Nee help on starter, please
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Mountain Pass
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 227
Likes: 1
Nee help on starter, please
Hi,
in last fall I build my engine and transformed the tired 400 into a muscular 408 with some TMI flattops, headers etc.
Due to a lot more pressure in the chambers the starter has to do heavy work now and a want to replace it with a new one with a step down gear from later models.
The p/n I found on the starter is : C7AF-11001-B
it´s a 1977 400 with C6 trans.
Can somebody tell me a from what type of engine family and car/truck range a starter with gear will fit into my application, please ?
My F100 is in germany and I would avoid to order such a heavy part in the US so I wanna look in the scrapyards or second hand or at least buy a new one but as cheap as possible ....
Any infos are appreciated, thank you !!
in last fall I build my engine and transformed the tired 400 into a muscular 408 with some TMI flattops, headers etc.
Due to a lot more pressure in the chambers the starter has to do heavy work now and a want to replace it with a new one with a step down gear from later models.
The p/n I found on the starter is : C7AF-11001-B
it´s a 1977 400 with C6 trans.
Can somebody tell me a from what type of engine family and car/truck range a starter with gear will fit into my application, please ?
My F100 is in germany and I would avoid to order such a heavy part in the US so I wanna look in the scrapyards or second hand or at least buy a new one but as cheap as possible ....
Any infos are appreciated, thank you !!
Laughing Gas
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 1,107
Likes: 32
From: Spokane, WA
If you can't find a factory option, you can always go the Powermaster route. They make starters in varying torque specifications to account for different compression ratings of engines. They also have them for the 335 class engines. I got one for Buford, and it bolted right in. Don't know if it works worth a darn yet, but it bolted right in. 
Also the powermaster starters are smaller in size which should help on shipping, and they're smaller in design so they don't suffer as much from heat soak like stock starters do on modified engines sometimes. Anyway, it's an option if you don't find a factory alternative.
Also the powermaster starters are smaller in size which should help on shipping, and they're smaller in design so they don't suffer as much from heat soak like stock starters do on modified engines sometimes. Anyway, it's an option if you don't find a factory alternative.
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Mountain Pass
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 227
Likes: 1
Yes, thank you for showing me the "powermaster route" ....
This would be the choice if I won´t find a second hand starter in my area. As I remember the 400 was released until 1982 in passenger cars and light trucks. Although this is almost 30 years ago it´s not a problem being in the US, guess there are a lot of ´yards that carry 335 stuff.....
... but being in germany it´s a real problem !
For me it would be essential to know from what year on a starter with step down gear was used or - is there a gear starter type of a other (later build) engine family beside the 335 series which will fit to broaden my bandwidth to search for.
This would be the choice if I won´t find a second hand starter in my area. As I remember the 400 was released until 1982 in passenger cars and light trucks. Although this is almost 30 years ago it´s not a problem being in the US, guess there are a lot of ´yards that carry 335 stuff.....
... but being in germany it´s a real problem !
For me it would be essential to know from what year on a starter with step down gear was used or - is there a gear starter type of a other (later build) engine family beside the 335 series which will fit to broaden my bandwidth to search for.
Postmaster
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 3,940
Likes: 8
From: Southern Oregon Coast
Summit Racing lists a bunch of starters that fit 351M/400/429/460 - Looks like 335 and 385 series engines use the same starter but tooth count might become an issue depending on application...
I don't imagine 460's are any easier to find in Germany than 400's are...
For reference:
SummitRacing.com
I don't imagine 460's are any easier to find in Germany than 400's are...
For reference:
SummitRacing.com
Thread Starter
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Mountain Pass
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 227
Likes: 1
Well I was right on the way klicking my order at Summit when I stopped and thought maybe somebody here can help me ....
Perhaps this question makes it easier : does anybody know is there even ANY factory starter with step down gear for a 335/385 series or do I have to go aftermarket ANYWAY ?
Perhaps this question makes it easier : does anybody know is there even ANY factory starter with step down gear for a 335/385 series or do I have to go aftermarket ANYWAY ?
Ford Parts Specialist
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 88,826
Likes: 787
From: Simi Valley, CA
This is not the correct A/T starter for a 400.
It was used on A/T 240 I-6 & 221/260/289/302/351C/351W passenger cars.
A/T 240/300/302/351W (1981 and later) F100/350's / 1969/96 302 & 1975/96 351W Econolines / 1980/96 300 I-6; 1969/96 302; 1981/96 351W Bronco's.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
ID engineering numbers: D1AF-11001-AA / D2AF-11001-AA / D5AF-11001-EA / D8AF-11001-AA / E1TF-11001-BA > >
You need the A/T starter (with one of the above ID numbers) from a:
400 1971/79 Passenger Car / 351M 1975/79 Passenger Car // 351M/400: 1977/79 F100/350 / 1978/82 Bronco / 1980/82 F150/350 & Econoline.
The M/T starter is NOT the same.
Posting Guru
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 2,003
Likes: 2
From: chicago burbs
somehow i got on the wrong thread. there were no gear reduction starters from 'back in the day', but there are some from the 90's production that may retrofit to your application. they may or may not have an extra mount bolt hole that just doesn't get used
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Mountain Pass
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 227
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Bill, I hoped you would read this thread, that´s why I posted the p/n ... I had a sneaking suspicion .... 
Thank you for this information !
.... but all the 20 years I own this truck the starter worked ....
ID engineering numbers: D1AF-11001-AA / D2AF-11001-AA / D5AF-11001-EA / D8AF-11001-AA / E1TF-11001-BA > >
Are you able to tell me, please is one of your listed starters armed with a step down gear ?
Thank you for this information !
.... but all the 20 years I own this truck the starter worked ....
ID engineering numbers: D1AF-11001-AA / D2AF-11001-AA / D5AF-11001-EA / D8AF-11001-AA / E1TF-11001-BA > >
Are you able to tell me, please is one of your listed starters armed with a step down gear ?
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Mountain Pass
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 227
Likes: 1
@ grclark :
Well, the timing is at 10 BTDC at the time. Last week I throwed in a new special recurved duraspark and the seller advised me to put the timing on 12-14, that would be even more and put more load on the starter.
I want to adjust the timing coming weekend, what do you think is best to do, please ?
Well, the timing is at 10 BTDC at the time. Last week I throwed in a new special recurved duraspark and the seller advised me to put the timing on 12-14, that would be even more and put more load on the starter.
I want to adjust the timing coming weekend, what do you think is best to do, please ?
Ford Parts Specialist
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 88,826
Likes: 787
From: Simi Valley, CA
Bill, I hoped you would read this thread, that´s why I posted the p/n ... I had a sneaking suspicion ....
Thank you for this information.... but all the 20 years I own this truck the starter worked ....
That fact that it bolts on...does not mean it's correct.
ID engineering numbers: D1AF-11001-AA / D2AF-11001-AA / D5AF-11001-EA / D8AF-11001-AA / E1TF-11001-BA > >
Are you able to tell me, please is one of your listed starters armed with a step down gear ?
Thank you for this information.... but all the 20 years I own this truck the starter worked ....
That fact that it bolts on...does not mean it's correct.
ID engineering numbers: D1AF-11001-AA / D2AF-11001-AA / D5AF-11001-EA / D8AF-11001-AA / E1TF-11001-BA > >
Are you able to tell me, please is one of your listed starters armed with a step down gear ?
Ford used the same starter drive in all: 200/240/250/300 I-6 / 221/260/289/302/351C/351M/351W/352/360/390/400:
D6PZ11350B (replaced C6VY11350A) .. Starter Drive (Motorcraft SD302)
Thread Starter
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Mountain Pass
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 227
Likes: 1
OK, maybe I choosed the wrong words or tech terms using a translator when I said "step down gear", better is "gear reduction ratio".
The powermaster p/n 9605 ( NOT 9606 as I posted before, sorry ) i. e. has a gear reduction ratio of 4.4:1, I need a reduction for the starter due to the higher chamber compression. The actual starter has not and works really hard sometimes getting the 400 to run ....
Thank you for the infos, you are very helpful !
The powermaster p/n 9605 ( NOT 9606 as I posted before, sorry ) i. e. has a gear reduction ratio of 4.4:1, I need a reduction for the starter due to the higher chamber compression. The actual starter has not and works really hard sometimes getting the 400 to run ....
Thank you for the infos, you are very helpful !
Ford Parts Specialist
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 88,826
Likes: 787
From: Simi Valley, CA
Some 1970's Lincoln's & Mark's w/460's / 1970's fullsized Ford's, Merc's and T-Bird's with 429/460's have a gear reduction starter.
I see you live in Germany...beautiful country, I've been there twice on vacations. 2000 (Berlin/Dresden), 2001 (Deutches Wein Strasse and etc).
Elder User
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 576
Likes: 0
When i rebuilt my 400, i just went to advance auto and got a lifetime warrenty starter. I went to much high compression too, but the "stock" style starter still spins the engine over just fine. If it ever dies...i'll just go and get a new one because of the warranty.
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Mountain Pass
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 227
Likes: 1
Hey Bill, that´s fine, I see you picked up some nice places to visit, hope you enjoyed your time here !
I`ve been in the US to, but it only lasted for New York City, so far..... hope to come again for a NASCAR race and travel some states !
Sorry to ask again but is one of the ID engineering no´s you´ve posted before the gear reduction type for the 1970´ Lincoln´s, Mark´s or fullsized Ford´s etc. ?
This would help me getting in touch with second hand dealers.
Thank you anyway, Bill !
I`ve been in the US to, but it only lasted for New York City, so far..... hope to come again for a NASCAR race and travel some states !
Sorry to ask again but is one of the ID engineering no´s you´ve posted before the gear reduction type for the 1970´ Lincoln´s, Mark´s or fullsized Ford´s etc. ?
This would help me getting in touch with second hand dealers.
Thank you anyway, Bill !