Upper ball joint install question
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From: sw mich
Upper ball joint install question
My steering has been very tight since i installed my new NAPA ball joints. I re-used the stock camber adjusters. I didn't notice when I installed them, but today noticed the lip on the camber/castor bushing doesn't set flush at the top of the spindle. The bottom of the bushing presses into the top of the ball on the ball joint. It seems to me the bushing should be about 3/16" shorter, but I'm pretty sure it is the stock bushing. Same situatiin on both sides. Any thoughts?
Fleet Mechanic
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 1,254
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My steering has been very tight since i installed my new NAPA ball joints. I re-used the stock camber adjusters. I didn't notice when I installed them, but today noticed the lip on the camber/castor bushing doesn't set flush at the top of the spindle. The bottom of the bushing presses into the top of the ball on the ball joint. It seems to me the bushing should be about 3/16" shorter, but I'm pretty sure it is the stock bushing. Same situatiin on both sides. Any thoughts?
Here is a pick of how mine sits.
Tim M
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From: Mt. Shasta California
My steering has been very tight since i installed my new NAPA ball joints. I re-used the stock camber adjusters. I didn't notice when I installed them, but today noticed the lip on the camber/castor bushing doesn't set flush at the top of the spindle. The bottom of the bushing presses into the top of the ball on the ball joint. It seems to me the bushing should be about 3/16" shorter, but I'm pretty sure it is the stock bushing. Same situatiin on both sides. Any thoughts?
Fleet Mechanic
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 1,254
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There is a specific torque sequence you need to follow when you are installing the new ball joints.
You torque the lowers first but only slightly then the uppers to full specs and then back to the lowers to their final torque specs.
Are you having any other steering issues...ie not returning to center or wandering?
Tim M
You torque the lowers first but only slightly then the uppers to full specs and then back to the lowers to their final torque specs.
Are you having any other steering issues...ie not returning to center or wandering?
Tim M
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From: sw mich
My main complaint is not returning to center. There is wandering, but I believe its more of the centering issue. It started with the new bjs.
I think they are adjusters, never really looked at them too close.
I played around with the torque sequence, but it really doesn't seem to matter. As soon as you start putting any real pressure on the upper joints they tighten up fast. It is so sensitive that just rotating the nut to make the pin fit over torques them. Thats why i was wondering about the bushing pressing on then ball.
I've got about 4k miles on them now. Steerongs better than it was, just a bit tight still.
I think they are adjusters, never really looked at them too close.
I played around with the torque sequence, but it really doesn't seem to matter. As soon as you start putting any real pressure on the upper joints they tighten up fast. It is so sensitive that just rotating the nut to make the pin fit over torques them. Thats why i was wondering about the bushing pressing on then ball.
I've got about 4k miles on them now. Steerongs better than it was, just a bit tight still.
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Fleet Mechanic
Joined: Dec 2005
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Here is some of my issues that I pulled from an old thread but didn't feel like re-writing it.
I am currently dealing with a similar situation with my steering not returning to center.
Prior to my new ball joints (moog), the X seemed to drive pretty good on the fwy. I had recently added V/B mod springs new shocks and tires. Since I did so much work I took it to an alignment shop and they said I need new everything in my front end.
So I added ....
New ball joints upper and lower
New front end links left and right
New steering link
and one more link I can't remember what its called.
After I added the ball joints the steering was not good on the fwy and it was all over the road it did not and does not return to center. This was causing me to steer the X to keep it centered.
The alignment shop told me the ball joints are tight and need to break in.
Prior to the ball joints it seem good and I can see that the ball joints are somewhat breaking in....
I lowered the air in my tires and I removed the steering dampener. These have helped the drive but not fully. I feel that my steering box is too tight from the previous owner and is not returning to center because of this.
My theory...Since my old ball joints were no good the tight steering box compensated for this which made the drive ok. But with good and tight ball joints the steering box may now be too tight on it causing it to not return to center. I am going to back it off a bit and hope that it has not been overtightened and now no good which may have me purchasing a redhead steering box.
and then ....
I just backed off the steering box by about a 1/4 turn (loosened it) and it has helped the constant steer I had to do while I was on the fwy.
It didn't completely remove the issue with it not returning to center but it drives much better.
I also removed the end links from the each of the knuckles and turned them by hand and they turn free, smooth and are not binding. They don't feel tight at all. As soon as I hook it all up and move the wheels by hand it is tighter.
The most recent thing I did was to toe in my alignment which was pretty much at 0. It is now 1/8" toed in and it has helped it driving straight and returning to center. I may be doing it some more so that it is at 1/4" toed in which is the max you should do.
Tim M
I am currently dealing with a similar situation with my steering not returning to center.
Prior to my new ball joints (moog), the X seemed to drive pretty good on the fwy. I had recently added V/B mod springs new shocks and tires. Since I did so much work I took it to an alignment shop and they said I need new everything in my front end.
So I added ....
New ball joints upper and lower
New front end links left and right
New steering link
and one more link I can't remember what its called.
After I added the ball joints the steering was not good on the fwy and it was all over the road it did not and does not return to center. This was causing me to steer the X to keep it centered.
The alignment shop told me the ball joints are tight and need to break in.
Prior to the ball joints it seem good and I can see that the ball joints are somewhat breaking in....
I lowered the air in my tires and I removed the steering dampener. These have helped the drive but not fully. I feel that my steering box is too tight from the previous owner and is not returning to center because of this.
My theory...Since my old ball joints were no good the tight steering box compensated for this which made the drive ok. But with good and tight ball joints the steering box may now be too tight on it causing it to not return to center. I am going to back it off a bit and hope that it has not been overtightened and now no good which may have me purchasing a redhead steering box.
and then ....
I just backed off the steering box by about a 1/4 turn (loosened it) and it has helped the constant steer I had to do while I was on the fwy.
It didn't completely remove the issue with it not returning to center but it drives much better.
I also removed the end links from the each of the knuckles and turned them by hand and they turn free, smooth and are not binding. They don't feel tight at all. As soon as I hook it all up and move the wheels by hand it is tighter.
The most recent thing I did was to toe in my alignment which was pretty much at 0. It is now 1/8" toed in and it has helped it driving straight and returning to center. I may be doing it some more so that it is at 1/4" toed in which is the max you should do.
Tim M
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Senior User
Joined: Dec 2004
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From: sw mich
I think I answered my own question about the bushings. After looking at a picture of the BJ without the boot, it makes sense to me how the bushing should set on the brass-colored lip.
I guess as long as the bushing seats down enough that it can't rotate, it shouldn't really matter how far down it sits. Tightness in the steering is more of a function of the torque on the upper ball joint. I torqued mine to 69 lbs.
Here is a picture of what mine looks like - pretty similar to Tim's, but my gap is bigger, - about 3/32".
[/IMG]
I guess as long as the bushing seats down enough that it can't rotate, it shouldn't really matter how far down it sits. Tightness in the steering is more of a function of the torque on the upper ball joint. I torqued mine to 69 lbs.
Here is a picture of what mine looks like - pretty similar to Tim's, but my gap is bigger, - about 3/32".
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