Stewart

 

I mean no disrespect,

That old part number got "retired" when they made the Recall Gray unit.
Then when they made the new Blue Unit they just grabbed that old number and re-used it again.
Talk about confusing. Even the Parts people at the Ford Dealerships will tell you the part number
is for a 1994-1996, sometimes. Then there are Volume Ford Dealers in S Florida and Texas that
sell 1000s of diesels and they know the Blue is the new unit, regardless what the part number is.

Over at International Parts they only go by the Part Number that's stamped into the unit.
And the newest one available is the 1876736C91 for any Year 7.3L T444E.

I bought every CMP manufactured for the 7.3L and I'm learning more each day about them.

When I compared the new Blue International CMP to the Form Blue CMP, they are exactly the same
except Ford has a machine that will etch a control set of numbers at the top plug area.

They both have very close numbers in the performance curve during my test.

The EGT's were 150 to 200 degrees lower using a 80HP program.

When I finish my report I will tell you what issue it will be printed in.

Best,
Russ

 

Russ,

You seem to know a lot about the Camshaft Position Sensors. Since you are comparatively new here at FTE, can you fill us in on your qualifications to assess the relative quality of different CPS's, and their application suitability?

You used the term "fake gold plating". What leads you to say this? I always believed that gold-on-gold was as reliable as one can get when it comes to connector surfaces.

Are you an engineer for an electronics company that has developed CPS's, or a technical writer? In what publication will you be publishing your report? What is the report's subject? CPS timing theory is something I would be interested in knowing more about. Since you posted a basic timing diagram above, would you also post a complete one for the 7.3? I'm interested in how 48 level tranasitions translates into our "timing".

Pop

 

I didn't take it that way. I was just saying for you to tell a 20+ year (I think it's been over 20 years for Ed...lol) Ford parts guy that he's giving out false info, is kind of presumptuous. Kind of a strong accusation is all.

And you wonder why Ed posted that info? If, as you've asserted, the Ford computers are giving the parts guys the wrong info, why would you accuse Ed of giving false info when all he's done is pass along the info the computer shows?

I dunno. Maybe in hindsight you didn't wanna use the term "false info", but rather, "incorrect info" seeing as how you must be privy to the info Ed's retrieving from his computer.

How are you doing your testing? What equipment are you using?

Stewart

 

I have both part numbers in stock and even ordered the International part number just so I could compare them.

the parts catalog list both part numbers and both are valid.

I've called International on both part numbers a few times on this issue and ask if them if they had a new updated number and they said there was not, you can order either the 94-96 1876736C91 dark blue or the 97-03 1876735C91 white (old number 1825899C93 black)


been doing this since 1982, and even doing it this long I learn new stuff everyday and a bunch of good stuff from members here on FTE. I never would have know you could use the 94-96 for the 97-03 had I not read it here. I just don't need members buying parts from other dealers (non sponsors). the info I have given is correct per Ford motor company and my local International dealer.

I'm not going to dispute your research or findings on the compatibly of the sensors, only thing I will say is the part numbers are still valid and one does not replace the other. At least not yet as far as Ford Motor Co is concerned.


<a href="http://photobucket.com" target="_blank"><img src="http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f229/ramfan92220/P1010055.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a>

 

Something's amiss here. Since vref for these PCM's is a highly-regulated +5VDC, how can these be 12 volt pulses?
Why would we want to go somewhere like White Bear Lake, when we've got "OEM, Baby" Ed right here?

OEM, baby!

Hmmmm, wonder why?

Since you've mentioned this person multiple times, I gotta' tell you that you're stepping close to a line that you don't want to cross if your purpose here is to steer parts sales there. We're kinda' a loyal bunch.....

We DO welcome your scientific input, but we're a little suspicious when it's accompanied by repeated sales information.

Anyway, back to the vref and 12 volt CPS pulses, and 48 level transitions keeping track of eight injection events. How does that all work?

Pop

 

I agree with Marv.

 

Again,

No disrespect to anyone,

I know a lot about this problem because I have studied it for over 2 months.

I really don't care who sells parts or where you buy a 25.00 part from.
Ed, I hope you become wealthy from selling parts, sincerely.
I really don't care about the Ford Numbering issue, the problem is way deeper than that.

Both Ford & International have decided to go with the lower cost sensor, and that's one of the main problems.

I have several 7.3L trucks that tow my collector cars across the country,
and a 7.3L Custom Van that is my Mobile Living Room.

What I am telling you is the current Ford/IH sensors have a new sensor inside and it also went back to the tinned pins. It's an improvement.

I am using Autoenginuity Software and another program that Jody uses to get my benchmarks.

I have purchased every CMP/CPS made for the 7.3L engine and have tested them all. I have even talked to Engineers at all the manufactures and the sensor manufactures. There are a couple of aftermarket companies making them and other companies put their names on them ie: private label.

When my article is finished it will be in most of the Major Diesel Magazine publications. So if you have subscriptions to them you will see it soon.

A lot of time and effort went into my testing, and it will help many people who have having serious problems especially the Tow Community.

I only mentioned the one Ford Dealer I know of with the new 2010 Stock of the Dark Blue Sensors, they changed the sending unit inside the sensor and the Jan 2010 stock to May 2010 stock is the new sensor. Everything 2009 and back is the old sending unit. Many Ford Dealers are selling old stock, so if you want one of the better CMP's try to get the 2010 stock. The dates are on the bags on the front, Like: 01 10 10 above the bar Code on the right in the plastic Ford Package. My local Ford Dealer only had the older stock, pre Nov 2009. I noticed in your Photo Ed that you have the new Sensors, that's great. I have not cut open a 2010 Gray Sensor yet to see if they installed the new sensor. I will cut one up tomorrow to check it.

I would have never know about these changes if I did not cut them all open and inspect them carefully.

But for now I just wanted to let some people know there is a new sending unit in the Dark Blue Design in the 2010 year. Anything is better than the Gray 35C91 unit.

Here are some of the CMP's I have tested,

Best,
Russ

 

It would be nice if you'd share some of your test results with us Russ, or at least tell us what all you've done to test it. I can guess at some because we have done several comparisons between the original & the gray one. I don't see an original CPS there in your picture for use as a baseline number?

I'd also like to know if you did any testing that scientifically measured the strength of the magnet in each sensor. Also did you test all those sensors pictured with the windshield wipers on?

 

Will you be around here after the release for follow-up questions?

As you are not yet published, I understand your current reluctance to be too detailed with your answers.

Do you have an electrical engineering background?

Will you be sharing your methodology for peer review purposes?

Pop

 

___________________

Chris,

I am not a journalist, but I know it's not fair to Spill the Beans so to speak.

I do have the 3 original CMP's 1999.5, 2000 & 2001 and I will include those numbers in the testing.
Most of the testing is at Sea Level, but I did do some testing in the Carolina Mountains where the air was thin.

After the Issue(s) are Printed & Distributed, I will make a Free Downloadable pbf for everyone since I own the Copyright on the Article.

I will explain the options in easy terms, and try not to get to Poindexter.

It's a very complex device and what I call "The Pacemaker" of the Engine.
It's basically the EKG/ECG Machine sending info to the Heart, PCM.

Best,
Russ

 

"Poindexter" is perfectly acceptable for quite a few of us here.

Go for it when you can!

Pop

 

which one provides the smoothest idle

I hate my idle with the CPS i have in it now, it is rough but i honestly dont remember which style/color i have right now

 

So is everyone leaning twards the blue CPS for the 01 7.3's? I would like to buy one to see if that is the issue I'm having with the truck running horrible.. Just don't want to buy 2..

I don't have codes but am experiencing similar issues to this.. Just want to make sure I try the right one..