While doing the RGP cleaning, found some issues
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Laughing Gas
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 776
Likes: 42
From: STL MO
While doing the RGP cleaning, found some issues
Finally have a nice warm day in st. louis, high 60s (teens a few day ago). decided to take out the EBP sensor and tubing to clean it. First, connect the AE to read the EBP before the operation. it reads 22 ish at idle. happens to look at engine coolant temperature and surprized to see a 320F reading. I assume that either the sensor or some connection problem (short or open). have to address it. After taking out the tubing and sensor, other surprises, actually two! there is a hole at one of the bends. good for me that I don't need to clean it, just hoping that a new one is not too expensive. will find out tomorrow at the dealership. second, there is no membrane inside the sensor hole as dexcribed in the write-up. should I buy a new one? I know there are two coolant temp sensors, one for the gauge in the dash, the other one for the ECM. Is the one for the ECM pretty important? Where is it? how can I trouble-shoot it? Thx. Erwin
Cargo Master
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 2,502
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From: Bend Oregon
AE dosent read coolant temp,neither ford for that matter. The gauge on the dash is a guesstimate based on the fueling,RPM and probibly some other factors.
The closest you can get to an engine temp with AE is oil temp.
on the sensor, I cant recall if I could see the membrane, I would just replace the tube andsee if it works and if not replace it at that time. Maybe buy both and just return it if you dont need it. the tube will be around $50 and the sensor around $100
The closest you can get to an engine temp with AE is oil temp.
on the sensor, I cant recall if I could see the membrane, I would just replace the tube andsee if it works and if not replace it at that time. Maybe buy both and just return it if you dont need it. the tube will be around $50 and the sensor around $100
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Laughing Gas
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 776
Likes: 42
From: STL MO
Thx, Steve. That makes sense. AE reads coolant temp well on my 95 manual. have a pretty tight budget this winter. Maybe just replace the tubing and see if the sensor can be reused.
Hotshot
Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 18,849
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From: Puget Sound
- The most important EBP reading with AE is Key On, Engine Off. Get your BARO Volts, your EBP volts, your EBP absolute, and your MAP absolute. You want the pairs of readings (volts and pressure) to be very close to each other. All your tuning is derived from this base reference. Absolute pressure should be about 14.2-14.5 in St Louis, but I haven't looked at my volts to say what that should be.
- Actually, there's no "diaphragm" as we'd think of one. Black in there is soot, and most diaphragms wouldn't survive the EGTs. I saw what looked to be brass-colored on a new one. I speculate it's a miniaturized version of a truck scale, with a load cell.
- I believe a hole or leak near the EBP is the demise of the sensor: They could have easily put the sensor on some exhaust component, but they needed distance to let things cool down a bit. So... the EBP and tube is a dead-head system to let the pressure reach the sensor without the full EGTs.
Logistics Pro
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 3,609
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From: Arizona
While it is true that coolant temp is not available to the PCM on trucks with automatics, the dash gauge and it's sender is a totally separate system and does read coolant temp.
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Laughing Gas
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 776
Likes: 42
From: STL MO
Thx. Tugly for the heads up. I'll do the full test once i put everythign together. The Stealership quoted me $84 just for a regular steel tube while Clay offers it for something like $26. I ordered the stainless stell kind. Thx, Clay.
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Trying to Gain Knowledge
Joined: Jun 2003
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From: Ezzell, TX
I cleaned my sensor out with brake Kleen. I did not hit the electrical side of the sensor just the sooted side. Now my KOEO is at 14.2 vs 17.5 before. Truck is running smooth as butter. I do have a spare sensor in case I need it.
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Cargo Master
Joined: Mar 2006
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From: Bend Oregon
Thanks for the heads up, where is the coolant temp sensor for the gauge located?
Post Fiend
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 6,096
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From: Mesa AZ
The PCM input for engine coolant temp is a valid input for manual transmission vehicles.
The PCM input for engine coolant temp is not used for automatic transmission vehicles.
The sensor is on top of the water pump.
The EBP sensor isn't very delicate.
The PCM input for engine coolant temp is not used for automatic transmission vehicles.
The sensor is on top of the water pump.
The EBP sensor isn't very delicate.
Posting Guru
Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 1,037
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From: Florida
This thread prompted me to check MAP vs. EBP. Cleaned the sensor and tube ~25K miles ago. Cleaned the sensor again last night, it wasn't very dirty.
KOEO MAP = 14.5 psi EBP = 15.95 psi and the latter value bounces around a bit.
Should I install a new EBP sensor?
KOEO MAP = 14.5 psi EBP = 15.95 psi and the latter value bounces around a bit.
Should I install a new EBP sensor?
Hotshot
Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 18,849
Likes: 179
From: Puget Sound
The book says they need to be within 0.2 of each other. I know a number of people have reported improving their MPGs by fixing their EBPs... and I'm one that had a huge improvement (mine was much worse). I wouldn't let it go... it won't get better with time.
Post Fiend
Joined: Sep 2003
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From: Mesa AZ
Posting Guru
Joined: Mar 2011
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From: Florida
I did clean it last night, numbers didn't change between before and after. The numbers I posted were from just after being cleaned. edit: missed the tube part, guess it won't hurt to clean that out too given your interval.
Fleet Mechanic
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 1,546
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From: Wellington, Co
Wow. Thanks Greg, I probably need to check mine. It has been at least 15-17k since i did mine.