Does anyone know why Ford continues with the CP4 and not switch over to the Denso fuel injection system like GM did ?

I went to a Ford dealership a few weeks ago and they even said it's a good idea to replace the CP4 with a DCR conversion.

 

If I was a betting man, Ford has their eye on the CP8 pump and will most likely be implemented on the next Power Stroke. That next gen Power Stroke could be 8.0L per the rumor mill.

 

Ultimately, money. The failure rate that Ford has had to pay for is acceptable to them compared to the cost of redesigning the fuel system, updating the line, etc etc. At some point they will have to move on from the CP4 since it won't meet the specs they are looking for but for now.

Remember this is still the company that did the math on the pinto after all.

 

I believe that pump that failed at 20k miles was the RP7 version and now there's a RP8 version that supposedly Bosch loosened up some dimensions to accommodate low lubricity fuel and probably in line with the new CP8 pump internal changes possibly. I don't recall seeing any reported CP4 pump failures from '23 on up.

 

Yep... I could have.

My point was not to compare the VE pump to the CP4. My point was to point out what Bosch was saying at that time about fuel. I know jack squat about either the VE pump and the CP4 to argue about it...

Great point about manufacturing defects but the sad truth is we'll never know but common sense says a bad batch of fuel can take out the rollers due to the aggressive lobes on the shaft...

As to additive use, in my opinion, not all additive is equal... I'll leave it there. I'm not going there because peeps get goofy about stuff like that, it's the same oil and change intervals and I ain't no expert. I just do what I do...

Yep that's true additives don't guarantee high mileage out of a CP4 but the 17 6.7 922k mile CP4 got lots of life and looked like it could have kept going... just saying.

 

I'm planning on traveling all across North America and living part time in the back of a camper and need a real dependable durable truck with low maintenance costs...

The Ford's CP4 is part of the reason why I'm thinking of looking at other manufacturers (GM, Ram), since the CP4 can be replaced with a DCR. My concern is all the upfront initial cost of getting the Ford reliable...

Ford upgrades -
S&S DCR Pump Conversion
Emissions delete
CCV reroute: SPE Motorsport

2013 - 2018 Ram 3500 Cummins H.O. High Output with Aisin AS69RC transmission.

2017 - 2019 GMC/Chevy 3500 L5P Duramax with Allison.

Which would you trust for full time traveling and less likely to have major repairs ?

 

The Ram. Simpler engine, proven transmission, easier to DIY repairs and a cheaper parts ecosystem. 2nd would be a 6.7 with the 6R140. The 10R140 or the GMC/Chevy with the 10L1000 are last because those are the most problematic of the bunch. Not saying they're bad, not saying they're anything to be afraid of, but if I had to rank them, there it is.

If we're allowed to consider things like comfort and ergonomics then I choose the Ford over the Ram anyway.

 

Ford no question pre 10 speed 6.7

A DCR is less than the sales tax of switching in most states.

 

My 2016 has almost 153k miles with no major emissions issues. If Covid never happened, I'd probably would have closer to 170k miles because I couldn't take my KY road trips but that's a WHOLE 'nother conversation...

The emissions systems on the Ford 6.7 perform pretty well if you are working the truck and the truck is getting hot with not a lot of low mile trips with lots of stop and go traffic. These are not gas trucks that can do the short stuff as they do not have the complex emissions of the 6.7 Powerstroke. That said, I am not against deleting as it does reduce the amount of soot ingested by the engine and reduces wear. I'll be making a post on this subject soon and will tie in bypass filters, especially for stock EGR ingesting 6.7s, but that's for later.

My 2016 is a daily driver and does not pull a load when I drive... bought it brand new. Then my education of the Ford 6.7 Powerstroke truck began... I was researching deleting when I bought it but then realized I was driving my truck enough, up and down the hills where I live south of Buffalo, started monitoring the truck info on first the first Banks iDash, then moved on to the iDash 1.8 units to monitor EGTs and regens. But then the EPA stepped up enforcement and the bigger software tuners went emissions complaint Like Korey Willis of PPEI but now it looks like we should be getting software updates that will stop the derate modes and 500 mile limits from certain CEL codes since Zeldin got into the EPA and hopefully blue collar workers who delete their trucks will not be penalized any more, or at least the ones not rolling coal. Time will tell...

I've had the EGR cooler core replaced just before the extended warranty expired at the end of 2023. The DEF sending unit/heater was replaced under warranty at I want to say 40k some miles. This sending unit did put the truck into a reduced power mode until it was fixed but I could still drive it normally IIRC. I replaced the DEF pump after the truck threw a Reductant Low Pressure CEL last year with no reduced power mode at all. Since I was there and the replaced sending unit had probably close to 100k miles, I replaced that as well... in my driveway. Kinda was a PITA but was doable.

Now. all that said, I don't mind being stock but will never say never about deleting... and IMHO, I'm no expert nor mechanic but just look at stuff a lot, I'd be more worried about the CP4 than having to delete the truck. The emissions will take care of itself when you are pulling a camper and getting things hot.

I run an Improved Racing CCR oil catch can in the recirculating mode under the hood on top of my underhood fuse box on the driver's side with the Mishimoto CCV box adapters to help with the inside of the manifold from getting extra gunky from the addition of more oil with the EGR. Had to buy extra fittings to make it work for my custom application. But yeah, you want to remove the CCV from your intake, a reroute with SPEs can sounds good.

About the Ram with the Aisin trans, personally and from reading stuff, I believe the Ford 6R140 is a solid transmission and a better one... don't know much about the 10R140 but think it was stupid of Ford, my opinion, to remove the trans fluid dipstick and tube. I've drained and filled my trans 4 times with 3 filter changes. The 17 to 19 Super Dutys still have the 6R140 with not only a dipstick, but a pan drain as well. But there are always aftermarket pans for the 10R140s. I am going to get an aftermarket trans pan for my truck... to increase the fluid capacity. I'm now leaning towards a Goerend trans pan.

So IMO, I'd lean towards a 17 to 19 Ford 6.7. My buddy owns a 19 GMC 2500 6.6 because he's a Chevy guy. I'll ask him for more info on his truck.

His newer mechanic, a former Ford tech who used to work part time but quit Ford and works full time now, has a 11 to 16 gen 6.7. Bought it with a lot of miles (over 250k miles) and it was stock. Now has to have about 300k miles, at least, but did delete the truck the truck because he does a lot of local stop and go and the ride to the shop is close. He believes it has the original CP4 but he did add an S&S Gen 2.1 DPK for insurance.

Good luck with your search.

 

Any of the three will get the job done frankly. If you already have the Ford then the far cheaper route is to make whatever changes that get you comfortable with it.

Each truck has its pluses and minuses. Luckily all of them have a solid transmission with the Aisin being the chungus of the three at like 430 pounds. I think the 6 speed allisons and the 6140 are within 10 pounds of each other or something like that. Biggest pro of the Ford is the power, Dodge has a great interior in the upper trims and a better exhaust brake, GM has a great fuel system in the Densos. High mileage HP4 have shown to fail with a similar modality to the CP4 but typically only at high mileage (300k+) and not as common.

That said I am at 152k miles on my 2019, OEM emissions compliant. So far has been pretty good, haven't done any emissions repairs in the 4 years and 80k miles I have had the truck. OEM CP4 is still kick as well, demand and actual rail pressures track well with each other.

 

Not sure why you have emissions delete on the Ford and not the Ram and GM trucks. I believe the emissions system on the Ford is the most reliable of the big 2 and Ram

 

Yes, which ever manufacturer I choose, I'll look into deleting which ever one I get.

When crossing borders, like when traveling through Canada to Alaska and back, does border patrol or any agencies inspect emissions on diesel trucks ?

 

Not as a rule, they can check for anything in secondary inspection though.

 

Does adding a dual-stage fuel filtration system (e.g., Fuelab, Fleetguard, or DAVCO) with a primary 10-micron filter and a secondary 2-micron filter make a real world difference for engine longevity ?

 

No, you will have no troubles.