I'm not a dealer, but I'm not here to discuss marketing. I think that horse has been dead for quite some time. Until I get my data from my own engine, I don't have a whole lot more to add at this point.

Funny thought... wouldn't a "smiley beating a dead horse" be another great graphic addition to the current list of smiley's? If I had the HTML skills, I'd build it for us. Maybe someone else can.

 

How can you know this?

 

OK... so look at my post above that references a thread I started in the 6.0L section on ATF fluid. We're not talking marketing here... we are talking about the FACT that Mercon, Mercon V and Mercon SP are three different fluids with three different specifications... PERIOD!!!

Now, you tell me or defend how Amsoil can make this claim since Ford and no one else can? The viscosity and specs for all three fluids are different... so how can Amsoil do it and they are not paying Ford to license it or gain access to the formulation or specs!!!

Again... forget marketing... lets discuss and review engineering specs... cold hard engineering specs.... I am all ears!!!!

 

Pete, the ATF thread is new information about Amsoil! Just remember what
Scott (horsepuller) said:

This thread belongs to the Amsoil enthusiast's. So make of it what you will. Freedom is a two way street though. If we want to voice our opinions we have to tolerate the opinions of others.

The issue here isn't just marketing, but it's the credibility of Amsoil! Just more
proof (FACTS) that Amsoil fits right in with the profile of other MLM companies!!

 

Here is all my info on the Amsoil ATF fluid scam.... so no one has to click on links... here it is in one post...

Check out Amsoil's mis-leading link below.

https://www.amsoil.com/storefront/atf.aspx
(May have to cut & paste into browser to view)

They say their new ATF fluid is "everything compatible... even Mercon SP!!!!

There is no way that a fluid can be Mercon, Mercon V and Mercon SP compatible... but it does in the "warped minds" of Amsoil marketing and dealers... use it in our Torqushift tranny's and you may be sorry!!!!

Here is a portion of what their site (link above) states...

APPLICATIONS
AMSOIL Synthetic Universal Automatic Transmission Fluid is completely compatible with other synthetic and petroleum automatic transmission fluids. AMSOIL ATF is a universal, multi-functional fluid that greatly reduces the need for specialized fluid inventories and the possibilities of misapplication. AMSOIL ATF is recommended for transmission, hydraulic and other applications requiring any of the following specifications:

GM DEXRON® II, III & VI
Ford MERCON®, MERCON® V & SP
Chrysler ATF+ through ATF+4®
Honda Z-1 (Not for use in CVT transmissions)
Toyota Type T and T-IV
Mitsubishi/Hyundai Diamond SP II & III
Allison C-3, C-4
Caterpillar TO-2
Voith G607, G1363
ZF TE-ML 14A, 14B & 14C
Mercedes Benz 236.1, 236.2, 236.6, 236.7, 236.9
BMW 7045E
NAG 1 & 2
JWS 3309
LT 71141 (ESSO)
Nissan Matic D, J & K
Vickers I-286S & M-2950S
Excellent for power steering units that use ATF.

Not for use in CVT transmissions.

SERVICE LIFE
AMSOIL Synthetic Automatic Transmission Fluid is recommended for use up to 50,000 miles under severe service* and up to 100,000 miles under normal service* or according to the vehicle manufacturer recommended intervals, whichever is longer. AMSOIL recommends thoroughly draining the transmission and flushing with new AMSOIL ATF to achieve a minimum 90% purity of new transmission fluid. Drain intervals may be extended further with oil analysis.

* As defined by the vehicle or transmission manufacturer.

Now check out these two links... and you wonder how and why Amsoil can make the claims they do... at least on ATF fluid!!!

http://www.lubereport.com/e_article0...3G8K8K,bQ545pN

Ford officials declined to discuss the SP specification, but market sources said it was developed for high-torque five-speed transmissions built by German manufacturer ZF and used by Ford in some light trucks. The biggest differences between SP and the two older Mercon specs are the viscosity requirements. SP requires a kinematic viscosity of 5.5 to 6 square millimeters per second at 100 degrees C, compared to a minimum of 6.8 for both Mercon and Mercon V. SP also has more stringent requirements for cold-temperature Brookfield viscosity.


http://www.imakenews.com/lng/e_artic....cfm?x=b11,0,w

Here is proof that the specs are different... yet that is not how Amsoil is markting it... oh I am sorry... how it was engineered... I need to leave the "marketing" issue out of this debate/discussion!!!

 

Thanks for the links, Beachbumcook.

 

Jeff,

not trying to speak for Pete here, but I re-read his post and don't see him or anyone so far defending Amsoil labeling of this new tranny fluid as "all compatible" or whatever we are calling it. What he said (and I agree with) is after posted once, twice, so on...it quickly seems like a dead horse. It's a poor choice and misleading to label any one tranny fluid as "will work with all" - I get it and I'm sure most others do. Luckily, I consider myself smart enough not to buy such a fluid for my Torque Shift tranny. Poor representation of a product, yes, but does not mean they don't make some good motor oils for certain applications.

I've read it here, in the 6.0 forum and I'm sure it may show up in the Excursion and Super Duty forums soon if not already, all of which I scan from time to time like others. You and Bob have researched it and I appreciate that, but it seems like you are dissapointed when noone posts back to defend their choice in how to label this product? Are you looking to inform or more looking forward to the conflict?

 

Never looking for conflict... just trying to learn myself and educate others. I will only speak for myself, I try to show and post links and articles that support my position. I do not care about MLM tactics or any of that... but rather look at "cost of product", "availability of product", industry certifications and the like.

I believe that Amsoil maybe a good oil, but is not a great oil. I believe that for the money, other oils exist that are indeed more above board and register their products with API and can document such. Yes, we have choices, and when I saw the Amsoil tranny fluid link and what they claim... I could easily disprove it as HARMFULL to ones tranny as any engineer could tell you that "ONE SPEC DOES NOT FIT ALL".

If they market their tranny fluid that way... I, as an educated man, wonder how they really perform with their oils... and not API certifed at that... so who really knows. As I stated above, I am sure it is good oil, but for the same price or less and API registered... there are many other as good or better oils available!!!

Not looking for a conflict as you state, but trying to educate people that if they will lower themselves to market tranny fluid for every tranny out there... then I call their entire engineering department and motivations into question!!!

You stated that you would not use this tranny fluid as you are an educated man... but there are plenty of uneducated ones... and those are the ones I worry about.

 

Certainly agree there, and am in the uneducated group on LOTS of stuff still!!

 

Thanks, 2005X. It seems to me that you're about the only one I've encountered who thinks about what I write instead of knee-jerking at catch-words (there are a few others, though).

The last thing I will say is that I am also in the same boat with 2005X in terms of being "uneducated ... on Lots of stuff". I appreciate the wisdom and experience that I seen so freely shared in FTE, and will continue to benefit from the generosity of you guys who fit into that group.

 

How in the heck did we get from Amsoil oil to Amsoil trans fluid in a 6.0 .

 

The defined range of topics is left pretty open from the beginning. I guess it was only a matter of time before the discussion moved around from oil to something else that Amsoil sells.

By the way, Bob, I don't consider myself an "Amsoil enthusiast", as you put it. I am a PSD enthusiast, though.

 

I posted becuase the topic of this thread is Amsoil (re-read post #1). I posted about the Amsoil tranny fluid becuase of how they claim that it works in most/all trannys... and in Ford's.... they claim Mercon, Mercon V and Mercon SP... which is fasle advertising, false claims, mis-leading, could cause damage to one's tranny... and just a flat out LIE!!!!

 

Pete, re-read my post. I never said that you were an "Amsoil enthusiast", that was a quote from Scott, regarding this thread. You have said, however, that you have bought Amsoil DEO to use in your PSD.

 

Well there just happens to be an organization called the American Petroleum Institute, they are the indipendant testing and licensing authority. They are responsible for making sure everyones products meet a minimun set of criteria to be labeled as one spec or another (I.E. SM SL CD CH ect. ect.). If you go to the API website you can look up which companies are licensed to produce, market and sell said product carring an API certification, that is how I know.