Gray vs. Black CPS test
Postmaster
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 3,266
Likes: 0
From: Levittown
Iam begining to believe the 3,8 is from hpop oil
or fuel and the grey sensor unmasks it. The 3 and 8 fire
right after a cyl has fired in the same bank (head).
Would be nice to see the #s with an HX also.
Bill
or fuel and the grey sensor unmasks it. The 3 and 8 fire
right after a cyl has fired in the same bank (head).
Would be nice to see the #s with an HX also.
Bill
Hotshot
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 11,286
Likes: 263
From: North of Greenville
I still have the LL, and also have the HPX and am getting ready to install the DFA RR as an upgrade to my CCK, then I can figure out how to use my newly purchased AE for the IPR duty cycles, rotational velocities, and the CCT's.
I also still have a couple of brand new gray CPS units, one used gray CPS, and one used black CPS, none of which have given me any trouble.
...hehe... if that's not a mouthful of acronyms, I don't know what is!!
I also still have a couple of brand new gray CPS units, one used gray CPS, and one used black CPS, none of which have given me any trouble.
...hehe... if that's not a mouthful of acronyms, I don't know what is!!
Thread Starter
|
Post Fiend
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 26,966
Likes: 50
From: Texas
I'm pretty sure others have seen the same issues even with the crossover, including those without the LL. Interesting observation though. We'll need to wait for others to chime in who have seen similar issues.
Molon Labe
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 5,272
Likes: 1
From: Alaska
I just walked out of SunState International in Sarasota FL with the last black cps they had in stock. Part #1821720C99 $25.12
Installed it, took a short drive. It seems to idle smoother, and the applause from #8 didn't sound as loud....maybe its the plasebo affect?
Installed it, took a short drive. It seems to idle smoother, and the applause from #8 didn't sound as loud....maybe its the plasebo affect?
Thread Starter
|
Post Fiend
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 26,966
Likes: 50
From: Texas
For 99-03 7.3L, another way to use AutoEnginuity to see if there are problems with a particular cylinder is to monitor the "Cylinder x Change Rotational Vel" or "Percentage of Crank Deceleration" PID (also commonly called PERDEL). This PID exists for all 8 cylinders and is a representation of crankshaft velocity change (decrease) at the time the cylinder is firing. Ideally, these should all read 0%. Any cylinder consistently reading more than 3-5% change in rotational velocity is suspect and should be further examined. Note: Engine should be fully warmed up before checking PERDEL data.
FTE Stories
Ford Trucks for Ford Truck Enthusiasts
Rezvani's Latest Post-Apocalytic Monster Is a Ford F-150 Raptor Underneath
Verdad Gallardo
Top 10 Most Expensive Ford Trucks Ever Sold on Bring a Trailer
Joe Kucinski
2027 Ford Super Duty Buyer's Guide (Every Model, Engine, & Package)
Brett Foote
Top 10 Ford Truck Tragedies
Joe Kucinski
AEV FXL Super Duty - the Super Duty Raptor Ford Doesn't Make
Brett Foote
Lobo Vs Lobo: Proof the F-150 Lobo Should Be Even Lower!
Michael S. Palmer
Ford's 2001 Explorer Sportsman Concept Looks For a New Home
Verdad Gallardo
10 Best Ford Truck Engines We Miss the Most!
Joe Kucinski
2026 Shelby F-150 Off-Road: Better Than a Raptor R?
Brett Foote
More Turbo
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 636
Likes: 7
From: La Mesa, Ca.
I read many threads on the subject of this CPS sensor.
I want to ask a question that I have seen as yet.
the question is, What is the sensor?
Is it a magnetic pickup, that measures pulses from the cam gear?
Has any one measured the actual square pulse voltage and amplitude generated from the sensor?
Has anyone experimented with changing the gap between the sensor and the cam gear thereby changing the voltage generated?
Inquiring minds want to know!
thanks, Nick
I want to ask a question that I have seen as yet.
the question is, What is the sensor?
Is it a magnetic pickup, that measures pulses from the cam gear?
Has any one measured the actual square pulse voltage and amplitude generated from the sensor?
Has anyone experimented with changing the gap between the sensor and the cam gear thereby changing the voltage generated?
Inquiring minds want to know!
thanks, Nick
Thread Starter
|
Post Fiend
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 26,966
Likes: 50
From: Texas
I read many threads on the subject of this CPS sensor.
I want to ask a question that I have seen as yet.
the question is, What is the sensor?
Is it a magnetic pickup, that measures pulses from the cam gear?
Has any one measured the actual square pulse voltage and amplitude generated from the sensor?
Has anyone experimented with changing the gap between the sensor and the cam gear thereby changing the voltage generated?
Inquiring minds want to know!
thanks, Nick
I want to ask a question that I have seen as yet.
the question is, What is the sensor?
Is it a magnetic pickup, that measures pulses from the cam gear?
Has any one measured the actual square pulse voltage and amplitude generated from the sensor?
Has anyone experimented with changing the gap between the sensor and the cam gear thereby changing the voltage generated?
Inquiring minds want to know!
thanks, Nick
The manual says
<title>Camshaft Position (CMP) Sensor</title><link href="V2C%7Eus%7Een%7Efile=V2Cstyle.htm%7Egen%7Ere f.htm" type="text/css" rel="stylesheet">Signal Functions The camshaft position (CMP) sensor is a Hall-effect type sensor that generates a digital frequency, as windows in a target wheel pass through its magnetic field. The frequency of the windows passing by the sensor as well as the width of selected windows allows the powertrain control module (PCM) to detect engine speed and position.
So, yes it's a magnet picking up grooves in the cam gear. The OBS trucks have used shims in the CPS, but as I understand it, that was to prevent contact during cam walk, not to change anything generated by the sensor.
Here's a picture of the grooves (squares) in the cam gear. You'll note the one larger square and one skinny square, which notes the #1 & #4 cylinder position for timing purposes.
More Turbo
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 636
Likes: 7
From: La Mesa, Ca.
To measure the actual signal you have to place a meter across the two leads that are attached to the sensor, without opening the circuit. You might be able to use a digital meter to measure voltage, but probably need a scope to see the pulses generated, since the pulses would be of variable frequency. It would be interesting to do some experimenting to see the actual raw signal from the device, rather than the interpretation from a reader and software.
nick
nick
Thread Starter
|
Post Fiend
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 26,966
Likes: 50
From: Texas
Do you have an oscillascope Nick? I don't, and I doubt a meter would give sufficient readings based on the frequency involved. Since you seem to know what you're talking about, we volunteer you to look into this.
Of course then we'd need to understand the readings well enough to understand if or how a shim/shaving might be beneficial.
Of course then we'd need to understand the readings well enough to understand if or how a shim/shaving might be beneficial.
More Turbo
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 636
Likes: 7
From: La Mesa, Ca.
I wish I did have the right equipment to do the tests and then be able to compare the different sensors under the same conditions. Whats interesting to me, is the fact that the sensor is measuring the magnetic changes presented by each position of the cam. The physical position of the sensor could change the output of the sensor dramatically, thereby giving the CPU incorrect or weak signals.
Nick
Nick
Thread Starter
|
Post Fiend
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 26,966
Likes: 50
From: Texas
Magnets don't typically just instantaneously go bad, so I don't really understand the mode of failure with these things. With that said, would shimming the CPS (if it fixed the rougher idle) have any affect on the typical issues we usually associate with the CPS?