And get that new 09' F-150 to market before the company implodes. A multi year Ford stock price chart looks very ominous to say the least. What's a price chart got to do with the new F-150? Plenty. It's a microcosm of the financials of the company. The F-150 is Fords' bread and butter vehicle. And as you can all see things ain't looking to rosy.

http://bigcharts.marketwatch.com/qui...freq=2&time=20

 

It's no secret Ford's stock is down in the dumps. It's no secret they are losing money...they lost more than $12 Billion last year! What do you expect their stock to do, increase 200% while they are still losing money?

Have you been in a hole? Or had someone hidden your TV, newspaper, radio, AND computer for the last 5 years?

No offense intended, just letting you know you have stated the obvious.

 

[QUOTE=ArtsBest]And get that new 09' F-150 to market before the company implodes. A multi year Ford stock price chart looks very ominous to say the least. What's a price chart got to do with the new F-150? Plenty. It's a microcosm of the financials of the company. The F-150 is Fords' bread and butter vehicle. And as you can all see things ain't looking to rosy.

http://bigcharts.marketwatch.com/quickchart/quickchart.asp?symb=f&sid=0&o_symb=f&freq=2&time=2 0[/QUOTE]

It has been stated recently by many economist that Ford is actually handling down turn and rebuilding better than GM. And, Ford recently had an increase in intial quality, with some models scoring higher than Toyota. If anything Ford is right on track on rebuilding being it was the only one of the Big 3 that didn't go on strike this year. Sure, the F150 is BIG, but with sky rocketing sales of the Edge and Escape Ford is making money else where. Things look pretty good in my opinion.

 

it won't take much longer till people realize the mighty toyleta is nothing but an econobox manufacturer and not really adequate with the american life style...

 

Please, elaborate on your opinion...

 

Here we go sports fans, the T word had to come up. Any way I just heard that ford is doing better at this point than they expected, looses are down below what they had forcast. They are getting close to profitability which they expected by 09. Thier on track and the way forward seems to be working. They knew this wouldn't happen over night as they had a multi year plan. The cross over suv's are really doing well as they needed them to. All we can do is hope for the best and hope that ford is a good swimmer.

 

I just want to know what makes a vehicle make "adequate with the American lifstyle". I could care less if it is a Toyota, Nissan, Honda, Chevy, Dodge.... well you get the picture.

I do agree with ya on Ford's forward progress. They are building better products and they seem to be the only of the "Big 3" not wrapped up in UAW problems at the moment.

Now all we need is a 400 hp GT Mustang to compete with the Camaro and Challenger. ( without the aid of a supercharger )

Ah, it's nice to dream...

 

One thing that Toyota is lacking is a decent truck, If I cant load my four wheeler in the bed with out bending my tailgate, I don't want it. I use my truck as a truck and don't need it breaking when I do. America wants power, strength, quality, and durability. Toyota's are cheap plastic parts throw together as cheaply as possible, and sold for good fuel mileage. America has been down that road before, back in the 70s, once people get used to gas prices the big American vehicles will be back on top.

 

I just read where the mustang GT will be getting a 5.8 liter V-8 around 2010. They didn't say what the hp will be, but it's to compete with the V-8's from dodge and chevy in thier pony cars. I guess at 5.8 liters, it will be a boss 351. I need another 100 hp so I can compete with my 07. Sutton is experimenting with a head and cam package that will get 400 hp to the rear wheels on the 4.6. It's either something like that or super charge it.
Thats sorta strange, I thought the 77-79 ford trucks were some of the best ever, C -6 automatics, 4 speeds with granny low, 9' rear diffs, BW 205 t-cases and so on.

 

Well some of the early to mid 80's ford trucks had some of those good parts as well, but what they no longer had was the tuff as nails straight front axles on the 4x4's. The 70's 4x4's were the end of an era.

 

All the manufacturers are cutting weight wherever they can. Toyota's cheap plastic parts are the same as Chevy's, Fords, Dodge's and Nissans.

The Toyota tailgate fiasco hasn't seen much press yet, and prolly won't. Toyotas transmission problems and their quality ratings have dropped, but what difference that will make is yet to be seen. Most ppl are sheep when they buy cars/trucks today. They do little in the way of research = it's monkey see, monkey do.

As far as "big" American vehicles are concerned, the US car makers lost the passenger car market to the Japanese 25 years ago. If US cars ever get back on top again, it'll be a miracle. The full sized truck market will continue as a US dominated segment. Toyota and Nissan combined can only produce around 300,000 units per year. so nothing will change in the forseeable future.

The US's former stranglehold on the so-called mini truck market was lost years ago, and there's no sign anything will change. Sales of Tacomas are skyrocketing, while sales of Rangers & Colorado/Canyons are dropping like flies.

Many ppl today don't read the newspapers, and the TV news segments regarding Toyota's quality issues were covered in seconds. The only time spent on news stories by the left wing media types (who LOVE Toyota) is when it's about some gun crime = then it's a feeding frenzy.

 

So let me get this straight, American auto manufactures lost the passenger car market 25 years ago? (Many say this would have been labeled stage 1)

Then the mini truck market was lost "years ago"? (Stage 2?)

Now they will never take over the full size truck market?(if history teach's us anything full size trucks will be Toyota's as well).

I know the new Tundra has problems, all manufactures do. BUT the perception of better quality leads to more sales.

The fact they understand business tactics and lean manufacturing means they will not flood the channel as American auto manufactures do (any one paid sticker price in the last 10 years?). Channel management, less discounting leads to higher resale of used trucks (more sales).

Poorly managed short sited vision (All American auto manufactures believe they slap there label on it and it sales IE). So the American public brand loyalty actually hurt Ford, GM and Dodge. Why? Because big brass doesn't see the need to invest and improve in better product. Ford will sell the F-150 no matter what they come out with. Why invest in higher quality, more options? (Anyone here remember the 6.0 PowerStroke???)Leads to stagnate growth and product. Opens the door for Toyota.

This puts all of the American manufactures behind the 8 ball. Can they recover is the question. It doesn't look so good but then again neither did Datsun...

To me it's simple, listen to your customers. Give them what they want. Or in Lee Iacocca terms identify US (meaning Dodge at the time) and do what we do better than anyone else. K car was cheap and economical. Lead to the 92 Ram, Viper and so on.

Great fuel economy and high quality standards for Toyota cars?
A selectable locker in 4x4 trucks (Tacoma)? More power (381hp Tundra)? Bigger brakes? Bigger cab? Toyota is listening and gaining sales rapidly:

More new awards

Sales (the only manufacture going UP)

Just some things to think about, the way the big 3 do business needs to change and adapt. The problem is bigger than a product or product line. It's the way of doing business, lean manufacturing, adaptability, channel management etc...

 

The US automakers lost the lead in the passenger car market to the Japanese in the 1980's. Ford had 3 cars in the Top 10 best seller list (Escort, Tempo, Taurus) during the 80's, but by 1994, only the Taurus remained. The Honda Accord/Toyota Camry have been the #1 and #2 top selling passenger cars since 1995. Honda was #1 for several years, but was soon outsold by Toyota because they signed up 100's of new dealers...and in the process, increased Camry production by adding another assembly plant (they just added another one several months ago by buying the Isuzu plant in Lafayette, Indiana from GM). Today, the only American Cars in the Top 10 list are two Chevy models, and only because of rental cars sales.

The mini truck segment was once ruled by Ford and GM, but no more. Since I only track passenger car and full sized truck sales, I can't recall the date when the Toyota Tacoma first outsold both Ford and GM's mini trucks, but it was at least 8 years ago.

Toyota has two assembly plants building Tundras, one in Indiana, one in Texas. The combined output of both those plants can only produce..at maximum output: 300,000 Tundras a year. Because full sized pickup sales have dropped since 2005, neither plant is operating at full capacity. In order for the Toyota Tundra to outsell Ford, GM and Dodge, Toyota would have to add two more large assembly plants. That will not happen in the forseeable future.

Perceived Quality. Why the American consumer has bought millions of Toyotas since 1966. Toyota's recent quality slide was touched on by the News Media, but only for a short time. If the majority of ppl don't know Toyota quality is slipping, they'll go right on buying them. Toyota has been the darling of the News Media for years.

Nissan (Datsun) went bankrupt in 1999. What saved Nissan was French carmaker Renault stepping in and buying a 33% share of the company. By Japanese standards, that gives Renault controlling interest.

 

I lost your point. Ford stop making cars even though they where selling THAT'S why Toyota came in? Why would Ford or GM stop making cars that where selling? Toyota made a better product, GM and Ford stop making those lower profit not selling cars.

Mini trucks are the same thing. GM and Ford quit making them because Toyotas SR5's, Tacoma's or whatever made a better product. Good fuel economy, decent power and GREAT TRACTION (selectable locker).

The fact Toyota can "only make 300,000" units is my exact point. The can't out pace the need. Which is exactly what Ford and GM do wrong. Out pace the need and increase the discounts. Which lowers resale, which leads to less and less sales. They have to go somewhere. Highest resale does win over customers, that's a FACT.

Datsun did come back, renult/nissian whatever you want to call it. They made it through. But who is the next LEE? Ford doesn't seem to have the leadership? GM doesn't? Or do they? They better learn to scale production but given the fire sales that seem to continue to happen, I don't think the lesson has been learned just yet.

 

Lee Iacocca was the right man at the right time...twice. What is wrong today, is the bean counters have taken over the asylums. There's not ONE car guy running the show at GM and Ford. Mulally, (who's making 26+ million a yr), was a bean counter at Boeing. Chrysler has shaken up top management, but who the new "Lee" is, I haven't a klew.

Besides saving Chrysler, Lee was the father of the Mustang. He was fired as Ford prexy by The Deuce (Henry Ford II). When Iacocca asked why, The Deuce said..."I just don't like you!"