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I'm starting to think it's not the IPR valve at all but the pump. The return passage the dumps oil back to the front cover has to be plugged up somehow. I'm almost back to the house I'm going to pull one of my spare pumps off the shelf and see if I can work out how that could happen.
Ok, it was Mrs. Peacock in the NSP with some BS. Always thought she was a shady bi*ch. For real though I'm thinking you might have something stuck on or around the funky little square thing that is behind the non serviceable plug. The first pic is of the IPR port and the rear plug passage while shining a light through the the NSP port. You can see the are communicated but when assembled that square thing sets between the two. The rear plug passage is what connects the 2 discharge ports btw. The second pic is of the forward discharge ports with the light still in the NSP. That also happens to lead straight to the belly of the beast. The last pic is the NSP port e/ square thing. So basically the oil gets pumped to the forward discharge where it connects to the rear plug passage then via the NSP down to the IPR valve. If the valve is closed oil is forced to the rails/injectors. If it's open oil passes through the valve and into a small hole that leads to another passage back to the front cover. Clear as 10k mile engine oil? The short short version is if the NSP passageway is plugged then oil never even gets to the IPR valve.
Ok, it was Mrs. Peacock in the NSP with some BS. Always thought she was a shady bi*ch. For real though I'm thinking you might have something stuck on or around the funky little square thing that is behind the non serviceable plug. The first pic is of the IPR port and the rear plug passage while shining a light through the the NSP port. You can see the are communicated but when assembled that square thing sets between the two. The rear plug passage is what connects the 2 discharge ports btw. The second pic is of the forward discharge ports with the light still in the NSP. That also happens to lead straight to the belly of the beast. The last pic is the NSP port e/ square thing. So basically the oil gets pumped to the forward discharge where it connects to the rear plug passage then via the NSP down to the IPR valve. If the valve is closed oil is forced to the rails/injectors. If it's open oil passes through the valve and into a small hole that leads to another passage back to the front cover. Clear as 10k mile engine oil? The short short version is if the NSP passageway is plugged then oil never even gets to the IPR valve.
So the short is remove the HPOP and then remove the NSP to check for debris? Just trying to make sure there isn't another magical way.
You could try removing the rear plug and the IPR valve and attempt to flush between them. The hitch there is A) the square thing will still be in the way so could be fruitless, B) if you attempt to back flush you risk send whatever the blockage is, if there actually is one, to either the pump guts or the discharge leading to the injectors. It could also flush right out and all is well. Just a roll of the dice. The pump is pretty easy to get out though. The bowl and reservoir don't have to come out to remove the pump. Only the gear cover plate and gear, the 2 discharge hoses to the heads, and the 2 bolts holding the pump in place. The gasket is reusable, so o rings and Loctite will be the only things to source.
You could try removing the rear plug and the IPR valve and attempt to flush between them. The hitch there is A) the square thing will still be in the way so could be fruitless, B) if you attempt to back flush you risk send whatever the blockage is, if there actually is one, to either the pump guts or the discharge leading to the injectors. It could also flush right out and all is well. Just a roll of the dice. The pump is pretty easy to get out though. The bowl and reservoir don't have to come out to remove the pump. Only the gear cover plate and gear, the 2 discharge hoses to the heads, and the 2 bolts holding the pump in place. The gasket is reusable, so o rings and Loctite will be the only things to source.
To play devil's advocate for a moment, if I have debris in this area, why does my pressure become uncontrolled and go high only once the engine is warm?
I can only speculate on that little wrench in the works. Best guess it's got something to do with that oil that Ford doesn't like for some reason. If you think about it a multi weight oil is designed to increase viscosity at higher temps. Maybe it gets tackier and bridges the passage when warm.
With the same line of thinking how the heck would pressure stay high even if the valve is unplugged? What else could it be? I can't come up with any other scenarios that fit enough of the symptoms to be at least plausible. The options I see are to ll the pump for little more than time invested, or go drop $200 on a new ICP without any data even suggesting that it might be bad.
I can only speculate on that little wrench in the works. Best guess it's got something to do with that oil that Ford doesn't like for some reason. If you think about it a multi weight oil is designed to increase viscosity at higher temps. Maybe it gets tackier and bridges the passage when warm.
With the same line of thinking how the heck would pressure stay high even if the valve is unplugged? What else could it be? I can't come up with any other scenarios that fit enough of the symptoms to be at least plausible. The options I see are to ll the pump for little more than time invested, or go drop $200 on a new ICP without any data even suggesting that it might be bad.
My plan is this,
Drain all the oil
Vacuum HPOP res.
Vacuum oil in head galleries
Clean my new Motorcraft IPR valve
Put in proper rated oil
Test some more
Just now reading through this. My 2 cents, which is more than it’s worth…
The new motorcraft IPR has to be physically stuck to run without the wiring.
If this were related to blocked passages or oil then it should do it with all the IPRs not just 1.
Of course, what caused the IPR to stick? Contamination? From? But in my opinion that’s somewhat separate from the issue with other IPRs and would not focus there right now. Unless maybe you want to check it out to see if it’s stuck.
How does the IPR wiring/PCM operate? Does it adjust the ground to raise percentage? If so you could be dealing with a short to ground in the wiring.
I still think the generic ICP is suspect even though it’s mostly matching a mechanical gauge. We’ve just seen them do so many strange things here on the forum. I’m not saying to go buy one, but instead I’d be considering doing testing with the ICP disconnected for now. Ok, edit before even hitting submit. Still curious of what it does but since the IPR is only being commanded minimal % then it seems less likely the ICP is the root cause. Unless there’s a short for a common reference signal. Have you tried disconnecting all “unneeded” sensors? Someone on here has been recommending this due to his previous issue but I can’t remember who at the moment.
Wait, so the mechanical gauge at idle at 3000psi was with which IPR? And the ICP matches that?
I’m guessing the 4.xx% IPR might be as low as the PCM will allow itself to go. So it’s seeing a high ICP value and trying to compensate in the control but it’s not happening. Which leads me back to a short in the IPR wiring.
Maybe I missed it, have you pulled back the wire loom and checked?
It's a plan, and if you fail to plan, you plan to fail.
Yup!
Originally Posted by RacinJasonWV
Just now reading through this. My 2 cents, which is more than it’s worth…
The new motorcraft IPR has to be physically stuck to run without the wiring.
If this were related to blocked passages or oil then it should do it with all the IPRs not just 1.
Of course, what caused the IPR to stick? Contamination? From? But in my opinion that’s somewhat separate from the issue with other IPRs and would not focus there right now. Unless maybe you want to check it out to see if it’s stuck.
How does the IPR wiring/PCM operate? Does it adjust the ground to raise percentage? If so you could be dealing with a short to ground in the wiring.
I still think the generic ICP is suspect even though it’s mostly matching a mechanical gauge. We’ve just seen them do so many strange things here on the forum. I’m not saying to go buy one, but instead I’d be considering doing testing with the ICP disconnected for now. Ok, edit before even hitting submit. Still curious of what it does but since the IPR is only being commanded minimal % then it seems less likely the ICP is the root cause. Unless there’s a short for a common reference signal. Have you tried disconnecting all “unneeded” sensors? Someone on here has been recommending this due to his previous issue but I can’t remember who at the moment.
Wait, so the mechanical gauge at idle at 3000psi was with which IPR? And the ICP matches that?
I’m guessing the 4.xx% IPR might be as low as the PCM will allow itself to go. So it’s seeing a high ICP value and trying to compensate in the control but it’s not happening. Which leads me back to a short in the IPR wiring.
Maybe I missed it, have you pulled back the wire loom and checked?
I've been fighting this a few months now so I'll try to answer your questions 1 by 1.
The brandy new IPR did seem to work until it didn't. During a drive I noticed the pressure went back up and then it died pulling back into my neighborhood. I wasn't creating logs at that time of the process. Later I tried it again and saw the pressure climb and unplugged it and started the truck back up.
From my understanding the IPR operates off of pulsing 12v to the unit until ICP pressure is happy. I think it's actually pulsing the ground thru the ECU but same idea.
Everytime I've tested, the mechanical matches the ICP pressure. When cold it's great at 600 psi ish, then warm and a drive it will idle at between 2-3kpsi. Confirmed by 4k mechanical. I'm running both the mechanical and ICP from different ports.
I pulled the engine wiring harness a few weeks ago and tore off all loom and wrap. Didn't find anything odd, but I cleaned it all and replaced the low pressure oil sensor pigtail, the IPR pigtail and the exhaust cold start gate pigtail "thing". Rewrapped everything and and reinstalled. The pigtails were questionable or broken so I replaced them with all Alliant units, soldered and heat shrunk.
No possibility you mixed up the IPR and EBPV pigtails is there? They are the same connector and can physically reach. I figure it's unlikely but throwing it out there anyway.
No possibility you mixed up the IPR and EBPV pigtails is there? They are the same connector and can physically reach. I figure it's unlikely but throwing it out there anyway.
At this point, nope! I disconnected both and she she runs! I guess its like an ol' 7.3 and just wont die! Working on uploading the a 35sec video that must be too high resolution but I'm chopping it up so I can post it.
I changed the oil and filter, sucked as much oil as I could out of the heads and HPOP reservoir, I removed the O-rings and seals from the MotorCraft IPR valve and sonic cleaned it for 25 minutes and then installed. Cranked the truck for 2 long cycles before it fired up. It fired up and instantly went to 3,000psi! Everything seemed the same. Ran the truck at an idle for 30minutes and it went up and down between 2,700-4,000psi per both gauges as it idled and hitting the loud pedal which I only did to see if the pressure would snap back. I'm now determined that this IPR is just fully stuck! I dare not disassemble it before speaking with Brian at JeliBuilt as that's where I bought it from.
Last edited by Matt_fury; Jul 28, 2024 at 09:58 PM.
Reason: Wrote incorrect information
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