Arguing with a Know it all
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From: Detroit Subs
Originally Posted by Saurian
All I have to say - I wanna see that engine put in a truck and last over 200,000 miles. Exactly, it won't. That engine gets torn down every race I bet. It may not get torn down by necessity, but it certainly wouldn't last long. No conventional engine puts out those numbers and also carries longevity. One of the requirements of any diesel engine is that it be able to deal with work on the farm for years...through hundreds of thousands of miles. PSD's do it, CTD's do it, but I don't know many Duramax's that are even running around on the farm. It's too early to see their longevity though, seeing as they've been out since...99? I doubt any Duramax has reached 100,000 miles of hard farm work. Factory Freaks withstanding, Aluminum is NOT suitable in a diesel. Gas engines...sure. I mean, the weight savings of using a 350 block that weighs only 80 pounds is enormous...as well asthe heads that conduct out the heat better, pistons that suck less power from parasitic losses, cranks, etc - go ahead. They're good. I'd still prefer to use Iron parts just because I'd feel better at night. Iron's gotten pretty trick as of late, and Aluminum is losing grounds in the Valvetrain. Heads...if its an aluminum block then ok. Otherwise...you have 3.8 troubles from time to time in other engines.
Aluminum in Gassers? Go ahead. Diesels are a whole nother story. Go out and get a peice of steel, and then get a peice of aluminum. Take a sledge to them. You'll get tired pretty quickly with the Iron before you can deform the hell out of it. Just look at the Aluminum when you get done.
Aluminum in Gassers? Go ahead. Diesels are a whole nother story. Go out and get a peice of steel, and then get a peice of aluminum. Take a sledge to them. You'll get tired pretty quickly with the Iron before you can deform the hell out of it. Just look at the Aluminum when you get done.
Yes, Top Fuel engines are essentially rebuilt about every 2 minutes of run time, so longevity can't be measured by them. Strength yes, longevity no. But, most aluminum engines that I'm familiar with have steel cylinder sleeves, so I would expect the same with aluminum diesels, no? Are you saying that the problem with aluminum diesel engines is their tendency to warp or fatigue? (I don't have any experience with diesels, so I'm not familiar with their normal failure modes.)
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Originally Posted by Saurian
Ok..honestly, to settle the question of the Duramax's unreliability. Look for Banks Power..or whatever they are. If they offer extensive upgrades without mentioning the Duramax's already being at hte limit for safe handling..then I'd be greatly surprised. Fords can handle hte upgrades - ATX or MTX. Dodges can handle them with ease, though you HAVE to get the ATX upgrades as well unless you want to scatter your transmission in a few thousand miles.
This is just my bit...what I've come to know. And..I hope that you all can see what I'm tryin to say. I don't think the Cummins is worth buying a dodge for. We have a Hemi ram...and its nothing special.
This is just my bit...what I've come to know. And..I hope that you all can see what I'm tryin to say. I don't think the Cummins is worth buying a dodge for. We have a Hemi ram...and its nothing special.
Careful what you ask for!
As you read the article in full (not just what I posted here), Youll see the Allison handles the 850 ft lbs of torque well, except the 5th gear clutch pack..
Which is understandable at the rate of power. What is Interesting is they actually turn up the MAX more, than the 6.0 or Cummins... Hmmm Sure sounds like a weak Engine to me!
Edited to say: I dont think this is the new more powerful 04 design, as it just gave a general 01-04 duramax choice.
Ron
00 Excursion Limited 4x4 V-10
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From: Alaska
This is about the biggest non-combatant war going on in the US! Even though I agree with Rob about petty arguments, etc, etc. I have some input. My boyfriend and I have both been Ford people for years. For some reason we decided to buy a '77 Chevy 1500 and had nothing but problems with it from day one. It's a very nice truck to look at....but.... Tranny, head gaskets, rides like a tank, rear main leaking, just blew out the rear end this weekend, t-case (3rd one in 6 months)...and this is a truck that we are NICE to, no rallying PERIOD! We have rallied all 6 of our previously and currently owned Fords with not too many problems. Maybe Chevy's problem is that they only really made one good motor (350) and they put it in EVERYTHING and then they stop making it! They never could put a tranny behind it. But as far as getting rid of good motors go....I really miss the 302....
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Ford man here, BUT......
Isuzu has been making diesels for a LONG time, and not just for little trucks either. They make commercial engines for big trucks and also HUGE SHIPPING FREIGHTERS, so I'd say they have some experience in that field.
IMO, the jury is still out on the durability of the aluminum heads they put in GM though.......
JUST AN OPINION!!!!
Isuzu has been making diesels for a LONG time, and not just for little trucks either. They make commercial engines for big trucks and also HUGE SHIPPING FREIGHTERS, so I'd say they have some experience in that field.
IMO, the jury is still out on the durability of the aluminum heads they put in GM though.......
JUST AN OPINION!!!!
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Joined: Aug 2003
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Originally Posted by Purdue Offroader
I may be completely wrong here but don't deisels burn much hotter????? cause if it did then I would be worried about the heat because it wouldn't take long for that engine to get to hot to do anything
I've run a Duramax with the Juice-Attitude combo and a Banks Exhaust which at level 5 is over 400hp and over 800 ft/tq and I've never had any motor related problems. I've never even come close to reaching the 1350 degree (melting point of aluminum) mark pulling the traverl trailer (11,000lbs). Remember fella's lets base this conversation on actual facts and figures of the actual real world product.
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Originally Posted by Saurian
Duramax? Aluminum? This is pathetic. Aluminum belongs ONLY in gassers.
Ok..honestly, to settle the question of the Duramax's unreliability. Look for Banks Power..or whatever they are. If they offer extensive upgrades without mentioning the Duramax's already being at hte limit for safe handling..then I'd be greatly surprised. Fords can handle hte upgrades - ATX or MTX. Dodges can handle them with ease, though you HAVE to get the ATX upgrades as well unless you want to scatter your transmission in a few thousand miles.
This is just my bit...what I've come to know. And..I hope that you all can see what I'm tryin to say. I don't think the Cummins is worth buying a dodge for. We have a Hemi ram...and its nothing special.
Ok..honestly, to settle the question of the Duramax's unreliability. Look for Banks Power..or whatever they are. If they offer extensive upgrades without mentioning the Duramax's already being at hte limit for safe handling..then I'd be greatly surprised. Fords can handle hte upgrades - ATX or MTX. Dodges can handle them with ease, though you HAVE to get the ATX upgrades as well unless you want to scatter your transmission in a few thousand miles.
This is just my bit...what I've come to know. And..I hope that you all can see what I'm tryin to say. I don't think the Cummins is worth buying a dodge for. We have a Hemi ram...and its nothing special.
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I agree, the Duramax's heads have been fine from what I've seen. We could argue this issue all day long, and while I concur that iron is stronger and more durable than aluminum is, how much those two factors actually matter within the design limitations of these particular engines is pure speculation. Four years of reliability does not make the Duramax legendary by any means, but it does show that the technology can be made to work in these applications. Isuzu has built diesels this way for a long time now. Cummins is currently designing a 5.6L OHC V8 diesel for the Ram 1500, and it too will utilise aluminum heads. Cummins does not rush products to market, this engine has been in design since 98'-99', and when released will probably be every bit as durable as the 5.9 CTD is, of course only up to 8650 GVWR's though.
Aluminum would start to concern me if we were talking more than 700 FTLB or so, without actually going to a larger engine. Course this is speculation on my part- I could be wrong.
Aluminum would start to concern me if we were talking more than 700 FTLB or so, without actually going to a larger engine. Course this is speculation on my part- I could be wrong.
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From: South Dakota
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None. 1/2 ton diesel information is sparse at best, and I was lucky to find that report.
It does show that there's at least something from one of the major diesel manufacturers in development for a half ton truck. This is more than I have seen for either Ford or GM. And since this report is coming from Cummins Mfg as opposed to Dodge, or (even worse) some biased Dodge truck web site, it deserves to be taken as having credibility.
It does show that there's at least something from one of the major diesel manufacturers in development for a half ton truck. This is more than I have seen for either Ford or GM. And since this report is coming from Cummins Mfg as opposed to Dodge, or (even worse) some biased Dodge truck web site, it deserves to be taken as having credibility.
Laughing Gas
Joined: Feb 2004
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From: FLA
Duramax Lemon's
[QUOTE=ktmguy70]Is all He said, she said, I want FACTS, Give me the facts that the Duramax is a Horrible engine? Im intelligent enough to know that not every DM has lived a happy life with 0 problems,
Hate to burst your bubble ktmguy70. I just did a search on Duramax problems and the very first hit I got was a buy back, http://www.motorhomemagazine.com/cfo...g/13485549.cfm
And I quote from another site " I sold my 2004 Duramax 2500HD because it was having a hard time staying in my garage rather then the dealers. It was returned under the "lemon law." Owned it for 60 days and it was in the shop 18 times and GM still can't say what was wrong with it. Just the "service engine soon" light kept coming on and there was no reason for it according to them.
There you go....facts. Just look around a little all the big three have problems with the new stuff. It seems like Ford got thiers fixed pretty quickly compared to GM. I never really looked into the others to see if they were having any problems until someone mentioned it here. I see they are but I don't care my Harley runs really well :-)
Hate to burst your bubble ktmguy70. I just did a search on Duramax problems and the very first hit I got was a buy back, http://www.motorhomemagazine.com/cfo...g/13485549.cfm
And I quote from another site " I sold my 2004 Duramax 2500HD because it was having a hard time staying in my garage rather then the dealers. It was returned under the "lemon law." Owned it for 60 days and it was in the shop 18 times and GM still can't say what was wrong with it. Just the "service engine soon" light kept coming on and there was no reason for it according to them.
There you go....facts. Just look around a little all the big three have problems with the new stuff. It seems like Ford got thiers fixed pretty quickly compared to GM. I never really looked into the others to see if they were having any problems until someone mentioned it here. I see they are but I don't care my Harley runs really well :-)
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i tell you what purplewg thru all my years driving chevrolas i never had any problems and the reason cause i maintain it by changing the oil and etc. and where i live i drive a 2004 Chevy Crew Cab dually with the Duramax and i haul cattle witha three axle trailer from where i live to the stock show rodeo here in South Dakota and thats a 200 mile drive, i mean when i see and read these sites i thought i was in a kids forums i see a 18 year old boy trying to find out how to bash a friend of his who was driving a chevy i mean for being adults you folks cant discuss anything right always bashing some other truck, for izusu being the diesel engine for GM is that they have a reputation for having a good engines and longevity, i driven some fords pretty impressed with engine but they have to live to my condition where its cold like hell and grade thats goes for all of you you buy the truck that you like and wont to live with its your money.
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From: McChord AFB
As far as aluminum heads on a deisel goes you guys must be increadibly behind the times. The Isuzu NPR v-6 deisle uses aluminum heads and im shure you all have companies in your toan that use those becouse of reliability easy of maintnence compact size and good payload and millage. I in no way suport GM just give Isuzu some credit, they always have been and always will be ahead of thier time. In 10-20years all diesles will have aluminum or alloy heads so save wieght. Just watch...
Logistics Pro
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From: Central KY
Originally Posted by thenrich
Your completely off the mark here. It's just the opposite. Diesels run much, much cooler. The whole motor is designed to disperse heat - the true killer of any motor.
I've run a Duramax with the Juice-Attitude combo and a Banks Exhaust which at level 5 is over 400hp and over 800 ft/tq and I've never had any motor related problems. I've never even come close to reaching the 1350 degree (melting point of aluminum) mark pulling the traverl trailer (11,000lbs). Remember fella's lets base this conversation on actual facts and figures of the actual real world product.
I've run a Duramax with the Juice-Attitude combo and a Banks Exhaust which at level 5 is over 400hp and over 800 ft/tq and I've never had any motor related problems. I've never even come close to reaching the 1350 degree (melting point of aluminum) mark pulling the traverl trailer (11,000lbs). Remember fella's lets base this conversation on actual facts and figures of the actual real world product.
YOU'RE KIDDING, RIGHT? The combustion chambers of a diesel engine reach temperatures well in excess of 600° C! It doesn't take a rocket scientist to see that aluminum does NOT belong in a diesel engine. THAT is what's wrong with the Durajunk. It's foreign...and therefore it's made from cheap materials. Show me an original Durajunk with 525,000 miles on it. CTDs turn that kind of mileage all the time on original internals.
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From: pound
I'm thinking that if the information on the new 5.6 Cummins came from Cummins instead of Dodge, then it would be on the Cummins website. Until it comes from Dodge and/or Cummins, I wouldn't give it any credibility at all.
International/Navistar DID produce a six cylinder diesel for the new F-150, but Ford decided not to go with it. I heard that this engine will be considered for the new Hummer or the H2. Again, just speculation.
Nothing is concrete until we can go buy one if we want it.
I read on this board that the new Lightning will have a six speed, but researching the subject, Ford says that it will have the torqueshift. Can't believe anything you read on the internet unless it is substantially validated with concrete proof.
International/Navistar DID produce a six cylinder diesel for the new F-150, but Ford decided not to go with it. I heard that this engine will be considered for the new Hummer or the H2. Again, just speculation.
Nothing is concrete until we can go buy one if we want it.
I read on this board that the new Lightning will have a six speed, but researching the subject, Ford says that it will have the torqueshift. Can't believe anything you read on the internet unless it is substantially validated with concrete proof.
Last edited by FordLariat; Mar 30, 2004 at 03:33 AM.
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From: pound
Originally Posted by WXboy
YOU'RE KIDDING, RIGHT? The combustion chambers of a diesel engine reach temperatures well in excess of 600° C! It doesn't take a rocket scientist to see that aluminum does NOT belong in a diesel engine. THAT is what's wrong with the Durajunk. It's foreign...and therefore it's made from cheap materials. Show me an original Durajunk with 525,000 miles on it. CTDs turn that kind of mileage all the time on original internals.