P51D MUSTANG; Said like a true gentelman. TURBO TED

 

Dont Recall Who QUADDACK is, but if he left, then so be it..
I typed this once, but I did something wrong, so if it pops up twice, apologies.

I own 2 Ford Products, I Like Ford products, I like Our Excursion, even with its quality issues. I prefer the Superduty out of the big 3 HD trucks, I prefer the V-10 that Ford offers to the 8.1 in GM. HOWEVER.. I do believe that the Duramax is a Superior Diesel to the Powerstroke. Not that the Gm is a better overall Vehicle (not that I think its anyworse either) . Based on My preference and OPINION and experiences, I simply prefer the Max to the powerstroke.
Will that Change? Maybe, im not Sure, But this Is america, Im allowed to Like a GM Diesel and a Ford Gasser.

Ron

00 Excursion Limited 4x4 V-10

 

If you had the money, you could go and disassemble all three diesels. Chevy, you'll find Aluminum - and quite a bit of it. Its internals are not nearly up to par. Honestly...who's bloody idea was it to throw Aluminum internals into a DIESEL engine. Dodge, oh my god. One of the secrets to the Cummins torquiness is just its internals. Their internal parts are ALL much bigger and heavier then anything from either Ford or Chebbie. This aids in the low end torque as well - at a given rpm at lower speeds the internals carry more power - but it hurts higher end giddyup because it drains power just trying to rip those peices around inside. Ford is middle of the road. They're not as big as Cummins, or as powerful, but at least they're Iron-based. They're not weak, but they're not exactly uber-beefy either. Another reason the Ford PSD is able to take a bit of winding compared to a Cummins that falls flat. And, as everybody knows, the Ford's have always been geared properly so that this somewhat higher (but still perfectly low) torque peak is right where it needs to be.

Duramax? Aluminum? This is pathetic. Aluminum belongs ONLY in gassers.

Ford? If the 6.0 would work out all its problems - then hold on tight. I think the PSD when it is finally ready for primetime is going to show itself as the golden boy of Diesels.

Cummins? Beef, and lots of it. Big internals, big numbers - just missing a pair of cylinders.

I'd go for a 03 7.3L Ford 250 SCREW...untill 05 or maybe even 06, when EVERYTHING will be ok once again in the world of Ford Diesels.

Ok..honestly, to settle the question of the Duramax's unreliability. Look for Banks Power..or whatever they are. If they offer extensive upgrades without mentioning the Duramax's already being at hte limit for safe handling..then I'd be greatly surprised. Fords can handle hte upgrades - ATX or MTX. Dodges can handle them with ease, though you HAVE to get the ATX upgrades as well unless you want to scatter your transmission in a few thousand miles.

This is just my bit...what I've come to know. And..I hope that you all can see what I'm tryin to say. I don't think the Cummins is worth buying a dodge for. We have a Hemi ram...and its nothing special.

 

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My opinion (not that it means much at most times) is that all three manufacturers make a decent overall product, and that all of them have inherent advantages to them over the competition- far too many to bother listing in this post, sorry. Overall Ford is hard to beat IMO. Overall the Super Duty is generally the better pickup of the three trucks, but not by a wide margin in any category, from what I've seen.

As far as the diesels go, I really don't have any experience with any of them but the Cummins. I test drove a SD 6.0PSD with the 6 speed, and I did not like what I felt was lack of power below 1800 RPM. I did test drive a Duramax once, and I was'int overly impressed. In all fairness to it though, it was equipt with the Allison automatic (a really heavy duty transmission which is known for causing lots of parasitic loss), there was no 6 speed available to test, and even though GM makes one, I have NEVER personally seen one.

Duramax; Not many problems from what I've read, nor from people I have met with them. Aluminum is not my favorite material for diesel heads either, but Isuzu has been making them this way for more than 20 years now. As far as internals- yes the Ford and Dodge are more impressive looking. The Duramax has been getting the job done for more than 4 years now, to me that means it works. I don't think I'd want to mod this motor too much though.

6.0PSD; Very strong motor as the VT365 made by International. Inexcusable (IMO) teething problems last year. Seems to still have some problems, but they are a whole lot less than they had last year- hopefully this trend continues. In a year I'll test drive another and I'll see if I like it. I agree that this will be great if Ford does manage to pull off their programming changes so that you can have the best of both worlds with this motor. I was greatly anticipating this motor before it came out.

Cummins; Slowest of the three, but it's speed is less effected by load- the more load, the less effect the load has on this engine compared to the others. Inline 6 is hard to beat for many reasons. I have never seen a power problem with this motor. It does not need high RPM to make good power. In fact, unless your a farmer who constantly pulls overloaded trailers down back stretches at slow speeds, I really can't think of a reason for having 4.10 gears with this motor - 3.73's keep this motor around 2000 - 2300 RPM at highway speeds, which is perfect for the torque curve it produces, and in addition to this they are better for fuel efficiency.

I would still take the Cummins first if I had to buy right now, especially since you can buy a quad cab 3500 SRW Long Bed 4x4 SLT CTD/ 6 speed for a little over 31,000.00. An equivalent Ford would cost you almost forty, and a GM would be well over 40K. Ford is the better truck - but not 9,000.00 better, and I like Dodges well enough- they are good trucks.

IMO.

 

WHOA DUDE...I have to jump in here, I was just reading along with a smile on my face, but now I must interject a comment......

I bleed ford blue, I have three of them, 2 old trucks and a fox body mustang (see sig)...but I also have an 83 diesel suburban powered by guess what... a 6.2 It has over 250,000 miles on it, and runs like a top, doesnt have a whole lot of power, but that said, how many 21 year old NA diesels do have a lot of power? It had enough to haul its own 6,000 lbs, plus the trailer 1500 plus my 73 f100 when I bought it 5000+ thats almost 13,000 pounds.....not too shabby Id say......its never let me down

in short, I agree w/ you on the 5.7, but leave the 6.2 alone. Its the only chevy I have ever, or probably will ever own....

respectfully yours.....

 

Icicle, your experience with a Chevy diesel is definately no the norm. Their reputation before the Duramax with diesels was terrible.

 

There's nothing wrong with using aluminum in ANY engine, as long as it's the right aluminum and designed for the application. Remember, it's Chrysler's Aluminum Hemi engine, with aluminum heads, manifold, blower, rods and pistons that is putting out 8,000 HP in a Top Fuel Dragster. I'd say that's a testament to the strength of aluminum, if used properly.

 

Using aluminum in a diesel is much different than a gas engine. The main concern is the compression which is typically twice that of a gas engine.

 

You wouldn't happen to know where I could get paid 20k a year for owning one do ya????? I'm a ford guy born and raised but damn if that was true I would bite the bullet haha

 

My point was that if aluminum can handle 8000HP, I'm sure it can handle diesel applications if designed properly.

 

I may be completely wrong here but don't deisels burn much hotter????? cause if it did then I would be worried about the heat because it wouldn't take long for that engine to get to hot to do anything

 

All I have to say - I wanna see that engine put in a truck and last over 200,000 miles. Exactly, it won't. That engine gets torn down every race I bet. It may not get torn down by necessity, but it certainly wouldn't last long. No conventional engine puts out those numbers and also carries longevity. One of the requirements of any diesel engine is that it be able to deal with work on the farm for years...through hundreds of thousands of miles. PSD's do it, CTD's do it, but I don't know many Duramax's that are even running around on the farm. It's too early to see their longevity though, seeing as they've been out since...99? I doubt any Duramax has reached 100,000 miles of hard farm work. Factory Freaks withstanding, Aluminum is NOT suitable in a diesel. Gas engines...sure. I mean, the weight savings of using a 350 block that weighs only 80 pounds is enormous...as well asthe heads that conduct out the heat better, pistons that suck less power from parasitic losses, cranks, etc - go ahead. They're good. I'd still prefer to use Iron parts just because I'd feel better at night. Iron's gotten pretty trick as of late, and Aluminum is losing grounds in the Valvetrain. Heads...if its an aluminum block then ok. Otherwise...you have 3.8 troubles from time to time in other engines.

Aluminum in Gassers? Go ahead. Diesels are a whole nother story. Go out and get a peice of steel, and then get a peice of aluminum. Take a sledge to them. You'll get tired pretty quickly with the Iron before you can deform the hell out of it. Just look at the Aluminum when you get done.

 

Well said. You simply can't compare the construction of gas and diesel engines. They are totally different.

 

Yeh I do agree we act childish on these posts me included. This brand war will go on until the end of time. My brand is better than yours. I just happen to like Fords they have served me well over the years. Never had anything else. I grew up with them. I defend them at every turn.If you like dodges or chevys keep driving them if they have served you well. Hey every make offers something for everyone. We should be all happy. As far as diesel go the other guys have made pros and cons about the different diesel motors and Ill leave it go at that.

 

Honestly why is Isuzu so bad? Just becouse its forign? Becouse they are inovative whith thier use of lightwieght alloys that disapate heat faster? I think that is a VARY weak reason. If you had your choice between a company whith 100years of deisel building expericence and one whith only 50years who would you go whith? By the way Isuzu Japan and Isuzu USA are seperate companies so all US bought Isuzu producst are built in the states, and owned by Americans. Thats better than Mexican built Fords isnt it?