sorry cletus... i missed the sarcasm... i would like to see some pics of your setup... sounds to me like you are venting heat out from under your hood which is a good thing... if the heat is going out there, then cooler air should be coming in and getting to your air intake... anyway... back to your regularly scheduled thread..!

 

Thanks Gene for all your research and math. Your the reason I posted up here in the 99+ 7.3 forum was so that you could help with your outstanding ability of math and research. Keep up the good work

Cowboy Steve

BTW, the reason some of these fella's seem to give you such a hard time is that they themselves are lost in your endless amounts of numbers, and caveman tactics would have someone who dosn't understand it, bash it cause they feel little inside when they arent able to follow such amounts of mathmatical equations. Just my $.02 worth

 

Interesting read if anybody is still following this thread. This guy did a similar thing with a Mazda comparing filters. http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/airfilter/airtest1.htmSeems his conclusions are that cotton flows the best, but paper filters the best and even though cotton flowed better it wasn't by much.

 

So Steve, are you saying that bashing ernesteugene's theories is so easy a caveman could do it?
So in other words, choosing a filter for filtration might be more important than choosing a filter based on flow?
Hmmmmm, seems like I've heard that somewhere before.........................

 

I don't understand his math but I do try. How can real world numbers be disputed? I have on atleast three instances shown him to be wrong with no answer. You believe what you want and I will do the same. I think that's worth $.05.

 

I understand it, Steve. The problem I have (which I have said already also unanswered) is that there MUST be something missing from the calculations. The math would have you believe the 6637 is a POS and shoudn't be used under any circumstances. THAT'S why I have tried to ask pointed questions about this. Answers like "I'm not dead yet" aren't an answer. Everyone will die eventually, and so will your air filter (unless you and your filter live in a bubble). You maintain your body and your truck (including the filter) and both will live a long fruitful life without being in a bubble. Time and the real world (round or flat) has seemed to confirm its use in our trucks. The filter has been exposed to just about every kind of driving style out there, and it performs. And very well at that. Gene and his math are on here telling us we shouldn't use it. What's missing?

Is that so clear a caveman could understand it??

Joe

 

The link I posted earlier buy a guy who performed flow and filtration tests on his Mazda using an instrument like that being used by Gene and Tenn clearly showed that “paper” filters the best over all. As for flow filters made out of cotton flow the best. The differences in flow though were very small. However you need to consider he was using drop in replacements. What this means is for equal size paper is not the best choice for flow, however with the 6637 we are not dealing with equal size. The surface area of the 6637 is huge compared to stock and many alternative after market products. This provides much more surface area to pull in air thus increasing flow. Its larger size compared stock and even the AIS system is obvious. As the tester in the link I provided showed the filters followed common sense better flow=poorer filtering, better filtering=poorer flow. With 6637 you overcome the poorer flow problem by increasing the surface area. This way you get the best of both worlds great filtering and free flowing.

As for the other potential problems posted with 6637 such as heat of the engine is not a big deal. Even at idle the air temperature difference between the outside and under the hood is not enough the get worried about. As for moisture on paper not a big deal. First off using the term paper filter is misleading. “Paper” filters made today are a mixture of natural and synthetic materials that are treated to resist moisture. This does not make them moisture proof only resistant. This is an important difference to remember. Additional the filter is reinforced with a wire frame for added integrity.


Just seeing the testing in the link I provided and the lack of any opposing real world tests I feel safe in saying that the 6637 is a great choice as long as you use some common sense. If you have the zoodad mod you may want to think twice as it is moisture resistant not moisture proof and others have had water introduced to their filters through the zoodad hole. If you do a lot of off road driving in wet environments this filter is not a good choice, remember resistant does not equal proof. Make sure it is securely installed and won’t slip off. Check it as often as you would any filter. Given its size it will take a long time to clog up, but you still should check it. If you don’t like the sound of the turbo don’t install this filter. The free flowing design and the lack of an air box lets out a lot of noise.

 

I asked for math and research and thats what Gene provided. Right or wrong its what he provided and Im not about to bash a guy cause of his info I asked for. he's going off of website numbers, which we all agree are a little off when it comes to the 450cfm mark on the 6637 and the 250cfm mark on the stock air box. My dyno runs show diffrent then what Gene has provided yes, but its the thought that people are bashing him cause his math dosnt compare to the dyno runs I made that is bothering me. No need to start a "Hate and Discontent" thread over a few diffrences of opinion. Unless I missed it, I still havent seen anybody post up their math research to dispute Gene's........

I appreciated everybodies intel and opinions on thishread. Everyone has helped truemendously! Thanks guys

Cowboy Steve

 

Well, after reading all 15 pages of posts, I just bought a NAPA 6637.

I don't think I can go wrong with it, the cost is right, the filtering certainly up to par, and the air flow is better than stock.

I guess I'll just see how it goes,

Richard

 

You'll love it if you like whistle...

 

I'm not "bashing" him -- I hope I'm not lumped in that category. I just think that he's a bit over zealous in trying to prove something's "wrong" with the 6637. He has said that it's his hobby, and that's fine. But issuing warnings to folks about something that lots of us use daily with no problems warrants rebuttals. No hate or discontent at all -- just friendly discussion and debate. I think those are excellent reasons to frequent this forum! Plenty of options out there and you certainly have the ability to choose for yourself how to modify these beasts. As much as I love the results of the 6637, I may get an AIS simply for the quiet characteristic of it. I don't mind the sounds, but my wife & daughter may have a different opinion on a long trip.

Oh, and you're welcome!!

Joe

 

Izzy very good post!

 

Please tell me specifically which calculations you're having a problem believing, and I'll try again and explain why they're 100% correct. I stand by my math, my calculations, and the theoretical physical concepts behind them!

Either quote them back from one of my previous posts, or just copy and paste these calculations into a new post if that's easier. I promise to keep explaining any and all of my calculations until they're understood by all that are interested enough in them to read my explanations of them.

 

As I've said many times, the thing that's "wrong" (your words not mine, I always say "not the best choice") is the fact that the 6637 is an "open element filter" that's not protected by an air box and is directly exposed to the under hood environment, and I've made it clear that this applies to all such filters, which is why none of them is the best, or if you tow hot and heavy, even a good choice.

Now that you've brought this up again, I'm going to post one reason at a time why these types of filters are not the best choice in general, and not even a good choice for towing in particular. Then everyone can post their reasons why my reason is incorrect, misguided or whatever. I'll make my first reason an easy one involving no math or science.

Reason #1 An "open element filter" is subjected to all the dirt and dust that gets into the engine compartment. It gets coated with oil fumes, dirt, and grime, just like everything else in a typical engine compartment. A filter in an air box with an inlet leading directly to ambient air, only has to deal with the dust that's in the air actually being used by the engine. I can wipe the top of my air box clean, and after 2 or 3 hours of towing pull into a rest stop, and the air box is dirty again. The way I see it, that's an extra amount of dust that would've wound coating my filter if it hadn't been protected by an air box.

 

Where does the air for an enclosed air filter system come from if you don't have a zoodad mod or hybrid form of it? Where does all the dust under the hood come from?