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  #31  
Old 01-26-2019, 10:03 AM
Imadentguy
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First and fore most i want you to know that i am in no way shape or form trying to talk ****, but ive NEVER been impressed with pioneers sub woofers. Head units, amps, and full range speakers? yes, but their subs have never sounded good. (At least to me) Is it a shallow mount sub? If so thats probably alot of your problem. I have personally never heard one that sounded right. They always have a hollow muddy sound to me. No real drive or punch, just noise. I have been out of car audio for a while, and when i was hard into it, DSP’s were a rich mans toy, so i dont have much experience with the new ones. I have done a ton of research and have read that the kicker unit is difficult to get set up correctly. It may be in your best interests to take it to a shop and have them mic it and try and set it up for you. If your bass is muddy try dropping your cross over on the sub. I used to run all of my subs between 60-80 hertz. Drop the cross over frequency to your door speakers and have a listen. If you have decent door drivers dont be scared to drop the frequency lower, but listen for distortion at the volume levels you generally listen at. With a DSP i would try and tune the system with everything on the OEM headunit set to middle of the road. Make adjustments on your processor to boost frequency. One more quick question. Do you have the on off “pop” some people complain about with the kicker processor? Thanks dude
 
  #32  
Old 01-26-2019, 10:22 AM
Imadentguy
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Also your bass control **** should have a direct impact on subwoofer output. I would probably call kicker on that one.
 
  #33  
Old 01-26-2019, 11:01 AM
undl8r
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your'e probably right about pioneer/shallow box. my previous truck had a small (smaller than pioneer box) self powered (claimed 1000W but no way possible based on wiring harness provided) Nakamichi sub that would send a moderate shockwave through you and cost $300 installed. I thought going to a bigger woofer with a dedicated amp channel and more box volume would have sounded at least as good. that being said I've come across a company that makes offset mounting brackets for the rear seats - gives a few more inches of room to allow for a deeper/bigger sub box behind the seats. so if i can't get the sub to perform i might build a 12" box and get the brackets for more room behind the seat.

i hear you on door door speakers, my fronts (JL Audio) can handle more bass so I'll try lower x-over. as you've alluded to, i've been messing with this for a few days now and it is getting a little tiring (drive a few miles, pull over, make adjustment, repeat).

bass control **** works when bass is "normal" e.g. med bass song I can turn up and down the sub "thump". i actually don't mind were the bass is at for heavy music but i have to be able to turn it down when others get it.
 
  #34  
Old 01-26-2019, 11:09 AM
Imadentguy
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I went back and read your post a couple of times. Also try turning the sub gain down on your amplifier, and turn off any bass boost on the amp if you have it turned on and try tuning from there.
 
  #35  
Old 01-26-2019, 11:10 AM
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Even though the sub is kick(ing) my butt. If your system self tunes I think you should get it. The front row allows spatial adjustment (not sure about the one you're considering) such that I can eliminate certain situations where things may start to sound "screechy" or frequencies seem out of balance. The self tuning, I would think, should handle this automatically.

However, 1/2 of the Sat Radio stations sound like crap and there's little improvement the DSP can do.
 
  #36  
Old 01-26-2019, 11:32 AM
Imadentguy
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Originally Posted by undl8r View Post
your'e probably right about pioneer/shallow box. my previous truck had a small (smaller than pioneer box) self powered (claimed 1000W but no way possible based on wiring harness provided) Nakamichi sub that would send a moderate shockwave through you and cost $300 installed. I thought going to a bigger woofer with a dedicated amp channel and more box volume would have sounded at least as good. that being said I've come across a company that makes offset mounting brackets for the rear seats - gives a few more inches of room to allow for a deeper/bigger sub box behind the seats. so if i can't get the sub to perform i might build a 12" box and get the brackets for more room behind the seat.

i hear you on door door speakers, my fronts (JL Audio) can handle more bass so I'll try lower x-over. as you've alluded to, i've been messing with this for a few days now and it is getting a little tiring (drive a few miles, pull over, make adjustment, repeat).

bass control **** works when bass is "normal" e.g. med bass song I can turn up and down the sub "thump". i actually don't mind were the bass is at for heavy music but i have to be able to turn it down when others get it.
Unless you listen to alot of rap, and are looking to GET DOWN 1 quality 10” sub that is appropriately powered, mounted in a box with the manufacturers suggested air space will give you the most balanced quality sound. It will play tight and controlled while still getting low. When it comes to subs the box is EVERYTHING. I have heard low end subs mounted in the appropriately sized box with a quality amp and they were fantastic. Likewise i have heard highend subs mounted in boxes that did not have enough airspace that sounded like 2k dollars worth of crap. Airspace is everything. The prefab boxes generally have a trade off in size at the expense of sound. I have always built my own box. I think the gain on your sub channel is too high. Turn it down and play around with the front row output gain and boost.
 
  #37  
Old 01-26-2019, 11:44 AM
Imadentguy
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Also, you have quality door drivers. Lower the crossovers on the doors with the sub disconnected and listen to them. I would even try running them “open” with no crossover cutting out the sub frequency's. If they play at your listening level without breaking up, re attach the sub and set your crossover on the sub channel to 80ish maybe even 60 and then play with the sub gain. See if it gives the “stomach punch” without getting muddy. Im not sure how the OEM HU is set up. Most of them cut sub frequency as the volume goes up so keep that in mind. I personally would try and set it up to sound best around 14 or 15 on the OEM head unit. At 3/4 volume you may be getting into odd EQ curves programmed into the factory HU. I dont believe the front row summons signals and washes any eq curves but i could be wrong.
 
  #38  
Old 01-26-2019, 11:57 AM
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Originally Posted by undl8r View Post

However, 1/2 of the Sat Radio stations sound like crap and there's little improvement the DSP can do.
^This.

Most of the music I listen to in the truck is from the Hi Fi (high bit rate) catalog on Tidal. It's a great source for lossless 16bit tracks. Some tracks are what they call Master quality or 24bit. Recently found some ZZ Top & Billy Gibbons licks in the Master format I have a 256gb SD card in my phone that I download them to. Starting with a good source vs satellite or Spotify makes a big difference if your audio system (not oem) is upgraded. I run Hertz components and a JL sub in a custom box, with a 1k watt JL digital amp.
 
  #39  
Old 01-26-2019, 12:13 PM
Imadentguy
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If you want a sub that puches like a drunk step daddy, the kicker solo’s are the mutts nutz! Space can be a problem though, and you would need to make sure your amp can push it, but these things are awesome. You would need to take measurments after you lift the back seat (including excursion limit measurments). One 8” mounted under your back seat in a sealed box (built to kicker specs) and it will boogie down. This is an old 12 i still have. When i was hard into mini trucks years ago i ran 2 of these in a sealed box in an xcab ford ranger. The sub box was the size of a coffin, but good lord did they pound! 2 of these hit as hard as the 4 15’s i had in my old toyots pickup. Not an audiophile sub..... but man did they hit hard. Been trying to get my ol’ lady to let me put this in her wrangler. Lol she aint feelin’ it
 
  #40  
Old 01-26-2019, 12:48 PM
undl8r
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@Iamadentguy - much appreciation and thanks for all the advice. i'll try your suggestions as soon as it warms up a bit - still in the 20s. i don't believe i've messed with amp sub gain since bringing down the x-over and adjusting DSP output gain. The (front - JL) door drivers do produce a lot of bass and heavily vibrate door panel (but surprisingly with no discernible distortion/resonance) will adjust their x-over too.

i'm going to start looking at getting a bigger box/off setting rear seats. but my monthly allowance for truck modifications has about run out
 
  #41  
Old 01-26-2019, 10:00 PM
csuther
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[img][/img]
i bought this harness from "plug n play kits" on ebay, the pioneer amp is very similar to the kicker key, everything plugged in and works great. added infinity kappas and a rockville powered sub
 
  #42  
Old 01-26-2019, 10:08 PM
Imadentguy
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Originally Posted by csuther View Post
[img]
i bought this harness from "plug n play kits" on ebay, the pioneer amp is very similar to the kicker key, everything plugged in and works great. added infinity kappas and a rockville powered sub
heeeey yeah i found that plug and play kits website. Is he legit? I have messaged him a couple of times about a harness and he really didnt seem very professional. You received your order with no problems? Did you run the d1004 or the s100a? Can you tell a significat difference with the amp?
 
  #43  
Old 01-26-2019, 10:20 PM
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yes I got it with the pioneer D1004, the harness is very well made, not junk, I got if in about 2 days after ordering so shipping was good. I mounted the amp behind the cd player just like in the video, makes a pretty impressive difference from the stock set up. I changed the center speaker to a 3.5" infinity reference but that isn't a very big difference that I can tell so far. it is better than the sony system in my brothers 17 lariat, but that might be mostly because of the speakers.
 
  #44  
Old 01-26-2019, 10:21 PM
Imadentguy
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I am now second guessing the kicker key. It only runs in 4 channel and i have a regular cab which only has a front sound stage. Im also not sure how the key will play along with the center channel. I did a little research and kicker says to disconnect the center channel while running the set up and then either leave the center channel disconnected, or re connect, but i feel like it may battle the benifits of the key with its alignment capabilities. I am leaning towards the alpine 445u run in 2 channel, or the kicker 42 pxa3004 run in 2 channel. The only thing is the kicker puts out 150 rms at 4 ohm in 2 channel, and im not sure what the oem speaker wiring can be run at. Im not interested in running new wires. I also wanted to let undul8r know that i played with my factory head unit tonight listening to driving tecno with a strong bass line. With the volume up 3/4 i could not hear any drop off of the bass frequency. If it does it is minuscule. Nothing like gm and their head units. The signal actually sounds pretty clean.... just needs more power.
 
  #45  
Old 01-26-2019, 10:31 PM
Imadentguy
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Originally Posted by csuther View Post
yes I got it with the pioneer D1004, the harness is very well made, not junk, I got if in about 2 days after ordering so shipping was good. I mounted the amp behind the cd player just like in the video, makes a pretty impressive difference from the stock set up. I changed the center speaker to a 3.5" infinity reference but that isn't a very big difference that I can tell so far. it is better than the sony system in my brothers 17 lariat, but that might be mostly because of the speakers.
man thats good to hear. I think im going to give him a shot. Does anyone know if my headinit will still have powered channels for rear speakers, even though my regular cab only has a front stage. I guess what im asking is, do yall think ford would have programed my head unit different since my system only has 5 speakers? What i would like to do is run the 4 channel harness and hopefully use the two rear channels to run to a LOC and amp for a small sub.
 

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