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460 vs. 454

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Old Jul 26, 2009 | 11:50 PM
  #151  
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From: McKenzie River
I would say a 76 vette with LS-1 350 probably put out around 200hp, about 25hp less than a mid 80s 302 in a Mustang GT.
 
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Old Jul 27, 2009 | 12:11 AM
  #152  
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At the risk of being a troublemaker here,back around 1984 i worked for a company that pumped concrete,and i drove one of there flatbed pump trucks,built on a 1965 or 1966 Ford F350 chassis....they actually had two nearly identical trucks,both powered by 390's with 4 spds...... we were told to try to avoid the truck scales,which led me to believe that they were probably above the 10,000 gvw mark,but even so,these trucks pulled surprisingly well......As a "shop" truck,we also had a 70's F350 Super Camper Special,with a 460 and a/t,and the company owner's son had an F250 4x4 with a 460/4 spd in it( it was somewhere between an 81 and 84 model,so it would have been Carb'd rather than an EFI motor) and i drove both of these 460 powered trucks a couple times... Considering how much less they weighed than the 390 powered F350 flatbed dually's,and the fact that they had more displacement, i was actually kind of dissappointed by the 460's less than resounding advantage,power wise.
At that time,my daily driver was a 1970 GMC 2500 2wd with a 4bbl 350,A/t and either 3.73 or 4.10 rear axle ratio,and honestly it was a lot quicker than either of the 460 Fords were.....At the time,i suspected that had you put one of those 390's in an equivalent 2wd F250,they would have also been far quicker than the 460's.......
 
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Old Jul 27, 2009 | 12:15 AM
  #153  
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Those early 80s 460s were probably putting power to the ground thru a 3.55 or 3.73 rear axle..........not a quick set up.
 
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Old Jul 27, 2009 | 12:24 AM
  #154  
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Probably Correct on the early 80's models,i remember that many of the 6.9/T19 4 spd models used 3.54's,but i would have assumed that the F350 SCS would have had at least 3.73's if not 4.10's,and im guessing that the old 390 powered flatbeds probably would have carried 4.10's or even 4.56's at that weight rating.....
 
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Old Jul 27, 2009 | 12:28 AM
  #155  
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I have been known to be wrong, but I think 3.55s and 3.73 were more common in the early 80s to get CAFE stds. down there.....4.10 were available but not as common, 4.56 was a special order only item.
 
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Old Jul 27, 2009 | 12:56 AM
  #156  
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no your right,but i was actually comparing models from the mid-late 60's,thru the 70's,and even until the early 80's.......as said,i was only surprised that both of those 460 powered trucks werent stronger feeling....The 70's F350 Super Camper Special was a Dentside,and im certain it had the 73-77 sheetmetal,so im guessing its 460 engine would narrow it down to a 76 or 77 year,so im still betting it would have carried either 3.73's or 4.10's,remember these were a 140" wheelbase,9000 lb gvw single rear wheel truck. Back in the mid 60's,3/4 to 1 ton trucks frequently had 4.56 gears,and earlier than that my recently gotten rid of 1959 1 ton IH dually had around 5.40 to 5.60 gears
 
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Old Jul 27, 2009 | 01:08 AM
  #157  
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Ah,well Tomorrow is a work on the Chevy day,ive got to drill 4-6 holes in the front frame rails,and make some spacers to mount a 70's- early 90's Dodge specific Ramsey winch bumper on a 1980 Chevy........Ironically,about 2-1/2 years back i was taking a Warn Winch bumper,from a 73-87 Chevy/GMC and modifying it to fit a 92 Dodge,since sold! At least the winch bumper on the F250 was actually off of another F250 from the same era....
 
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Old Jul 27, 2009 | 05:56 AM
  #158  
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first no duh a cummins would blow a 350 out of the hole...your going oh its funny only has 6 cylnders ...well we cant go by engine size obviously the cummins is a lil bigger engine then a 350 is you go by cubes.....but pistons wise obviously a 350 biger cause of that V power....now that the obvious is done.....first off......a cummins is a diesel...so naturally more HP.....second it doesnt have a carb fixed to it like on of those old 350's...(noduh its a diesel anyways dont have carbs) 2nd they COME with TURBOS so no **** sherlock...a cummins will beat out a old corvette 350 like i say i would LOVE to get my hands on a cummins or a 6.5L from the middle/late 90's but its un-affordable for now so i been putting cash into what i got(although if i havent put cash into my 400 by now i probly coulda bought a duramax) and reading your coments above the 460 and work truck stuff....thats interesting my best bud has 460 with a 3:55 1977 camper special...im pretty sure its a 3:55 we put in it anyways....
 
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Old Jul 27, 2009 | 12:07 PM
  #159  
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Originally Posted by 6.6liter
first no duh a cummins would blow a 350 out of the hole...your going oh its funny only has 6 cylnders ...well we cant go by engine size obviously the cummins is a lil bigger engine then a 350 is you go by cubes.....but pistons wise obviously a 350 biger cause of that V power....now that the obvious is done.....first off......a cummins is a diesel...so naturally more HP.....second it doesnt have a carb fixed to it like on of those old 350's...(noduh its a diesel anyways dont have carbs) 2nd they COME with TURBOS so no **** sherlock...a cummins will beat out a old corvette 350 like i say i would LOVE to get my hands on a cummins or a 6.5L from the middle/late 90's but its un-affordable for now so i been putting cash into what i got(although if i havent put cash into my 400 by now i probly coulda bought a duramax) and reading your coments above the 460 and work truck stuff....thats interesting my best bud has 460 with a 3:55 1977 camper special...im pretty sure its a 3:55 we put in it anyways....
"pistons wise obviously a 350 biger cause of that V power" what did you just say there? do we speak the same language,because i truly have no idea what you were trying to say there?
So far,nothing you have stated is obvious!
First off a Cummins is a diesel....so naturally more hp? Diesels do not inherently have more HP,review your beloved GM archives......Consider the GM 5.7 diesel.and the 6.2......In the case of the 6.2,not only does it have more displacement than your beloved Camaro/grain truck/pivot engine( whatever a pivot engine is?) LT-1,but its got that "V power" thing you spoke of earlier, yet the 6.2 only put out 130 hp net,which is a far cry from whatever net hp number the LT-1 would have achieved....As far as Carburetors go,and there relevance to this discussion( please let us know,HOW its relevant),take a look under the hood of any vehicle built from the late 80's onward gas or diesel,and you likely discover that they pretty much all have fuel injection,rather than carbs,if that matters?
Apparently,you are trying to say that Carburetors arent good,compared to fuel injection,am i grasping your intent here?
How come then that Ole 350 gas motor with a carb,has so much more HP than the larger displacement fuel injected,6.2 diesel?
Didnt you say that diesels have more HP?
Your good buddy's 77 Ford with the 460 and 3.55 gears,is that the one that makes its peak torque at 930-960 rpm on the dyno?
May i make a suggestion 6.6liter? Call it constructive criticism,but have you considered re-reading your material,perhaps with a little editing and modifying,before you hit the "submit" button?
 
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Old Jul 27, 2009 | 12:35 PM
  #160  
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Posting under the influence?........."V power"?....Oh, yeah..thats what you get from Shell gas!
 
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Old Jul 27, 2009 | 12:51 PM
  #161  
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Yeah,Dave i was kinda wondering after a long day on the farm,if perhaps 6.6 was having an adult beverage or 3 whilst posting? I certainly would be!
 
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Old Jul 27, 2009 | 12:53 PM
  #162  
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I think you can almost be assured of it, Bob.........Those were the ramblings of 80proof brain cells for certain.
 
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Old Jul 27, 2009 | 03:27 PM
  #163  
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Originally Posted by iggybob44
Okay,6.6liter,i just got done looking at a 1971-1978 Chilton's truck repair manual,as well as a book entitled "Standard Catalog of 4x4's,1945-1993" and BOTH of them list the 400 SBC as being first introduced in 1975 for pick-up applications,ive got no idea if they had car applications before that,but that's immaterial since were talking trucks here! By 1981 the 400 was GONE from the 1ton and under line up......PER BOTH books,depending on whether the engine was for light duty or heavy duty emissions(depending on the year,the light duty was classified as either under 6000 lbs,or under 8500 lbs) or Federal Vs. California specs....Net HP for the 400 was from 170HP to a MAXIMUM of 185 HP.....NO version of the truck 400SB came anywhere near 265 net hp from the factory......The last year that HP ratings were listed at Gross HP rather than Net HP was 1971,and for truck app's,the best rated 350 4bbl 9.0 compression ratio version was listed at 255 gross hp,while a year later,the closest equivalent,8.5 to 1,4bbl 350 was listed at 175 net hp......moving up the ladder to the 454,325 max gross hp for 1971,270 net for 1972......low point for the 454 was 1975 at 215 net hp.......
the closest number that i see to your claimed 265 rated hp,was from a 1971 402 big block which was rated at 260 gross hp.........
Regarding our trashing of the 454,i seem to recall you werent all that fond of the 454 either,preferring the 400 sb........
Id have to look up the truck comment....im sure its wrong tho

the 400SBC first year was 70. It was for the big cars (cap/imp) in 2bbl configuration for those that wanted to boat in style and for the vans as the chevy van at the time would not fit a BBC.

1974 IIRC was the first year a 4bbl hit the 400 - but make no mistake, chevy NEVER made a performance version of the 400.

the 400-2bbl was rated at 265hp gross, Id deduct about 70 to get the true installed hp and it sorta got worse each year as the valves got smaller and it was generally detuned.
 
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Old Jul 27, 2009 | 04:47 PM
  #164  
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i dont consider the 6.2 a diesel its un-worthy of the name it was such a sad failure..... and im tired of typing and reading.....and its accually 100 prof czech plum brandy 10 years aged and tenn sippin whiskey and we farm 4,000 acres and i work for another guy who does 16,000 ...what would you know of farms anyways...california....buncha hippys hell last time i met a east or west coast guy he seriously asked us if we had out houses
 
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Old Jul 27, 2009 | 04:50 PM
  #165  
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and if you dont know what a pivot /pivot engine is then dont even ask stay on the coast....
 
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