Hi FTE! New owner of a 1952 Ford F1 V8 Flathead my father-in-law graciously gifted us. Had it towed to a classic car shop to get running, new fuel tank/lines/fuel pump and rebuilt carburator. Was running and then died. Battery seems to keep dying and then even after recharged will click but not turn over. I am NEW to working on cars but tried my best to trouble shoot along the terminals, wires, starter relay/solenoid, starter pathway. When I was testing I have 13V going to starter relay but only 5V coming out when trying to start. took relay off and noted its marked 6V. I had chatted with my FIL who told me the truck was converted to 12V long ago (came with a 12V battery) but as I read more and looked through the truck I'm a little worried this was never converted and had been running 12V on a 6V system. It looks like I still have a generator which should be a 6V system. Debating next steps, do I go buy a 6V and try it or just commit to doing a 12V conversion myself? I'm also a little worried the starter might be dead from running on a 12V system since its clicking but not turning over. Appreciate any advice or tips!!

Starter relay. looks like it says 62-6V


View of generator, only see LL stamped on it

 

IMHO, going 6V will be simpler and more straight forward for mostly stock truck as all the Ford manufacturer provided documentation will align with that. A well maintained 6V system is just as good as a well maintained 12V system. I feel that those who boast "performance improvements" with their new 12V systems with new battery, charging apparatuses, new wires etc are comparing to a rundown 6V system. The 6V system would have the same improvements if all the same items were refreshed (and probably for a little less $$$ too)...


Before making a determination on which way to go, you should take inventory of your ignition coil, generator, starter, voltage regulator, lamps (headlight, tail, brake etc..), horn relay (missing on your firewall), and similar to determine what voltage they are configured for. Then you will know what is what to help determine what needs to be changed regardless if you decide to go 6V positive ground or 12V negative ground.

If you need help with the suggested inventory, take some pictures and record any numbers/markings, and share here and we can help you sort it all out.

So far, it seems:

Battery: 12V
Starter Solenoid: 6V
Horn Relay: Missing
Voltage Regulator: Not pictured
Ignition Coil: Undetermined
Headlights: Undetermined
Tail Lights: Undetermined
Generator: Likely 6V (12V Generators are rare)
Starter: Undetermined

 

Generator doesn't look like a flathead model, it has mounting ears like on later models. It could very well be 12v. The belt looks to be very loose, too.

 

Oh wow, thanks for your help!!

I started to check off your list to try and dertermine voltages. Both the headlights and taillights are rated 12V. I crawled under and looked at the starter but don't see any stamps or markings. Same for the generator, but this looks easier to take off and examine than the starter - maybe that's my next step? I don't see any markings on the regulator when I took the cover off.

I have been running this thing on 12V wired for postive ground (pretty sure that's how it came to me - but doubting myself now). Hopefully that didn't mess things up :/

 

Seems like it may be leaning to a 12V conversion. Let's start with the easy - take the battery to your local auto parts chain, and have them load test it.

Another bit of low hanging fruit, you might want to replace your battery cables and starter cable. Yours look old and could be deteriorated. If going 12V, you can probably get away with 1GA or 2GA, but surefire would be to get 00 rated wires. Unfortunately, local parts stores don't usually carry 00. Many members here have gone through https://www.batterycablesusa.com/00-...cables-2-0-awg with great success. A SMP B14 grounding strap also can be used.

Also, make sure the starter/engine mounting surfaces are clean as they are the ground. No paint or debris of any kind. It also helps to have the factory the starter support bracket is installed (with paint cleared for grounding) https://www.dennis-carpenter.com/tru...upport-bracket

Also, take a peek at your starter switch and let us know how many wire terminals it has so we can try to get you a reference to the correct 12V starter solenoid.

 

It sounds like you have been converted to 12v, but perhaps not completely and the solenoid is fried. Since you have enough 12v stuff there, it would be foolish to convert back, imho. I'd try putting a new 12v solenoid on and see what that does. It needs to be done no matter what so you might as well start there. Solenoid clicking when trying to start is a common symptom of either a weak battery or bad solenoid. Since you say your battery is fully charged and putting out 13v to the solenoid, it makes sense a 6v solenoid may have gone bad. Start with that and report back your findings.

PS, welcome to the forum!

 

Thanks so much for everyone's help! I will plan on getting a 12V solenoid and trying that, the one I took out was a 3 terminal.

Any thought on whether I should keep the 12V battery as a positive ground? All of what I'm reading on this forum makes me think most systems go negative ground when they convert

Thanks!

 

Please heed my note from earlier on finding the correct 12V solenoid. While they all can look similar, there are a few different types that are wired differently.

Generally all have a power in (from battery), power out (to the starter), and a trigger (crank signal from the ignition switch). Where things first differ is the crank signaling. Our Ford trucks used two different stock style setups. The first style with a single terminal starter button requires a completed ground as the trigger signal. The later style seeks requires hot signal. But it gets even more complex than that. Some have two small terminals that can be used for the trigger circuit, each requiring a ground and a hot. Some also have two small terminals, but one is a trigger, the other goes to the coil to give resistance bypass for spark on startup. There can be variations from these as well. Because of all these and other variances, it is extremely important to understand which system your truck is wired for, one of the stock, or some other alternative. The place to start is to look at your starter button and see how many wire terminals it has.

 

As a matter of common sense, since the automotive world has been wired 12 negative ground for nearly 70 years, it seems foolhardy, to me anyway, to do anything less. If it were me, I'd be making sure my truck was setup foolproof from idiots and finish the conversion fully to 12v neg ground. No one opening the hood to help or work on your truck would ever expect it to be backward, and honestly, you couldn't blame them.

When you start your truck, is it with a key turning on to run, and then to start momentarily like a modern vehicle, or is the key just to on and you still use a starter button in addition to the key switch? Depending on the type of starter button you have will determine some of the rest of your wiring. Your answer will guide us with further direction.

 

It would help to let us know where you live. I have helped many that I meet when I go to car shows in my local area.You can always get help from people when you meet them at te shows. A lot of great people there like on here. If you are close to me in the Clinton TN area I would be happy to help. Just an ideal

 

welcome to OlePapaLuke

i'm another who has done many a flaty from 6v to 12v, and agree with the others, a well maintained 6v starts as well as a 12, add another who has done many a 6 volt to 12 volt

i can't tell if the whole truck was rewired, please take note you can run 12v on 6v wires NOT 6 v on 12V ,12 volts wires can't handle the amps a 6 volts system runs as the wire gauge is smaller

 

agree as flats didn't have the ears that's most likely off a old Y block or a FE,

 

Other odds and ends - Which terminal on the coil (+ or -) has a wire running to the bottom of the distributor? This will help determine if the truck is set up for pos or neg ground.

I don't see a ceramic ignition resistor anywhere in the pictures. You don't want to run 12v to the points or you'll burn them and it won't start. Your coil could be internally resisted.

6v starters will work on 12v but you will probably break a few bendix springs along the way.

 

Thanks for everyone's advice! This forum is really really great. I live in Charlottesville VA now, would love to connect if anyone lives close by.

Doing more investigation, the Coil's + terminal goes to the base of the distributor. It is a 12V and states on it "no external resistor needed".

The car is set up with the original turn key + ignition button to start. The ignition button appears to have two wires coming from it

With that set up, any advice on which 12V starter solenoid to buy

Currently buying some replacement cables for battery/starter

 

I don't run ballasts for the coil. I buy coils with internal resistor. The only vehicle that I know for sure from the factory is a 1963 triumph tr3B. That's what I ask for every time I kneed a coil.