i sure don't want to start some thing here but one of the banks kits sat in my junk pile till the junk guys picked it up . any company can say you can get this and that, but when it comes down to every day conditions you don't get what they claim.
gail banks i have to say is one of the best old school.new school tuners out but even his products don't always cut the claims when it comes down to a non climent controled dyno like i can use any time i want, my gain from a banks cat back was 3hp at 3700 rpm.
as to the old 2 valve take notice of the numbers of parts out even for them, not much.

fred stated some thing else blue printing! and costs of doing it .there is only one company that offers any internal parts sulivan performance and what they do is offer up forged pistons and forged alloy rods from a 5.4 and rebalance them for the v10, price wise kiss 3k+ out the windows for gaskets, rings, rods and pistons. plus labor and blue print costs . so i will have to say about 6 to 7k is a realistic number for costs as you most remove the trucks cab to remove the heads and to have working room to r and i the piston/rod assemblys esp on number 4-5 and 9-10. and then you still have a basicly stock v10 .just one that can handle about a 100hp shot of nox for about 15 to 20 runs before the the crank shaft cracks or snaps off.

sorry guys some of the younger guys need to talk with more old farts like me and others before wasteing your hard earned. if you want to race do it with a v8 don't waste your cash on a v10.

again if you want to play heres what you can build out of a 5.4 ford mod motor that you can't with a v10. photo thanks to. http://www.sullivanperformance.com/

 

Antelope V10

No flames for you from me brother... Been there done that and I modded the hell out of my 2001...Unfortunatly the dollar per horse power cost was very high and driveability suffered for my NORMAL use

My trucks spend 80% to 90% of their time at 2250 rpm or lower

The 4 or 5 times a year I take a medium length trip, I just accept lower fuel MPG and set the motor to spin up in the 3500-5000RPM range and drag the load up and over the hill. If I was to do it as a full time RV warrior I would have to seriously consider the Diesel again.

BTW my 2v V10 managed local 3000-6000 loads all day long just fine even on our short but fairly steep Central Texas hill(ettes) (little hills)

Damned near every "bolt on" aftermarket part out there increases the HP and torque less then 15% and always at 3200 to 4800 RPM.

The only exception being a supercharger and you are obligated to add about $2000 to transmission bullet proofing after you spend the $3500-$5000 for the supercharger. Hell if you NEED that much power at high altitude to tow a heavy trailer real fast then you should have opted for the PSD...it would have been cheaper.

mizzitch

are you saying you get +51 more HP with the Banks kit? Or that is what Bank's claims you should get?

I am a big Gale banks fan and have bought a ton of his stuff over the years

His claims are well documented as saying "UP TO XX% HP and XX% MPG gains" and if you pay real close attention he is targeting the Class C E350-E450 and Class A F53 chassis motor coaches...they already have crippled intake and exhaust systems and much lower geared rear ends. The Camping World folks sell his kits installed by the truck load because they work well for that application. Those heavy boats already are down in the 5.5 to 7.5 MPG range MOST of the time and a 15% to 20% increase in power and MPG is a LOT over time but still not racing class power.

The Otto mind is NOT compatible with ANY other programmer

You are better off with a good custom tune programmer then the locked Otto mind system, if you are a true motor head... the Otto mind is good but only with Banks kits and is intended for old folks who just want to have it installed and forget about it so they can get from up north to down south over all the passes to snow bird in Texas, Arizona, Florida, or southern Cal. Gale also knows the limits of the trans and has the stuff tuned to not require a bullet proof 4R100 upgrade.

Back to the focus of this thread "intakes" has any one seen the current TV commercials for "increased power" cool looking intake kits? Did you notice how every actor giggled about how much more powerful it SOUNDED? Does any one out there know what the placebo effect is?

Charlie and I have posted many times that we have tested almost every "cold air" kit out there on a dyno...and by them selves there is absolutely zero gain at cruising rpm. Most of them only yield 5-9 HP at RPMs above 3200 and boys and girls... that is a cost of about $27 per HP that you can not really tell is there. Hell I even did a dyno run with no filter at all and only got 7 more HP way up in the 3600-4200 RPM zone. The Factory system is not restrictive at all.

Ever watch the Horse power TV show when they bolt on this or that part and then show the dyno results as only gaining 12 to 15 HP for some $800 to $1200 modification? and by the time the two shows are done they bolted on $3800 dollars worth of go fast crap and only got an extra 43HP way up in the RPM band.... Sorry but I am not impressed with the dollar to HP ratio there

The only exception is when they dyno and test drive the programmers for the diesel trucks... yes Virginia you really can plug in a chip and get a free extra 100+ HP on a Cummins or PSD... but I can tell you with a straight face there is no magic pill for the gas motors except a supercharger and nitrous that will get you any where near that much gain.

 

amen fred and i will always stand 100% behind you.
our v10's are what they are one super strong, smooth towing machine. not a race truck. and those who want to race a truck best route is with a oil burner.

our v10's weakest link in building it for racing is and always has been the crank shaft. it can't handle a lot,for to long. look closely at the throws. that tells you why. thats why ford builds this motor as a cross bolted 4 bolt. one with 7 mains it's to weak for performace apps. right at the throws. along the side of the rods center line between them.

 

Banks claims 51 hp increase peak to peak. They also claim a 1.5 second decrease in 0-60 time.

 

Gail Banks designed those kits to help out the motor home chassis. what you read and truly get depends on weather, gearing, fuel type and rating. engine condition to start with .i.e. low miles, high miles, hard miles. shape of tune up. plus the fact you will have to run 92 all the time.

I question a fact of some thing simple. Can we afford to pay for high test in every tank load? I for one can't. And again i will say start with some thing simple. checking the engines shape.

if one wants to play. start with a tune up. compression check. to get a idea of the engines shape, this i do dry and wet to check the rings, then a leak down check. wet and dry. new plugs. boots, filters,. run a injector cleaner kit though it.like a service center does.

set two goes to a tuner/programer i use sct flashes excal2 . www.sctflash.com type in your zip code and work with a custom tuner near by you so that you have near the same type of area. i.e. sea level. 1000 feet. 2k, 3k, 4, 5k, 6k get what i mean this amke a very serious change in the tuneing to get it running good dead stock.

have them build your tunes for running 87 rate a tune for toeing or 89 and another for 92. tire size and axle ratio must be given to the tuner to get proper trans shifting. without this information the trans will hunt for the gear at full throttle. cold hard factstep 2 the tuner. i use sct's excal 2 custom. as i can work with my customer to help him obtain near what he or she wants and have the ability to redo my tunes to how thier.wants how one wants things to work. even reset the programing of the trans. here i mean remove the torque limiting programing a little at time.
yes guys ford cuts back the amount of torque by limiting how much gets to the rear axle by as much as 65% in some cases. by making the cluchs slip a little in each gear.

next step which most people want is motor bling bling. the old but some times nasty cold air kit. here take your time and web surf. forget the dodad mod it 's not good for a gas motor. for the cold air you want one that truly gets cold air not a mix or all air from the engine bay. this many do, do.

torque convertors you can get some that work better and have better clutch lock up material. beef up the trans. stock clutchs can not and do not handle a lot of extra h.p. and torque.

next check your gearing, 3:73's go up to 4:30's bigger tires need even lower gear ratios to regain the loss from them.

finally remove the stock exhaust system carefully and make a few runs with out just a straight pipe, see if you like the sound. play with some throw away mufflers see if you can find one that dosn't rattle you inside the truck. stay with a baffled muffler not a straight though like many just from a psd and just make up a adapter for behind the cat. here i input a very sound wording leave the cat alone the v10 must have some back pressue esp. the 3 valve as the intake manifold is tuned to used the small amount of pressure caused by the closeing of the exhaust vakve to help push the air into the next open intake vavle set. yes this is german tuneing from about 1975 or 6 from audi. the v10 is very hard guys, many systems sound like a detroit deisel 2 stroke marine motor. yes thats how they sound un muffled. like a yamaha. 2 stroke .

here i've tryed attaching a shot of the crank shaft take a good look at the rod bearing and see what i ment about how easy is it to break right there.
now if you have any big ??'s please don't be afraid to email me. i'm ore then happy to advise or say were i screwed up and wasted cash .or even how to do some thing on the truck.
good luck guys please use caution this motor si not and dos.'t work any thing like the v8's we all know so well.

 

I want to see what "bolt ons" are required to get a '99 V10 to put out as much torque as a 3-valve V10.

And, of course, that's peak torque. And doesn't do a darn thing for the rest of the RPM band, I'd bet.



Side note: Cap, where did you get that pic of the V10 crank? And you're talking about the #3 rod journal, right? And what is that crank's history? NOS? Blower? What? And what did that #2 piston look like compared to the rest?

 

the shots are from one of our other members so i don't know what failed.
what i mean is when you look at how the throws are cut into the crank. the weakest link is right between the the rod bearings and that is the fail point where these cranks are known to break .as my one buddy who has a crank shaft grinding shop has told me. when he magnafluxs them every bad one he has had was right at that point.
and of course we all know about the snout breaking of on some blower motors from how long it is. also look at how thin the rods are, and the piston sizes.

while the v10 is a strong smooth towing motor know and proven at over 400k miles in a few tow trucks. racing it is not made for.

 

2001 F250 crew 4X4 v10 - Put on the Airaid intake system and gained a minimum of 20% increase in mileage. Well worth the money in my eyes. As a good note to everyone owning a V10, have a good look at the 'Y' pipe off the manifold. How effective do you think that is to exhaust flow?

 

Your post reminds me of a diet pill commercial where at the bottom in small print the words "results not typical" appear.

One has to consider exactly how much air is being moved through the intake and exhaust at a reasonable cruising speed in order to determine whether or not a particular product will offer the gains it advertises. In the case of pretty much any bolt-on modification (short of forced induction) I would presume the gain in fuel efficiency is nominal at best.

Looking at the Y pipe of the vehicle you must also consider that Ford may have used that as a final method of controlling peak torque location in the powerband. Surely replacing that pipe with a higher flowing unit will move your effective powerband up and net you with a truck that is perhaps no faster from a standstill than it was before though it may have more "pep" on the expressway or up in the rpms, just where most people that have this engine don't need power.

I too am in a constant search for an increase in power regardless of how much I start out with however having worked with both naturally aspirated and forced induction cars in a performance enviroment I know what results I can realistically expect after travelling either path. My money will be going Whipple or Kenne Belle.

As always, food for thought.

 

Mike Kopstain

EXACTLY

Good post

 

Huh?

You don't happen to sell them, do you?

 

No Art...he know this because he can HEAR the performance gain

The 20% MPG is probably from the motor stating to get broke in

What is 20% any way in a 10-14 mpg truck ?

10 +20% = 12
11+20% = 13.2
12 + 20% = 14.4
13 + 20% = 15.6
14 +205 = 16.8

If ANY air inlet and filter kit could get a 20% increase, FoMoCo would license it immediately and solve a big CAFE problem, sell thousands more trucks, and be everybody's hero

 

As in any good forum, guys will always have their opinions, which is great because this is how we learn things.

I thought many times about maybe trying this or that to the truck to maybe get it to run better or stronger and in the end, I decided to leave it alone except for the exhaust system and gears. I plan on keeping my truck for a while and will be sure it gets it's regular does of maintenance to keep it running right. And actually, the only REAL modification I seriously considered was a supercharger because that is the only sure mod to get power. But then I remembered that this is a truck. If I want speed, I can just hop into my Mustang.

It is always interesting to read about other people's experiences and learn from it. I perfectly understand where Charlie and Fred are coming from but as always, there will be guys that will want to tinker with something just for the fun of it.