american lifestyle is big willie style basically. we have boats, atv's, snowmobiles, 30ft campers, houses (that may need large/bulky home improvement stuff) not apartments; all stuff you rarely ever see in europe or asia where everyone lives in an apartment building, has no toys they need to haul around, smaller speed limits (yes, i know, the autobahn, whupdee****ing doo, every other road they have in europe is 25mph around town...) and don't need any of the performance or capability that we do here.

proof.. seen the problems with toyota tailgates lately from loading atv's in em? seen any tundras or titans plowing snow lately? or towing a big *** camper? seen any accords or camrys as cabs handling 300-400k miles of city driving before decomissioned?
amen

 

[QUOTE=aortizexcursion]Amen to that

 

[QUOTE=jllang2]Oh, Absolutely! I guess people don't realize their supporting a bunch of foreign *******s when they buy from Toyota or Honda. To me it seems totally UnAmerican.

 

No to your first question, but living in Los Angeles, where it hasn't snowed since 1949...I've never any plow trucks, Ford or otherwise.

Your second question inre to Titans can be answered here: titantalk.com

Toyota, Honda, Nissan et al employ 1000's of US workers, paying them in millions of US dollars to build their vehicles in the US. That supports the US economy.

How does GM, Ford and Chrysler support the US economy by hiring Mexican or Canadian workers to build vehicles in Canada, or Mexico?

Coming soon to a dealer near you...vehicles made in China, the Chinese parts are already being sold here.

The Big 3 have recently built assembly and parts plants in China, and are looking at India next.

 

Again, ford and GM were given an award by the union this summer for using over 70% american parts. Also canada and mexico are still part of north america. It should be peoples own business if they don't want to suport the japanese economy. The more american products sold, the better chance of our local plants around here staying open. Part of fords contract was to keep plants open like Avon Lake Ohio and to keep jobs at home. Guy's don't let anyone snowball you with a bunch of BS, buy american, whenever and as often as you can. Jobs are going over seas because thier not selling enough cars to compete, so they have to cut cost. Buy more american and there will be more jobs saved. Don't let anyone talk you into jumping in bed with the japanese just because they have. Japan has done nothing for you besides bomb peral harbor and bomd our economy. If your not part of the solution, then your part of the problem.

 

But you do realize that the majority of vehicles Toyota sells in America are designed by, guess who, AMERICANS! That includes Toyota's truckline.

The tailgate issue, yep it's a big problem alright. The problem is being fixed. ( not too sure on the details ) But the whole idea is that Toyota goofed and they are making good with addressing the problem. ( like I stated earlier, I don't know the details on if they are strengthing the tailgates or what )

That's alot more than I can say for some other manufacturers....

By the way, I have towed my 27' travel trailer with a new Tundra and I will say it does a very commendable job of doing so. Have you towed or even driven a new Tundra?

 

Wendell - I have three trucks out in my driveway - two Fords and a Dodge. The Dodge was made in Mexico. Mexico is NOT part of the US economy (except for the billions of dollars shipped back to Mexico by illegals here - but that's a different story). I don't know what percentage of my Ford parts were made in the US (not North America - the US), but I'm guessing it's around 70%.

If you go to San Antonio and look at the new Tundra plant you'll see dozens of suppliers all around that plant. Toyota set up this plant where it demands that the suppliers be very close to their factory. Those suppliers and Toyota have created thousands of US jobs. Toyota has added jobs while the Big 3 have job decline in the US. I can't find what percentage of US made parts are in the Tundras out of San Antonio, but I bet it's as much as the Ford.

I'm guessing your complaint is that all those new Toyota jobs are non-union. Saying that GM and Ford UNIONS gave an award to GM and Ford is like saying Walmart employees gave an award to Walmart.

That said, once the millions of dollars of US wages and benefits are paid by Toyota to their US workers, most of the profits end up going to Japan. So buying from the Big 3 keeps more money here in the US.

 

really? I find it odd that americans that have designed trucks for the past century decided using bolts to hold the frame together would be wiser.

how so? on the tundra forums the only response from Toyota was that the tailgate was only supposed to support 200lbs. that means my 220lb figure couldn't even get in the bed of the truck... do you need a running jump to get in that thing?

nice, so when ford has a problem, it's bad vehicles; when toyota has a problem, it's "oh look, they're fixing it right away, they're such good vehicles". gimme a break and go hug a prius.

I haven't needed to, but i did pull an older model (2004) out of a snow ditch last year . When I'll need less towing power and less stability on the road, I'll look at a tundra.

 

so lemme axe you guys some questions...

why did ford have to outsource parts of their operations? is it not because of the pressure from the asian manufacturers?

also, why is it that asian and european manufacturers have huge tarriffs on US automakers' products ($27k for a base stripped down focus anyone?), yet US has no tarriffs on japanese/european cars?

and by the way, take a look at how many pensions ford is paying and how many toyota is paying... and how well ford pays their employees vs toyota - the unions are putting pressure on toyota b/c they're pretty much paying crap compared to the big 3. in the end, toyota lowers the standard of living overall. they came in, caused the big 3 to have to close jobs in the us, and are paying the people that work for them (toyota) less than what ford/gm/chrysler was paying them. you can wave the "american built" flag all you want, but at the end of the day, the japanese economy is still doing better than ours because of toyota's success over here.

 

http://www.pickuptruck.com/html/news/toyota/tundra/tailgates/page1.html

Reference last paragraph.

Nope, I have stated numerous times that it could be any manufacturer I could be referring to, it just happens to be Toyota because it seems to be the one everyone gets all wadded up about when it comes to proving to them otherwise.

Where does anyone state here that Toyota's are "such good vehicles". Once again, just someone else jumping on the bandwagan....

Your bleeding heart is dually ( sp? ) noted.




Yep, another unedumatecated assumption. So if I've had to pull out my F150 with my brother in laws Dodge, ( which I have ) it is assumed that my truck is inadequate? Good point!

 

... you can wave the "american built" flag all you want, but at the end of the day, QUOTE]

I won't wave the American Built flag for Toyota if you won't wave it for the Big 3. They are US-owned, but to be making the argument that Toyota isn't "American Built" and somehow my Mexican Dodge is just doesn't fly.

Again - I own and have owned trucks from all of the Big 3. I "Buy American" because I think Ford makes a good, US-built truck. However, Toyota makes a good Texas-built truck. And they've got about the same amount of US parts.

As I said, buying from the Big 3 probably keeps more dollars here inside the US because some of the Toyota profits go to Japan. But I wouldn't be "jumping in bed with the Japanese" if I chose to buy a Tundra any more than I would be pro-Mexican if I bought a Dodge again. (and I wouldn't - it's a total piece of crap).

 

" The cause is still under investigation. Owners experiencing this issue should bring their truck to a Toyota dealer, where the tailgate will be fixed or replaced under warranty if it's determined the damage occurred under normal use. "

if it's determined the damage occured under normal use... according to toyota, that is 200 lbs or less being placed on the thing.

the last paragraph is someone's opinion on pickuptruck.com. nice job of finding official word from toyota on how quickly and swiftly they are proceeding to fix the problem. you should work for snopes.com with those detective instincts.

the statement that toyota makes "such good vehicles" is a bit more obvious through your posts than your article about toyota fixing the tailgate problem. I may bleed ford blue, but at least none of my bandwagan vehicles have needed a new tailgate, a new cam, or 4.30 gears and a granny gear to get out of it's own way

i'm guessing your ingenius detective insights missed the smiley in my comment and somehow fail to assess the sarcasm in my comment. Fear not, it'll get to you sometday Sparky.

 

the point is, the big 3 had to outsource because of toyota/honda/nissan. if the general public doesn't see all of the problems out there with toyota, this trend will continue. in the end, it's the asian manufacturers that forced Ford/GM/Chrysler to outsource parts of their operations, and the fact they are producing their trucks here in the US doesn't mean it's quite THAT good for the economy. they pay their employees less and they ship the profits overseas.

with every japanese car sold, one less american car is sold, more american jobs have to be outsourced so that the companies stay in business, and more of the money spent on that car end up in japan's economy.


no one has yet to answer my question on tarriffs... wonder why.

 

Care to share your link? I'll wait.....

Ah yes, more asumptions.

Congrats.

Just a question, what did you think I meant by "bandwagon". I will give you a clue, it has nothing to do with Ford.

Truly amazing. Critizising another without even understanding yourself what I posted.

But hey, Sparky will be the bigger man here and let you feel vindicated.

Carry on.

 

It doesn't bother me about vehicles built in canada or mexico, it's still north america. Alot of americans cross the bridge everyday to go to work in Windsor along with our canadain brothers. As far as mexico were going to suport them one way or another, either have plants down there or the ones streaming across the boarder everyday looking for work, it's all good. This topic has been argued way too much on a ford forum if you ask me. We have loyal ford guy's and those who bought a ford because it's the flavor of the month for them. For those of us who are loyal ford guy's, were never gonna be convinced to buy japanese, so why bother, it's a pointless debate. Myself and a lpt of others will never buy japanese no matter how much BS gets slung. We buy american, we believe in american and those who try to change that wre doing a disservice to our country and companies. It's a free country, you can do as you wish, like wise we can as well. Go pedal your japanese is best crap else where, it's not going to fly here for most of us. I buy fords, my dad buys fords and his dad bought fords and my sons buy fords. If it isn't broke, don't fix it. Toyota has the ugliest trucks on the market, look like a toad on steroids, thats reason enough to stay away from them if no other. Ford has allways served me well and will continue to do so as long as I draw breath. I was raised on ford money, my dad draws his ford retirement, friends and family still depend on ford for a living, thats all reason enough to have fords in my driveway, there the best is the other reason.