Headers vs. Stack manifold...power/performance difference?
Posting Guru
Joined: Oct 2005
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dynomax headers slip right in.. I've personally only changed 1 faulty starter in a running vehicle, and that was the original from 1972- and I had 2 motors in it since then. spend the money and put in a brand new starter when you change the headers, leave out the top bolt ad forget about it...
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Post Fiend
Joined: Dec 2003
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From: "Islander"
Heat wrap will shorten the life of your headers, manufactures will not warranty their product if wrap has been used.
The best way I have found is ceramic coat inside and out when they are new.
Copper gaskets with band clamps make the starter easy to remove should it be needed every 8 to 10 years on average.
The best way I have found is ceramic coat inside and out when they are new.
Copper gaskets with band clamps make the starter easy to remove should it be needed every 8 to 10 years on average.
Elder User
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 669
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My experience has been that starters last just about forever. I did replace my starter when I did my build just because I had it apart anyway. Starters aren't that expensive so If you are worried about it then change the starter when you put the headers on. Also, the question on heat wrap....were you talking about heat wrapping the headers or the starter? I agree with beemer....heat wrapping the headers will shorten their life....you can heat wrap the starter if you have trouble with the headers putting too much heat on the starter....I've heard this helps but I can't say firsthand as I've never done it myself.
Tracy
Tracy
Hotshot
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 11,141
Likes: 25
From: south louisiana
After dealing with starters on a 390 and later a 427 in a 67 big block Stang, I can tell you now, what to do if you don't want to coat headers, wrap them or the starter and not have problems. Buy a NEW starter with high torque field coils. Once I did that with my Stang, I never bought another starter for it. If you cannot find a starter as such, find a good starter rebuild shop and have them build one for you.
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Elder User
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 920
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From: Westminster, Colorado
My starter seems to survive fine with the "heat blanket" around it.....I lost one to heat already, and then a second wrapped one to oil seepage that was leaking onto it from the leaking intake manifold gaskets and valve cover gaskets. All the oil stuff is fixed now, so I should be good...
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Elder User
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 920
Likes: 0
From: Westminster, Colorado
Originally Posted by freejay
How much better do the above headers fit? I have a set of regular headers not for the highboy and they are a MAJOR pain to deal with. Changing the starter requires pulling the bolts out of the header, jacking up the engine on the passenger side, removing the header, change starter... It turns a 10 minute job into a couple hours of cursing and skinned knuckles. If these are better I will definately upgrade mine.
Post Fiend
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 8,600
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From: Iowa
Originally Posted by fordraceboy
dynomax headers slip right in.. I've personally only changed 1 faulty starter in a running vehicle, and that was the original from 1972- and I had 2 motors in it since then. spend the money and put in a brand new starter when you change the headers, leave out the top bolt ad forget about it...
Anyway, I refined my procedure to where I could have the old one out, new one in, and running, in 10 minutes. That's unbolting the header from the cylinder head, removing the old starter, and putting the new one all back together. That's WITH the top bolt! This is with Hedman headers.
Unimog is right, there's a special "twist" you have to give the starter to get it out of there. With the headers unbolted, I found it easiest to pull the starter out the top, leaning over the fender. Much more pleasant than trying to lay on your back, cramped, and trying to hold the thing up so it doesn't fall on your head when it does go.
The best part is when you drop that top bolt down in the bellhousing. That's always fun trying to fish that thing out. Got to the point where I would tie a 5 foot piece of dental floss to it before attempting the install. That way if it dropped, I get it back.
Post Fiend
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 6,658
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From: "Islander"
You can leave the bolt in the bellhousing for that gut sickening sound knowing the job was done right as you did it yourself. Just kidding.
Better yet is pieces of the disk damper springs rattling around as you gain extra driveline slack and chatter.
That required removing the inspection cover to let the pieces out.
Better yet is pieces of the disk damper springs rattling around as you gain extra driveline slack and chatter.
That required removing the inspection cover to let the pieces out.
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More Turbo
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 513
Likes: 0
From: Alberta
Thanks for the reply Unimog005. I've already purchased a set, they are flowtech instead of Dynomax but they look to be exactly the same. I also put a new(reman) starter on my truck only a couple years ago and it needed replacing less than a year later. Mine is even worse because there is a PTO shaft for the winch in the way as well.
Posting Guru
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 1,036
Likes: 1
From: NE Ga
I think if i go with headers, I'm just gonna take the time to make a couple of heat shields around the starter. I've done this for exhaust around tranny lines and trans bodies themselves and it makes a huuuge difference.
Post Fiend
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 6,658
Likes: 4
From: "Islander"
Originally Posted by 73F100*8Mile
I've done this for exhaust around tranny lines and trans bodies themselves and it makes a huuuge difference.
Sounds like your exhaust systems too close to your lines and you haven't explored the world of ceramic coatings.
Posting Guru
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 1,036
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From: NE Ga
The huuge difference I was talkin about was on a 2001 dodge B350. Now days all manufacturers are making things to break (built in oscilation (spell)). We burned a tranny at 88,000 about a year ago and put a jasper rebuild in it for sake of time. You couldnt' get your finger between the exhaust pipe and the cooling lines goin to the tranny and the same story on some places to the body of the tranny. It was made to cook and last a limited amount of time. The only place that is like that on my truck is next to the steering box...way too close to the manifold and will probably get even closer when headers are installed. Time to make a shield. Just think about sittin next to a campfire. You can feel the heat just sittin there but if someone walks in front, instant change. Same thing. Thats all I was sayin. I can do the same for my starter if need be.
More Turbo
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 513
Likes: 0
From: Alberta
Sorry Beemer, I don't have the know how, and often the time, to replace bushings, brushes and sprag starter gear on my old starter. My point is that when it does come time to do some 'minor' job on my truck, with the headers I currently have, it is a MAJOR PITA. I know there are ways to avoid it, or I could just deal with it, but for $150ca, I will just get the right headers for a start.
Post Fiend
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 6,658
Likes: 4
From: "Islander"
73F100, I see the joys of owning these new vehicles where space after design is an issue, seems common these days.
Sounds like your adding a little extra that the manufactures didn't add for a longer service life.
I rather enjoy the ride of the 69 as it went 900K trouble free miles before I sold it now testing a 68.
Sounds like your adding a little extra that the manufactures didn't add for a longer service life.
I rather enjoy the ride of the 69 as it went 900K trouble free miles before I sold it now testing a 68.
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