Well, the Chevy 8.1 could very well be an excellent engine.

Bear in mind that it's a brand new product, while the Ford V-10 has been around a few years now.

I don't want this to turn into a Ford vs. Chevy argument, but
I will also relate this: I bought my Ford pickup BECAUSE I had owned a Vortec V6 powered '95 Chev 4x4. Now, I want to be fair and say it might have been built on a Monday morning by a guy whose girlfriend just left him and it wasn't a typical product.

That Chev absolutely hauled a**. It was great when it was new.

I kept it until 75,000 miles. In the last two years I owned it:
->I had to replace the heater core TWICE for leaking. $500 total.
-> The trans case cracked. Not offroading, but normal street use. Blew all the oil out in just a few miles. Replaced trans, $2,000
->Wouldn't start when hot. Needed a new fuel injection body and a fuel pump. $600.
-> Radio never worked on AM. Replaced antenna and shorted cable.
It was routed too close to a hot exhaust pipe.
-> At 70,000 miles it threw a rod bearing. Not from abuse, it started slowly rattling which got worse during a week of commuting to work, no faster than 65 MPH. Engine replacement, $5,000.

I traded it in on a new 2000 F-150. I got $4,000 for the Chevy.

I still have the '87 Ford Ranger V6 pickup I bought new. Around 150,000 miles, and all I've replaced was the clutch. My son has been driving it. Runs like a top, uses absolutely no oil, passes emissions tests every time.

While I've always liked GM products, that was the LAST one I'll ever own.



(flaming mode off)

 

>You guys are comparing the V10 and the 8.1L. What about the
>OTHER V10? Dodge...

They may go, if the transmission doesn't break. And it may stop, if the brakes don't break.

It's a Dodge, nuff said.....

 

>>You guys are comparing the V10 and the 8.1L. What about the
>>OTHER V10? Dodge...
>
>They may go, if the transmission doesn't break. And it may
>stop, if the brakes don't break.
>
>It's a Dodge, nuff said.....


Tough call, really. My buddy has a Dodge 2500 QC SB V10. It's hooked up to the very (almost) ZF-6 speed manual that is in the SD's. It also has a front Dana 60 and a Dana 80 rear. It is one hell strong truck, no doubt about it! Only 300 horsies outa them 8 liters but a respectable 450 lb. ft. at like 2500 RPM. Can't really fault that! If they would have made a 3/4 ton SUV to compete with the Excursion, it would have a been a tougher call for me to choose what I did...but they didn't and aren't so FORD baby! All the way!

 

[updated:LAST EDITED ON 21-Mar-02 AT 09:20 PM (EST)]I'll bet the Dodge is a bit thirstier.Not saying it's bad,but I feel Ford tried to find a balance between performance and economy with the 6.8L.

 

>I'll bet the Dodge is a bit thirstier.

He once claimed 15 mpg average. I doubt it. That was when he first got it. 2or 3 years ago. I'll ask him again.

>Not saying it's bad,but I feel Ford tried to find a balance between
>performance and economy with the 6.8L.

Well, that, and since it is in the modular family it just so happened to work out to that displacment. We certainly have the higher technology. Hard to fault an engine whose faternal twin brother powers the Viper though.

 

I think the 8.1l is about a good technology v-8 push
rod motor with lots of cubes, and a lot of different
applications.

If you want to look at hp/displacement, my Denali
makes 320 hp from a 6.0l v8. In the Caddy version
it makes 345 hp from the same engine. My big v10
only makes 310 from more displacement.

I like a v-8 big engine strategy. Personally I think there
is still a lot to be said for a large displacement,
throaty v-8.

Ford's v-10 approach for it's big engines works great
as well. Love my v-10. It's quite a torque monster and
runs a lot smoother than I expected. Reminds me a lot
of my old SHOs in terms of advanced engine technology.

Advantages to both approaches the way I see it. Can't really
comment on Chrysler - only had their in line 6 cylinder
products.

-Jim
2001 E-450
2001 Yukon XL Denali

 

>If you want to look at hp/displacement, my Denali
>makes 320 hp from a 6.0l v8. In the Caddy version
>it makes 345 hp from the same engine. My big v10
>only makes 310 from more displacement.


Although true, it's more hype than anything else. Take a look at the RPM that the 6.0 has to reach to hit those numbers. You don't honestly think that a real truck needs to spin that fast, do you?

Keep one thing in mind. The V10 produces more torque at 1500 rpm than the 6.0L produces ever!

 

what i do not understand is why if gm was gonna design a new bigger engine why they made a push rod engine??? an over head cam engine is obviuosly more effecient and makes moe power easier. just seems to me that they shot themselves in the foot. and since im a ford man i do not mind that atall.


-nathan

 

>what i do not understand is why if gm was gonna design a new
>bigger engine why they made a push rod engine??? an
>over head cam engine is obviuosly more effecient and makes
>moe power easier. just seems to me that they shot
>themselves in the foot. and since im a ford man i do not
>mind that atall.
>
>
>-nathan


First off, GM didn't design a whole new motor with the 8.1. The 8.1 is an evolution of the venerable 396/402/427/454/502.

Second, I could give a rats a$$ were the cams are, all "more efficient" Ford motors lag in HP and torque with the comparable GM motors(except the 5.4 vs the 5.3 in torque)

I own both the V10 which lags behind the 8.1 and just sold a DOHC 4.6 Cobra which had less HP, torque and fuel economy than the GM LS1.(RIP cambirds)

Ford has a lot of advantages IMHO, that's why I like 'em. But right now we are behind in motor and trannys as far as power goes, OHC or not.

 

>I own both the V10 which lags behind the 8.1...

I wonder why so many of us want to compare the 6.8L to the GM 8.1L?!?

I know that most feel that the V10 is Ford's answer to the large displacement gas engine but I think it is better compared with the GM 6.0L. And although the 6.0L makes 10 more HP at peak, who really cares other than the un-informed and the sales jerks?

Seems the V10 doesn't lag behind the GM 8.1L as much as Ford lags behind in developing a real large displacement Gas engine. But I have a feeling that their corporate philosophy will negate the development of an engine that will directly compete with the 8.1L. It'd be cool if I were wrong.

 

>>I own both the V10 which lags behind the 8.1...
>
>I wonder why so many of us want to compare the 6.8L to the
>GM 8.1L?!?
>
>I know that most feel that the V10 is Ford's answer to the
>large displacement gas engine but I think it is better
>compared with the GM 6.0L. And although the 6.0L makes 10
>more HP at peak, who really cares other than the un-informed
>and the sales jerks?
>
>Seems the V10 doesn't lag behind the GM 8.1L as much as Ford
>lags behind in developing a real large displacement Gas
>engine. But I have a feeling that their corporate philosophy
>will negate the development of an engine that will directly
>compete with the 8.1L. It'd be cool if I were wrong.


I'm totally confused by your statement!!!!

Of course we HAVE to compare the 6.8 to the 8.1. They are both the top gas motors avalable. It's sad really that we don't have bragging rights and actually embarrassing to compare it to the 6.0 IMHO.

I agree the performance difference is not a whole lot comparing the 6.8/8.1 considering displacement but we are 2nd and it bothers me.

 

I have my doubts that we will be seeing a larger V10 from ford. From the modular lineup the 10 was relatively easy to make. I wonder if there are are any 3.55"bore/4.16"stroke 12 cylinder engines in the R&D shop? Now that would be interesting according to my rough math that's 494 CID(or is it 498) but that is hardly excessive if we look at it's "big block" competition. Surely it would fit?
But no doubt we'll see 3 or 4 valve heads that may not help torque below 3500RPM or so
By the way if you a serious ford V10 power deficit syndrome the cure is a twin screw blower(it's the torque curve). Ford's using the roots design on the lightening

 

Oh on another those old tech pushrod engines from the general ,, they do work and i'm thinking LS1 and LS6 here Imagine using block mounted cam and spinning the pee out of it and making a pretty dang good torque curve for a hot OEM CAR! But Ford has the right idea for truck engines nobody wants to tow at 4500RPM. Truck horsepower ratings only matter in the showroom!

 

I agree that the V10 has to be compared to the 8.1 GM. But it seems like GM came out with the 6.0 first to compete with the V10 then when it didn't match up they came out with the 8.1. I guess maybe they had the 8.1 in the works all along though, I don't follow GM and they're plans. Personally I like the V10 and think it has plenty of power, even if I don't have the bregging rights of being the biggest and most powerful. I think the V10 is a good engine and we'll se some mods to up the power some, but probably to improve the milage a little more. Also, I wouldn't mind seeing a turbo option, then we could compare it to the PSD

 

>I agree that the V10 has to be compared to the 8.1 GM. But
>it seems like GM came out with the 6.0 first to compete with
>the V10 then when it didn't match up they came out with the
>8.1. I guess maybe they had the 8.1 in the works all along
>though, I don't follow GM and they're plans. Personally I
>like the V10 and think it has plenty of power, even if I
>don't have the bregging rights of being the biggest and most
>powerful. I think the V10 is a good engine and we'll se
>some mods to up the power some, but probably to improve the
>milage a little more. Also, I wouldn't mind seeing a turbo
>option, then we could compare it to the PSD


I agree with everything(obviously since you already agreed with me. LOL!!) except the 6.0 comment. That motor is basically a bored/stroked LS1 that came out for the non HD2500. The non HD2500 were never meant to compete with Super Duties. GM still had the lame duck C/K 2500 with 454 untill the HD's with Duramax/8.1 came out.


In the Super duties you HAVE to compare the 5.4 to the GM 6.0 because those are the base motors. You HAVE to compare the 6.8 to the 8.1 because those are your only gas options. We, unfortunately, lose bragging rights both ways.