EBPV Jake brake mod.
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Posting Guru
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From: Amarillo, TX
EBPV Jake brake mod.
I remember seeing something regarding a "rig" using the EBPV as a exhaust brake. Has anyone done this? Does it work. And do you know where a do it yourself thread is?
Thanks for your input.
Thanks for your input.
Cargo Master
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 2,502
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From: Bend Oregon
I have seen write ups on here about how to do it but then I saw this on PHP's site and decided against it. It makes perfect sense to me....pay attention to the bold blue toward the bottom.
Do you offer a "Decel" or "Exhaust Brake" calibration?
Simply put, no, we don't because it goes against our basic tenet which, in part, is to provide safe, reliable products to our customers.
For those who don't know, this is a calibration that uses the EBV (Exhaust Backpressure Valve) as a makeshift exhaust brake. While this setup may work reasonably well for lightly loaded vehicles, we generally do not recommend this type of calibration... at least not for automatic transmission vehicles. There are a few reasons we don't recommend this.
First, in order to transfer the energy of the moving vehicle to the engine during deceleration, two things must occur: the torque converter must remain locked, and the coast clutch must be engaged. The problem with this is that the coast clutch on a stock transmission only has 3 friction plates, and these are smaller than the standard forward clutches. On 2001 and later transmissions, you also run the possibility of damaging the intermediate sprag or "diode," which will result in an immediate transmission teardown. Again, lightly loaded vehicles would have less of a problem with this, but the general idea of an exhaust brake is to be able to slow larger loads without overheating the standard brake system. It is these types of loads that can cause transmission damage. Obviously, a manual transmission would be free from these types of situations.
Second, whenever you increase exhaust backpressure, you need to make sure that the exhaust valve springs are capable of preventing the pressure in the exhaust system from lifting the exhaust valve from the valve seat, as this would result in a collision with the piston. Normal valve spring seat pressure is 70-75 PSI for NEW valve springs and deteriorates from there. Given that the surface area of the back of the exhaust valve is approximately 1.9 square inches, it would take only 40 PSI of exhaust pressure to lift the valve off the seat, even with new valve springs.
To put it simply, if you plan to use an exhaust brake, either through the use of the EBV or by purchasing an aftermarket stand alone unit, you will need to consider the condition of your transmission and exhaust valve springs in order to ensure safe, reliable operation.
Do you offer a "Decel" or "Exhaust Brake" calibration?
Simply put, no, we don't because it goes against our basic tenet which, in part, is to provide safe, reliable products to our customers.
For those who don't know, this is a calibration that uses the EBV (Exhaust Backpressure Valve) as a makeshift exhaust brake. While this setup may work reasonably well for lightly loaded vehicles, we generally do not recommend this type of calibration... at least not for automatic transmission vehicles. There are a few reasons we don't recommend this.
First, in order to transfer the energy of the moving vehicle to the engine during deceleration, two things must occur: the torque converter must remain locked, and the coast clutch must be engaged. The problem with this is that the coast clutch on a stock transmission only has 3 friction plates, and these are smaller than the standard forward clutches. On 2001 and later transmissions, you also run the possibility of damaging the intermediate sprag or "diode," which will result in an immediate transmission teardown. Again, lightly loaded vehicles would have less of a problem with this, but the general idea of an exhaust brake is to be able to slow larger loads without overheating the standard brake system. It is these types of loads that can cause transmission damage. Obviously, a manual transmission would be free from these types of situations.
Second, whenever you increase exhaust backpressure, you need to make sure that the exhaust valve springs are capable of preventing the pressure in the exhaust system from lifting the exhaust valve from the valve seat, as this would result in a collision with the piston. Normal valve spring seat pressure is 70-75 PSI for NEW valve springs and deteriorates from there. Given that the surface area of the back of the exhaust valve is approximately 1.9 square inches, it would take only 40 PSI of exhaust pressure to lift the valve off the seat, even with new valve springs.
To put it simply, if you plan to use an exhaust brake, either through the use of the EBV or by purchasing an aftermarket stand alone unit, you will need to consider the condition of your transmission and exhaust valve springs in order to ensure safe, reliable operation.
Postmaster
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 2,544
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From: Suffolk, VA
That's an interesting take on it and I can't argue the transmission part of it. But I'm not certain I can agree with 40 psi in the exhaust port even being close enough to lift the exhaust valve off its seat. Maybe Eugene can whip up a formula to see about this.
Postmaster
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 3,524
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From: CA Bay Area
Too lazy to find the thread, but several members are driving with it and reported to be happy.
There is still possibility that those who had the idea bringing the engine meltdown are no longer coming here.
Having manual transmission I don't have that dilemma and am considering installing toggle switch, but than I don't haul trailers and going downhill I usually let it coast at 80 mph.
There is still possibility that those who had the idea bringing the engine meltdown are no longer coming here.
Having manual transmission I don't have that dilemma and am considering installing toggle switch, but than I don't haul trailers and going downhill I usually let it coast at 80 mph.
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Posting Guru
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From: Amarillo, TX
Too lazy to find the thread, but several members are driving with it and reported to be happy.
There is still possibility that those who had the idea bringing the engine meltdown are no longer coming here.
Having manual transmission I don't have that dilemma and am considering installing toggle switch, but than I don't haul trailers and going downhill I usually let it coast at 80 mph.
There is still possibility that those who had the idea bringing the engine meltdown are no longer coming here.
Having manual transmission I don't have that dilemma and am considering installing toggle switch, but than I don't haul trailers and going downhill I usually let it coast at 80 mph.
Postmaster
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 3,524
Likes: 2
From: CA Bay Area
Yeah. The trailers can be killers. I had situation few years back with 1-ton Chevy. Going downhill with 6000 lb boat I underestimated the gear and had it on 3rd (out of 5)
With the engine screaming above 4000 rpm I still had to use brakes a lot.
The hill was only 3/4 mile but at the bottom where the stop sign was my brake pedal went to the floor. Fortunately at night nobody was there and when I finally stopped with parking brake I could see my front rotors glowing.
I still could drive it long way home after cooling down the brakes, but that was the last straw to part out old Chevy and get Ford.
With the engine screaming above 4000 rpm I still had to use brakes a lot.
The hill was only 3/4 mile but at the bottom where the stop sign was my brake pedal went to the floor. Fortunately at night nobody was there and when I finally stopped with parking brake I could see my front rotors glowing.
I still could drive it long way home after cooling down the brakes, but that was the last straw to part out old Chevy and get Ford.
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Of the next Riffraff East
Joined: Oct 2004
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From: Concord NC
Well, I have it on my DP-Tuner and it works great. Coming down the steep downgrade on I40 just east of Asheville towing my 8k travel trailer, I used it with the transmission out of OD. Never had to touch the brakes, not once, I did however have to take it out to Decel several times to keep from going too slow. I've used it several times and will tell you it does work. I can't answer to the statement above, but I've used it several times and for several miles at a time and I'm still running strong. I do have an auto tranny and for those that might wonder, EGT's were very low will in Decel, 400-475 was about what I was seeing all the way down the hill. Folks have been using Jake Brakes for an long time and it's the principle as far I know. This is the first time I've heard about it and it's just one opinion. So, until something else comes along, I'll be using it every time I tow my TT and need to slow up while going down the mountains....
Go Bills !
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 2,778
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From: Buffalo, NY
I use my EBPV to help slow me down.. Works well. Especially while pulling the camper..
https://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/2...brake-mod.html
I got the idea from there.. I added LED's and a switch to this setup.. I can see what the EPBV is being told what to do and what i tell it to do.
https://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/2...brake-mod.html
I got the idea from there.. I added LED's and a switch to this setup.. I can see what the EPBV is being told what to do and what i tell it to do.
Postmaster
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 3,524
Likes: 2
From: CA Bay Area
I have one more purpose for the EBPV switch, that for me would be more important than help in braking.
Living in CA I don't have to worry much about pre-warming and usually just start the engine and drive. I live close to highway and even with 60F outside, the 1/4 mile drive will not warm up the engine. So when I enter the highway and try to accelerate the EBPV is holding the engine on low rpm and I annoy others crawling at 15 mph for hundreds of yards before I reach downhill and EBPV will let go.
So I would like to make the 3-way switch that in center position would hold factory wiring, going down would turn EBPV on for braking and going up would disconnect the EBPV for cold engine acceleration.
My concern is possible voltage spikes and possible error codes for disconnecting EBPV.
Did anyone try it this way? I heard suggestion about pulling EBPV plug off to disconnect it, but nobody reported back doing it with, or without codes.
BTW >> "Jake" is a brand name usually associated with engine valves system reset for braking.
What we are talking here is pure exhaust brake.
Living in CA I don't have to worry much about pre-warming and usually just start the engine and drive. I live close to highway and even with 60F outside, the 1/4 mile drive will not warm up the engine. So when I enter the highway and try to accelerate the EBPV is holding the engine on low rpm and I annoy others crawling at 15 mph for hundreds of yards before I reach downhill and EBPV will let go.
So I would like to make the 3-way switch that in center position would hold factory wiring, going down would turn EBPV on for braking and going up would disconnect the EBPV for cold engine acceleration.
My concern is possible voltage spikes and possible error codes for disconnecting EBPV.
Did anyone try it this way? I heard suggestion about pulling EBPV plug off to disconnect it, but nobody reported back doing it with, or without codes.
BTW >> "Jake" is a brand name usually associated with engine valves system reset for braking.
What we are talking here is pure exhaust brake.
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