About the only thing we as consumers can hope for is this....No hurricanes in the gulf this year (production is still not at pre katrina levels yet) The lease sale goes well and more acreage onshore is opened up to drilling. We as Americans see the biggest price break or control on domesticly produced oil. If we produce more that means we import less, hence supply goes up and demand goes down, along with the price.

Add about 5 new state of the art refineries stratigicly located (medium sized 150,000 BPD-250,000BPD)

Get the government to shut down Ford, GM, KrautKrysler if they don't change their stance on 5% bio.

Get the Farmers doing what they do best again, Farm.

Lastly quit using hydrocarbons to generate electricity, go nuclear once and for all.

Best case scenario, 10 years from now prices will be lower than 10 years ago. It is a very comprehensive deal when you talk about how our nation uses energy. There are so many different entities involved, their is simply no silver bullet.

Ryan

 

tell you what I am doing driveing less use car to go to work and only use truck when I have to, maybe if others did that we would see some change

 

Sadly, for now is the only say we have in the price. Trying to control the demand. We sold one of our vehicles since I drive a company truck. We try to eliminate double trips, purchase things online, ect. All of this has been discussed before. It also worked shortly after Katrina and Rita, they backed off prices rather quicley when they saw a sharp fall in demand.


Ryan

 

For those of you that would like to comment in that thread but were not able to, I have now opened the thread for discussion.
Remember that I had to close it due to name calling. Please don't make me close it again, it was a great discussion. Very educational for me.

https://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/5...d-the-epa.html

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thanks for the education on supply and demand, it still doesnt seem right that we are to pay so much for fuel. Big oil wants huge profits, thats why we are to pay higher prices. They want to give their CEO's millions in pensions, thats why we pay alot more. We are covering thier retirements.

 

I just heard on the news today that there is a nationwide shortage of diesel fuel. They didn't say why, but they said that truckers are being limited to 50 gallons at many western state truck stops. Yikes, that's NOT good news for us diesel users.

 

any reason to raise fuel prices, i think oil companies cause the shortages so they can make more. We have another retirement to pay for fellas. doesnt it feel good???!!!!

 

another thing we can do is to pay cash for our fuel, if we use a debit card today, then we control the prices for tommorow. If we go debit then they arent getting their money for a day or two, then they have a reason to raise prices a bit to compensate for the banks taking forever on paying them.

 

Rwalker,you have bought hook, line and sinker into the liberal spin machine about big oil!

Sure they are making big profits, and I wish they would be willing to cut their margins, and while a disagree with the huge salaries paid to oil, as well as many other large company executives, you have to realize that the millions they are paid is but a drop in the bucket as a percentage of total sales. And the liberals sure don't seem to complain about the huge salaries paid to media moguls like Ted Turner of CNN, as they apparently see him as one of their own.

And, you need to remember who the owners of the oil companies are. Primarily, they are the pension companies and other retirement funds who make up the mutual funds for working people like you and me. Also, the mutual funds owned by little old ladies who depend on the monthly checks they get. Do you want to reduce the money they get each month?

As good business managers, it is their oil exec's duty to make a good return for the company's owners, and it isn't their fault at all that oil prices are high. That is set by another whole group of people who I disagree with a lot more then the oil companies, the speculators in commodities and hedge funds. This is where the blame lies as far as high oil prices go, and I wish the media would put the blame where it really belongs. Sure, again, they are just doing their jobs, but for something as critically important to the economy as oil, I think it might be time to take oil out of the commodities market again.

Oil wasn't traded as a commodity until about 20 years ago, and while this worked great when there was plenty of oil, the fear that we are running out now is driving the prices way beyond any reasonable levels based on actual availabilty of oil.

But it sounds much better for the Dems and the BIG media to blame big oil then the commodities market, as they get a lot more mileage out of indirectly beating up Bush and his supposed ties to big oil. Not to mention that it plays much better to the Dems mostly uneducated and uninformed voters who don't have a clue as to what the commodities market is.

As for profit margins, for such a capital intensive industry, the oil companies are still making relatively small margins of around 10%. While that amounts to huge profits, due to the humongous volume of sales, nobody complained when Microsoft was regularly generating profits in excess of 50% back in the 90's. Or that McDonalds regularly generates profits in excess of 15%- 20%. In business it's all about profit margins, not gross profit dollars, but this information wouldn't play well on the news to people who don't have a clue of how to calculate margins, especially when the margins are very average as far as business goes. Heck no, speaking about BILLIONS and BILLIONS in profits plays much, much better to the masses.

 

Couple what MDB said with a lack of refining capacity. Folks we use more refined products than we can refine in a day.

Rwalkers point is that he lives by a refinery and cannot understand why his fuel is more expensive than say in AZ where their are no refineries.

This is the complicated dark side that I have not been wanting to explain due to it sounding like a conspericy theory. Most of the direct or indirect competition was set up in 1911 by the Standard Oil antitrust case. With the mergers, LLC's, and LP's redistricting was deemed un necessary. This is why some places have no Shell stations, or BP stations, or Citgo Stations and so forth and so on. Then you have licensed re-branding of fuel that complicates it even further. Giant Refining is allowed by licensing to produce Conoco branded fuel. Guess what that does to the price? Someone pays all those licensing fees. Interstate pipelines and the old history lesson about long haul vs short haul on the railroads. Competition became so fierce that you could ship something to California cheaper than you could 1 state over. Interstate Pipelines operate the same way. Capacity of the pipeline is bid on by energy marketer's, oil and gas producers, local utilities, just like you bid on commodities and stocks. The feds set rules as the interstate pipelines are still federally regulated. If you ship oil from Texas to the middle of nowhere with little or no competing bid for capacity the transportation fee becomes cheaper.

Ryan

 

I had to laugh when I read this Ryan. IF the "Problem is we consume more than we refine." Then it would stand to reason your first statement is UNTRUE. As demand increases we must increase refining capabilities and buy more crude. This has not been done where diesel and #2 oils are spoken about. Oil companies have increased production of all gasolines... while maintaining status quo where diesel is concerned.

The oil companies in my mind have deliberatly kept production down on these oils so that the demand could drive up prices to where they are equal to gasoline. Increased pricing on lower cost production = much higher profits for the oil company. What I mean is... diesel in the refinement process is much cheaper to produce from a barrell of crude, than gasoline. In years past when demand was not so great, the oil companies charged a (semi-) fair price. When the trend toward diesel vehicles occured, and demand increased... the oil companies saw a lil lightbulb come on... hmmmm lets hold production at X rate per month.... and as supply runs out we'll be able to charge more, which will give us a huge increase in profit!

Frank

 

I agree 100%, we are being taken advantage of plain and simple. No matter how you put it. They see profits in the billions, then dont want to give it up. Marketing doesnt cost billions, heck, i never even see commercials about big oil or its chain of gasoline stations so how can marketing cost bilolions. we are being fooled.

 

I feel the same pain as you brother.

 

Well you are sure free to think what you want. Do you know why they have increased production of gasoline? Do you know how a refinery works? Have you ever been to one? Answer me these questions and I will explain your mis-understandings of my post. I already know the answer to the first and second, but the third I am unsure of. I smell a political troll here, and just want to be sure.

Ryan

 

All I have heard out of you in this thread is a bunch of crying. If the cost bothers you that much, move to Canada, or England, I have heard the price is much better over there. Or here is a novel idea, take the bus, car pool, anything but please stop the crying.

Ryan