Brand loyalty? I for one don't have any hell I own three brands of cars for my truck I went with an 04 Ram QC Hemi, cars I have an 04 GT and a 99 Civic. To me if I were to just stick to one brand I would be missing out on many other things that other brands have to offer. I wouldn't trade my 04 GT for any GM car in its class and I wouldn't trade my Ram for any ford, GM or any other truck in its class, as for my honda I need to save some money on gas... I'd go broke if I only drove the other two around...

For me to purchase a vehicle I look at the Price, Power, Build Quality, and what my family has been through with vehicles of that brand in the past

 

I've seen plenty of Fords that racked up 200,000 or 300,000 miles or more, and for those who haven't paid attention to the outside world, I've also seen just as many (yes, just as many...if not more...) Nissan's that have seen that many miles, with original engines - baby food jar filters and all. For that matter, I've also seen just as many Toyotas, Chevys, Dodges and Hondas that have achieved such impressive figures. I tend to pay attention to that kind of stuff.

I tend to agree that while a larger filter may be nice and may add a little to the individual's feeling of comfort (including mine own), I don't think it really makes much difference unless the owner REALLY lets a LOT of time lapse between oil filter changes. If it made that much difference, then we wouldn't be seeing these other brands ALL lasting 200,000 - 300,000 miles or more in some cases.

Mind you, I'm just talking about the basic engine, not external engine accessories, such as water pump, sensors, etc., or transmissions, electric components. Just talking about engine longevity. In the end, I don't think the filter size is that critical. It might be nice, but not that big of a deal.

Interesting story that may or may not directly relate: I knew a guy who bought a 1977 Chevy 4x4 brand new and drove it till it quit. His maintenance on that truck was practically non-existant. He was the boss' son and also worked at the shop where I used to work, and his oil always got changed by one of our shop guys - cause it was free (he was the boss' son). It would only get changed about once every 10,000 - 20,000 miles (no joke here), despite it being free. It got changed basically whenever he felt like making the effort to walk out to the truck and drive it into the shop from the parking lot (sarcasm intended). After the engine (350 V8) crapped out, we took it apart and found the valley between the two banks of cylinders was almost completely full of carbon crud, and the areas under the valve covers were jam-packed full of crud. There were just these little pockets where the rocker arms, valve springs and pushrods moved. That was bad! And yet his engine (350 V8) still lasted 165,000 miles. None of the other 350 V8's we had at our shop ever became crudded up like that, and they all ran on the same oil, so the long period between oil changes was what did it to his engine. It didn't last as long as most of us would like, and not as long as it could have lasted if he had taken better care, but the point is that his maintenance was pretty horrible and if there was ever a candidate for a clogged filter, his filter was it, and yet his engine still lasted quite some time. Either his filter did not clog, despite the horrible care or if it did clog, perhaps the oil being unfiltered for those hopefully brief periods did not matter quite as much as we all think it does. Perhaps Chevy used a bigger filter back then than they do now, but if this guy's filter did not clog in 20,000 miles, then I don't think any of us has anything to worry about. You can't engineer everything to be infinitely idiot-proof. Maybe I'm comparing apples to oranges by talking about a truck that was built nearly 30 years ago, but that story came to mind and seems relevant.

As for WHY I am on a Ford forum, well, to echo what ddrumman2004 said, I own a Ford, and I happen to think it's a pretty darn good vehicle, so I come here. However, I've known plenty of X-brand owners who have had great luck with their vehicles, as well. I would like to think that the components outside the engine are a little better on Ford trucks than they are on Chevy or Dodge trucks, though, as I have seen fewer problems with those components than on the other brands, but I don't know for sure.

Anyway, enough rambling for now.

 

Yeah...enough of this stuff. I have owned all makes of vehicles...namely Ford, Chevy, Dodge, Nissan, Mazda, plus a couple VW's in the past. By far the worst was the 92 Dodge Caravan that had Lord know's how many recalls so I am familiar with other's.
My point is that no amount of facts or video's are going to change some folks minds.

I love my 97 F-150 Lariat with the 4.6 V8 and auto tranny. I bought it with 101K showing on the oddometer and it now has over 145k on it.....all trouble free miles.
I have said it before and say it again.....To each his own.

 

You have obviously never towed anything in your entire life if you think the 80% torque at 1000rpms is useless. I don't own a 5.4L but instead the V10 and its for this very reason that I purchaced the V10. I buy trucks to use as a truck, not as a car, I only put 6K a year on my Super Duty but those 6K miles all have a trailor behind it or a load in the bed and I can garentee that low end grunt is what a 5klb+ truck needs to have to get it moving, and then when you have a trailor in tow it only emphasizes the need for the low end torque. Oh and by the way my F250 Weighs over 7000lbs with nothing more than a full tank of gas. I have no problems with any of the other brands but I do when people say nosense like this and have no Idea what they are talking about.

Also I do like the larger filter on the fords but I do think that it has a lot more to do with pressure, flow, and media type more than filter size. I really don't know that these filters realy do all that much as long as you change your oil regularly. To all ther own but I've owned 2 fords (both pickups),4 GMs (all cars) and 1 Chrysler (also a car) and the only one thats died on me before 170,000 miles was the chrysler and that had more to do with how it was maintained by the previous owner and not the car itself. If you want to do a comparison go buy a few different brands of filters for the same vehicle and cut them in half. I've done this only to find that the biggest advertisers seem to have the cheapest filters. out of 6 diffent brands of filters the fram extra gaurd had the least dence and least amount of media. Also the media was literally just floating inside the case unlike the other brands. the Motorcraft was pretty good as was the AC Delco. The Napa filter was also good (don't know who makes it) . There were two others in between but it was a good comparison that gave me a peice of mind when purchacing filters.

 

I agree that you can't change someone's opinion on a certain thing who is as stubborn as i am. If it was the other way around I would be the one standing up and defending my beliefs. It is just that all the facts are in my favor (and all other FORD ENTHUSIASTS!!) and I will argue them till this tread is dead. I mean just about everyone one with the oil filter issue is pretty much saying size doesn't matter, it still does the job, but yet they feel better with a larger one?!?! Well sorry, I prefer not to use the bare minimum to keep my engine running, whether it does the job or not. Perhaps it is because i have 270,000 on mine and would love to see the day it turns 1,000,000. It is just starting to show signs of its age, slight blow by and a slight puff of blue smoke at start ups. Yet when you get on it it still has got some left.

For all you who say the filter is not clogged after so many miles or so much abuse, have you actually tested it? Have you compared flow rates and its filtering capabilities to that of a new filter?? If it is not plugged why bother changing it out then?? Why not run it till it clogs, then change it?? Its not like all of a sudded oil stops flowing through, it will gradually increase resistance to oil flow over time, and generally the smaller the filter, the less oil that can flow thru it initially, not to mention the added resistance of all the filtered junk that will build up.

Perhaps FORD has yet again taken it to another level. FORD must have designed it to not only filter as expected under normal operating conditions, and normal wear, but under harsh conditions and under high wear situations. Generally as the engine racks up more and more hours and miles on the vehicle, wear increases and this is when you need the larger filter cap. I know my filter is rather heavy when I take it out and drain out all the oil that I can from it. I bet if I had a smaller filter it would be plugged or at least VERY restrictive. I have also compared the weight of the filter after several hundred mile to after having 3,000 miles on it, and it is much heavier at 3,000 due to the additional accumulation of material in the filter element. I guess nissan is just unable (or choose not) to design their lubrication system to perform as well for the last turn of the engine as when it was brand new. I mean after all it is all just a business and what would they sell if the engines lasted forever?? Probably one reason the 302 was discontinued by FORD.

 

i believe i heard wix makes napa filters.

 

Yeh, I do like wix filters, air, fuel and oil. I actually have Wix Air filters in all three of my vehicles (Bumper to Bumper was having a good sale on them last fall).

As far as your filter being heavier after 3000 miles, It realy should be if its doing anything at all. But it has more weight more because the media is completly saturated than the paticulates that it has removed. Just fill a new filter to the top and wait about 10 mins The media will absorb probably 90% of that oil and you can fill the filter again. I don't know how many times you can do this but you would have to weigh two filters before installation (to ensure equal values) and then put one one your vehicle and the other fill to the top with oil for the same amount of time (without installation and you would have to top it off a few times to ensure that the media is always covered). After say 2 months then weigh both filters again. this would be a better test to see how much they are actually taking out. although if they are not drained and dried exactly the same this may not work either. Someone should do come up with a good way to test this. I would be real interested to see. Also the flow tests would really be the way to find out but there again less dense media lets more particle through. Ever wonder how those great K&N filters can get such wonderfull flow. Oil analysis show that the amount of particulates in the oil increase propotionately to the % of more flow the K&N air filter flow. I guess to all his own, use what you trust.

 

We are talking about trucks right? Well at least I am, you appear to be confused on the fact that the F-150 is a truck and not a RICER!! I'm sorry but if i constantly needed to REDLINE my truck to build up some sort of power i would be embarresed to say the least. However, you are right, I would probably fall on my face from laughing at you since you need to always redline your nissan. Talk about cutting corners. I mean come on, Let me guess, next your gona tell me that nissan will uses honda's B16B vtec piece of !!!! because it redlines at 9 grand, and to you this would be BETTER I'm sorry, were we talking about trucks or crotch rockets? A truck should have the power in the low R's. Load it up and start from a dead stop, If you are luck and you've got a manual you may be able to ease in the clutch and hope no one is watching as you horrifically try to start rolling your under powered piece of junk. In this case your power in the high revs is USELESS. But wait, this is what a truck is supposed to do without any sweat. So much for "continues to build power to redline" if it takes all dayto get it up there in the first place. Oh wait, did someone say 6 speed tranny? hell why not put it in low range and add on 15 more gears in the tranny. That should allow you to redline it all day till you get to cruisin speed.

Any REAL engine, sorry all you ricers out there (well not really ), will have power from at least 1500 and up. I can't recall the last time i was doin 65 and spinin more than 2k on the tack. Thats a real truck if you ask me.

 

Real trucks also make their power where it can be used. Lots of torque at 1000 rpm cannot be used very effectively with an automatic transmission. The Nissan is very comparable down low with the Ford but it doesn't weaken as much as the revs increase. The Endurance has no problem making real power from 1500 up like you want. Its redline is way up at around 6100 rpm even though its power peak is at 4900. Conversely, the Ford makes max hp at is redline of 5000 rpm. It seems that the Ford needs to stay closer to redline than the Nissan in order to make its power. Every test that I have seen has shown that the Endurance pulls harder and longer than the Triton. I challenge you to show me otherwise.

 

hehe my Hemi will out tow and out perform both your endurance and your triton... =-P

 

eindow.
While your Hemi may be able to outperform both the standard triton and endurance, don't you think that is a little irrelevant?

My 5.4l will outperform anything this side of a twin turbocharged SRT-10, doesn't mean its a better vehicle than a stock F-150, or Titan for that matter.

 

well they are comparing stock trucks and was just doing it as a joke give me a month and I'll be eating SRT-10's for lunch anyhow I'm not trying to start any arguements or trying to jump in on their just adding a little humor don't lose any sleep over it...

 

I got a laugh out of it

 

Hummmm? Come to think of it you say a 5.4l will outperform anything this side of a twin-turbo SRT-10 I'd like to know how that is? what do you have in it and is it and F150? Don't tell me your talking about one of those Ausi crotch rockets that look like El Caminos!!!
hehe

 

Actually ive towed quite a bit and the 1/2 ton v8 that always impreesed me was the 2 valve 5.4 triton. Its still a great tow engine but nothing compared to the 5.6 from nissan.
As somone already said that 80% torque figure at 1000k rpm is not very useful in the real world.
Atv 1992 dont know why you or anyone else thinks the endurance has to be reved to make power.
That 80% torque sounds real nice on papaer but all the tow test show the 150 behind the titan
Trailer boats mag did call the titan 2004 tow vehicle of the year and the test was conducted with a 7840lb boat.
The 150 didnt do bad but was still left behind by the titan.
Edmunds also tested these trucks and the titan came in 1st again with a 6000 lb car and dual axle trailer combo.