None of it addresses how the lubricity will affect anything in the real world. Nobody shows us what the point of diminishing returns is which is real important. All they allude to is "Some is good, more is better". Much like the supplements they sell at Walgreens. All they talk about is how my brand has more of this than yours. Not a word on bio availability.

 

Did you locate & read it?

 

http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/sho...d.php?t=177728

Yes, I have read it and didn't think much of it. The only information I would consider valuable, and I use that term loosely, is the ranking of which snake oil, aka additive, is better than the other. Or as the Shania Twain song goes "That don't impress me much".

They seem to worship without question the magic number of 460. Why 460? Why not 400? 380? 200? As I have often asked and nobody can say with certainty "What is the point of diminishing returns?" Show me on a component or system level what the benefits of going from 520 to 460 is. Show me that for ever 10 points, the life is changed by X%. I realize even that won't be "real life" but it is reasonably close. Show me that by going from 520 to 460, the injector life is extended by say 10%. That will help me calculate the costs vs benefits. What happens when you go below 460? Again, no answer.

Yes, as a manufacturer, you bet I would be for any of these snake oils that will give any sort of improvement. Why? Because ever mile or day more you can go without a breakdown is a day or mile closer to the warranty going out. Best of all, it is on YOUR dime, not mine. Doesn't cost me a thing and it lowers my warranty coverage. Why not? As a consumer, I want to know what this "extension" is going to cost me. I want to know if it is going to cost me $10 to save $5 or vice versa.

Let me ask you this. If these snake oils do as much as the manufacturers like to think, why haven't they done a proper test instead of using these "studies" to infer you need their snake oil? After all, if you are selling it, isn't the onus on you to prove efficacy instead of trying to use these "studies" to hint at reasons why the consumer should buy their snake oil?

 

this information im about to share comes from technicians that i know both ones that work on the heavy duty semi's and light duty desiel pickups. i've been told tranny fluid is an excellent additive for multiple reasons. not only is it a good lubricant it is also a high detergent additive so it keeps your injectors and things of that nature clean. then from there it is also extremely flammable under pressure and has been known to increase the cetane level. i have also heard about the 2 stroke option but i heard from a handful of people that the 2 stroke will clog fuel filters and injectors not 100% sure sounds like you guys are having alot of success with it but here's a thought my buddies at ford run 80% used atf that they have filtered and 20% pump diesel in their trucks they run quieter and get approxametely 1.5 mpg better then on pump alone. just something to think about

 

Not sure if this might be something along the lines of what you're looking for... starting mostly around page 11.

http://mopar.mopar1973man.com/pdf/022003bosch.pdf

 

Aklim, Glad you at least took the time to read it.......

"Let me ask you this. If these snake oils do as much as the manufacturers like to think, why haven't they done a proper test instead of using these "studies" to infer you need their snake oil? After all, if you are selling it, isn't the onus on you to prove efficacy instead of trying to use these "studies" to hint at reasons why the consumer should buy their snake oil?"

What would you consider a proper test for lubricity if the High Frequency Reciprocating Rig test is not a "proper test" to measure lubricity of the tested "snake oils"?

I am not selling anything.

And it appears that the product that provides the best lubricity( REG's Biodiesel) and did not in any way fund this lab test......

 

Very interesting. Going to digest some of it later today.

 

From my initial reads, the item on the mopar board would be a good test. From an initial glance, it shows that there is a certain amount of increased wear in the pump parts. That shows things much better. Now I know that with say 520 fuel, I am probably losing 15-20% of pump life. Now I can calculate what the pump is worth and what the cost of additive and my time and decide if I want to dump the stuff in it.

Just showing the ball sliding up and down doesn't cut it. With the graph on page 11, you can see how much wear you are willing to put up with.

 

Don't forget to calculate the better burn rate if you use an additive with a cetane bump. I *do* notice about 1 mpg increase while using it. That's enough for me. Well, that, and better power due to the more complete burn.

 

HeHeHe. HKusp, I like your style and the avatar!

 

this is sorta off yalls topic yall have merged to but i pulled up to a shell station virtually on my last drops yea its bad i know but i wanted to try this so i put 12 oz of that super tech 2 stroke oil in a few shots of dieselkleen and a full tank and literally when pulling out of the parking lot i significantly noticed a quieting when the new fuel hit the bowl i jus thought that was pretty frickin cool haha sorry for interupting

 

I’d like to see more studies on ATF. But at the same time, I don’t have access to a lot of ATF to burn. The reason why 2-stroke oil is so popular is because we can still drive up to any fuel station, and simply add a quart of cheap easily accessible 2-stroke oil.

We’re adding not just any 2-stroke oil, but TW3 2-stroke oil; extra additives and ashless.

As for clogging filters, I can’t imagine that being a problem at the ratio being used, and with using TW3. I don’t think 2-stroke oil will change the fuel viscosity to clog a filter, and there shouldn’t be anything in the oil to clog a filter. I’ve been using 50/50 2-stroke oil in my other gasoline engines, and never had a fuel filter clog.

I'm also careful about some of the fuel stations that say "Up to 5% biodiesel". I'm not sure if it is 0%, 1%, 2%, or 5% being added.

Thanks for your comments,

Jake

 

I too started adding 1oz of Supertech 2 stroke per gallon of diesel, for the last 3 tanks of fuel. The motor initially got quieter, now it seems to be louder...Its difficult to tell over the #8 injector tick, which also seems louder since I started the 2 stroke diet.
I do like the idea of adding some lube to the fuel system though. I think I'll run straight fuel next fillup and see and hear what happens.