start up current draws......
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start up current draws......
work required me to get a new fluke clamp on ammeter
that has a flex loop current transformer loop for large
loads up to 2,500 amps. that isn't the interesting part.
it also has a remote display that is good up to 30' or so.
so i can clamp it on the battery cable, start up the van,
drive off, and see what kinda current flow is going on...
so i did.
'06 E-350 6.0, stock FICM, stock alternator, 120 amp
is what is marked on it. (haven't put on the DC power
unit yet. busy with work)
open door and turn on interior lights, 2.5 amps.
KOEO, 185 amps for cold engine start up.
cranking, 685 amps. vehicle starts immediately.
idling @ 650 rpm, 85 amp discharge on the batteries.
the full output of the alternator isn't enough to feed the
cold engine warm up load...... so it keeps drawing down
on the batteries till it gets warm.
are these numbers typical in your guys experience?
that has a flex loop current transformer loop for large
loads up to 2,500 amps. that isn't the interesting part.
it also has a remote display that is good up to 30' or so.
so i can clamp it on the battery cable, start up the van,
drive off, and see what kinda current flow is going on...
so i did.
'06 E-350 6.0, stock FICM, stock alternator, 120 amp
is what is marked on it. (haven't put on the DC power
unit yet. busy with work)
open door and turn on interior lights, 2.5 amps.
KOEO, 185 amps for cold engine start up.
cranking, 685 amps. vehicle starts immediately.
idling @ 650 rpm, 85 amp discharge on the batteries.
the full output of the alternator isn't enough to feed the
cold engine warm up load...... so it keeps drawing down
on the batteries till it gets warm.
are these numbers typical in your guys experience?
Posting Guru
Joined: Oct 2011
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From: Las Vegas, Nevada
Excuse me Mr. Apolo 13, since I don't have your fancy toy how am I suppose to know these numbers that you got
.
That's very interesting to know. How about when (approximately how many miles after driving) does the alternator start charging the batteries?
Do you have the stereo running at idle or was it off?
How much is that toy anyway? I like to get one if the price is reasonable, but since it a Fluke the thing may cost an arm and a leg, plus my first born
.That's very interesting to know. How about when (approximately how many miles after driving) does the alternator start charging the batteries?
Do you have the stereo running at idle or was it off?
How much is that toy anyway? I like to get one if the price is reasonable, but since it a Fluke the thing may cost an arm and a leg, plus my first born
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That's very interesting to know. How about when (approximately how many miles after driving) does the alternator start charging the batteries?
Do you have the stereo running at idle or was it off?
How much is that toy anyway? I like to get one if the price is reasonable, but since it a Fluke the thing may cost an arm and a leg, plus my first born
Do you have the stereo running at idle or was it off?
How much is that toy anyway? I like to get one if the price is reasonable, but since it a Fluke the thing may cost an arm and a leg, plus my first born
the main reason for the remote display, is to move the person
reading the instrument far enough away from the energized
conductors or bus bars that they don't have to be wearing the
arc flash protection.
i really wanted a fluke 435 power analyzer, but they are $8k,
so that didn't happen... chief financial officer (spouse) gave me
"the look" when i mentioned what a wonderful tool it was.
it's not that wonderful, and if i need one that bad, i can rent it.
stereo was off..... i let it run and drove for about 5 minutes, then
pulled it off and went to work.. it wasn't charging after five minutes,
still discharging....
Elder User
Joined: Jan 2004
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From: Arizona
Your Glow plugs are drawing it down. You should notice this by monitoring you battery voltage on every cold start. It will be around 12v-12.5v then jump up to 13v-13.7v when the glow plugs are off after a couple min.
VQT, you can get a basic ammeter for a lot less money. Its no Fancy Toy.
VQT, you can get a basic ammeter for a lot less money. Its no Fancy Toy.
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and clamp the meter around the ground lead, it'll show
2.5, and if you reverse it, -2.5
so flip it till you get a minus, and it's showing a discharge.
when the minus disappears, it's showing a charge. current
is going the other way.
then hit max/min/ave button, and you can cycle thru peak
values... as they are absolutes, peak current flow will show
as a min value, and charging a max value.
the vanilla was warm, so i went and tested again, right now.
start up circuit drew 35 amps discharge with remote start,
including fuel pump and engine control loads,
551 amps cranking, 43 amps charging at idle, right after
starting. this is a 100 millisecond sample rate, so it's realistic.
it disregards spikes
so, it would seem that the cold start portion of the program
draws 150 amps till the vehicle is warmed up.
no wonder batteries get hosed with the OEM alternator.
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The small case 6G alternator isn't really being drawn down, it just takes a few moments to ramp up the voltage. Similar to older 1-wire GM alternators. It isn't as quick start as the older 2G and 3G alternators.
It's funny you did this as I did my own testing on the green/red excite wire today. I have heard the instrument cluster holds back 30 seconds or so for the glow plugs to cut-out to "excite" the alternator.
That wasn't the case today on my 2006 F250. KOEO no power. Key-Run, 1.5 volts. KOER 12+ volts continuous ramping up to 13.6 volts.
About 55 degrees this morning and about 75 when I got off of work.
Josh
It's funny you did this as I did my own testing on the green/red excite wire today. I have heard the instrument cluster holds back 30 seconds or so for the glow plugs to cut-out to "excite" the alternator.
That wasn't the case today on my 2006 F250. KOEO no power. Key-Run, 1.5 volts. KOER 12+ volts continuous ramping up to 13.6 volts.
About 55 degrees this morning and about 75 when I got off of work.
Josh
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Lead Driver
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I have a 400A DC clamp meter and see about 165A after a cold start, with GPs on. Pretty amazing numbers, huh?
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my current thought is i should put on the dc power tomorrow.
so you are pulling 165 amps discharge with it idling? where are you clamped
on at? i picked the ground cable between minus post and frame,
so i'd see what current flow was going into and out of the batteries.
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yup. my first thought was, holy chit!
my current thought is i should put on the dc power tomorrow.
so you are pulling 165 amps discharge with it idling? where are you clamped
on at? i picked the ground cable between minus post and frame,
so i'd see what current flow was going into and out of the batteries.
my current thought is i should put on the dc power tomorrow.
so you are pulling 165 amps discharge with it idling? where are you clamped
on at? i picked the ground cable between minus post and frame,
so i'd see what current flow was going into and out of the batteries.
85 amps KOER (key on, engine run)
Josh
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From: N. Fort Worth, tx
I am by noway surprised by the numbers. if anything they are just a little lower then I would have guessed ( 725 was my guess)
anyway now back to the program.
the alternator will not come on till the gpcm times out. gpcm timer is 2 min of on time. the light really means nothing.
you have to be able to sustain the load of everything going on for that length of time. The weeker the batteries the longer it will take to recharge them and show a positive state.
anyway now back to the program.
the alternator will not come on till the gpcm times out. gpcm timer is 2 min of on time. the light really means nothing.
you have to be able to sustain the load of everything going on for that length of time. The weeker the batteries the longer it will take to recharge them and show a positive state.
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I am by noway surprised by the numbers. if anything they are just a little lower then I would have guessed ( 725 was my guess)
anyway now back to the program.
the alternator will not come on till the gpcm times out. gpcm timer is 2 min of on time. the light really means nothing.
you have to be able to sustain the load of everything going on for that length of time. The weeker the batteries the longer it will take to recharge them and show a positive state.
anyway now back to the program.
the alternator will not come on till the gpcm times out. gpcm timer is 2 min of on time. the light really means nothing.
you have to be able to sustain the load of everything going on for that length of time. The weeker the batteries the longer it will take to recharge them and show a positive state.
https://www.fleet.ford.com/truckbbas/non-html/Q91.pdf
And that was my experience in testing this theory this morning and this afternoon. The excite wire was activated as soon as the engine started.
Josh
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From: N. Fort Worth, tx
belive me or belive that I dont care. I know what one is correct.
also you have duel alt's? as that is what that is for.
go put a volt meter on your batterys and grab a stop watch. ill wait.
reality is not everything ford has in print is correct. sorry if im seeming like an ***. not tring to be
also you have duel alt's? as that is what that is for.
go put a volt meter on your batterys and grab a stop watch. ill wait.
reality is not everything ford has in print is correct. sorry if im seeming like an ***. not tring to be
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I am by noway surprised by the numbers. if anything they are just a little lower then I would have guessed ( 725 was my guess)
anyway now back to the program.
the alternator will not come on till the gpcm times out. gpcm timer is 2 min of on time. the light really means nothing.
you have to be able to sustain the load of everything going on for that length of time. The weeker the batteries the longer it will take to recharge them and show a positive state.
anyway now back to the program.
the alternator will not come on till the gpcm times out. gpcm timer is 2 min of on time. the light really means nothing.
you have to be able to sustain the load of everything going on for that length of time. The weeker the batteries the longer it will take to recharge them and show a positive state.