04 Excursion no boost
Thread Starter
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5th Wheeling
Joined: Jun 2023
Posts: 42
Likes: 8
Ok, at 55mph and accelerating, here's the snapshot numbers ForScan read:
ICP, V: 2.05
ICP, kPa: 12203.1
ICP_DES, kPa: 12132.8
IPR, %: 50.00
I couldn't find 'duty cycle', but tracked this one cause it sounded maybe close:
LOAD, OBDII, %: 43.14
ICP, V: 2.05
ICP, kPa: 12203.1
ICP_DES, kPa: 12132.8
IPR, %: 50.00
I couldn't find 'duty cycle', but tracked this one cause it sounded maybe close:
LOAD, OBDII, %: 43.14
Fleet Owner
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 27,881
Likes: 3,595
The IPR % is actually % Duty Cycle. There is no "positioner" on the IPR valve so we do not have any way of knowing what its position is. Besides it is a fast acting, duty cycled, type operation; and that IPR% value is ONLY a command signal from the PCM.
Fleet Owner
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 27,881
Likes: 3,595
I would look for the exhaust leaks as discussed above, and also look into a fuel pressure sensor and gauge. Beyond that, I would only be guessing, but would say that the turbo might be the most logical culprit.
If you had access to the Ford IDS system, a cylinder contribution test might be helpful.
If you had access to the Ford IDS system, a cylinder contribution test might be helpful.
Fleet Owner
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 27,881
Likes: 3,595
You haven't really done any tests to verify you are getting proper action of the turbo vanes or whether or not you are getting full boost pressures. So the test parameters we looked at, under acceleration conditions, were only ICP and IPR. Let me look for some resources to use for testing the VGT system.
Fleet Owner
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 27,881
Likes: 3,595
https://www.powerstrokehub.com/servi...2073%C2%B0%20F
http://www.ford-trucks.com/ford-manuals/Tech%20Turbo%20Guide%20for%20the%206.0L%20Power%20 Stroke%20Engine.pdf
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=be9YklDzn_Y
From @HydroTek :
Using ForScan to test the VGT system:
Click "read pid data" button - 3rd down, double click an empty gauge slot.
When the pop window opens, be sure at the top PCM is selected, then to the right select "Control" from the drop down box
Select the VGT, accept and close this window.
Now about mid way on the bottom bar of the main window is a button with sliders and an X on it -- labeled Control
Click that and the control window opens -- you will see a slider to control the VGT
You should already be monitoring MAP and EBP, you will need to watch these values
Slide to 99% and observe the sound and pressures -- then slide to 100%; The sound and pressures should change dramatically
To "exercise" the vanes, keep switching from 99 to 100% -- this fully closes the vanes and due to a glitch in ForScan, fully opens the vanes at 100
keep doing this exercise until the vanes operate quickly -- or until your finger is numb
you may need to rev the engine to about 1500-2000 to help with this
http://www.ford-trucks.com/ford-manuals/Tech%20Turbo%20Guide%20for%20the%206.0L%20Power%20 Stroke%20Engine.pdf
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=be9YklDzn_Y
From @HydroTek :
Using ForScan to test the VGT system:
Click "read pid data" button - 3rd down, double click an empty gauge slot.
When the pop window opens, be sure at the top PCM is selected, then to the right select "Control" from the drop down box
Select the VGT, accept and close this window.
Now about mid way on the bottom bar of the main window is a button with sliders and an X on it -- labeled Control
Click that and the control window opens -- you will see a slider to control the VGT
You should already be monitoring MAP and EBP, you will need to watch these values
Slide to 99% and observe the sound and pressures -- then slide to 100%; The sound and pressures should change dramatically
To "exercise" the vanes, keep switching from 99 to 100% -- this fully closes the vanes and due to a glitch in ForScan, fully opens the vanes at 100
keep doing this exercise until the vanes operate quickly -- or until your finger is numb
you may need to rev the engine to about 1500-2000 to help with this
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Thread Starter
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5th Wheeling
Joined: Jun 2023
Posts: 42
Likes: 8
I did the procedure you listed from HydroTech. I recorded MAP and EBP values while the control slider was at 99 and 100. The vanes seemed to be responsive right away. At idle I could hear a difference. It sounded more "throaty" at 100. Even still, I followed the directions and jumped between 99 and 100. Every time it responded immediately. When at 1500 RPM, it sounded like it did before this problem. I mean, you could hear the whine and a jump in RPMs. I got a result! I switched between 99 and 100 at 1500 RM and it was also very responsive. Immediate like at idle.
Here's the EBP/MAP from the test at idle:
@ 99% -
EBP V: 1.30
EBP A kPa: 128.8
EBP DSD kPa: 17.0
MAP V: 1.30
MAP kPa: 100.3
MAP OBDII kPa: 100.3
@ 100:
EBP V: 1.01
EBP A kPa: 108.0
EBP DSD kPa: 17.0
MAP V: 1.30
MAP kPa: 100.3
MAP OBDII kPa: 100.0
Here's the EBP/MAP from the test at idle:
@ 99% -
EBP V: 1.30
EBP A kPa: 128.8
EBP DSD kPa: 17.0
MAP V: 1.30
MAP kPa: 100.3
MAP OBDII kPa: 100.3
@ 100:
EBP V: 1.01
EBP A kPa: 108.0
EBP DSD kPa: 17.0
MAP V: 1.30
MAP kPa: 100.3
MAP OBDII kPa: 100.0
Last edited by RonMcG; Jun 21, 2023 at 09:30 AM.
Thread Starter
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5th Wheeling
Joined: Jun 2023
Posts: 42
Likes: 8
I was having a tough time getting my probes on the pins on the VGT solenoid. Then the plug actually came half way apart, (it kinda crumbled, really brittle), so I'm gonna get another plug. I can use that pig tail to get a good test on the solenoid.
The few times I got what seemed to be an actual reading, they were under 3 ohms.
Ordering the plug right now.
The few times I got what seemed to be an actual reading, they were under 3 ohms.
Ordering the plug right now.
Fleet Owner
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 27,881
Likes: 3,595
Your numbers look OK, but they are off a bit. It sounds like the turbo is responsive though.
Just be aware that the EBP_A is in absolute pressure and the EBP_DSD is in gauge pressure (the difference will be what the Baro reads).
From post #24:
Your EBP_A (at 99%) of 108.8 will be the same as EBP_G of (108 - 100.8) or 7.2 psig. And EBP_DSD was 17. So that one is a little low, but again, that could just be the normal variability in the test.
Your EBP_A (at 100%) of 128.8 will be the same as EBP_G of (128.8 - 100.8) or 28 psig. And EBP_DSD was 17. So it is a little high, but that could ALSO just be the normal variability in the test.
Lets see what the connector does for you. It definitely needs to be solid and it is known for failing due to the turbo heat.
Just be aware that the EBP_A is in absolute pressure and the EBP_DSD is in gauge pressure (the difference will be what the Baro reads).
From post #24:
Your EBP_A (at 99%) of 108.8 will be the same as EBP_G of (108 - 100.8) or 7.2 psig. And EBP_DSD was 17. So that one is a little low, but again, that could just be the normal variability in the test.
Your EBP_A (at 100%) of 128.8 will be the same as EBP_G of (128.8 - 100.8) or 28 psig. And EBP_DSD was 17. So it is a little high, but that could ALSO just be the normal variability in the test.
Lets see what the connector does for you. It definitely needs to be solid and it is known for failing due to the turbo heat.
Mountain Pass
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 233
Likes: 65
From: Southern Indiana
Testing with ForScan will not track with desired values at all
Main thing to get from that test is, will the vanes respond quickly, and do the EBP and MAP pressures rise
I would expect the EBP to be higher than MAP by about 10-15 psi
A leaking EGR valve could cause the pressures to be lower than expected
Does this engine still have the EGR cooler and valve ?
Main thing to get from that test is, will the vanes respond quickly, and do the EBP and MAP pressures rise
I would expect the EBP to be higher than MAP by about 10-15 psi
A leaking EGR valve could cause the pressures to be lower than expected
Does this engine still have the EGR cooler and valve ?
Thread Starter
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5th Wheeling
Joined: Jun 2023
Posts: 42
Likes: 8
Okay, I replaced the plug for the VGT. I got a consistant ohm reading of 4.4/4.5, According to a prior link, that is within range while hot.
Test drive shows no change. Still not getting the turbo.
What next?
Test drive shows no change. Still not getting the turbo.
What next?
Logistics Pro
Joined: Jul 2014
Posts: 4,673
Likes: 531
From: Houston, Texas
Air filter clean? No crack in the MAP tube. MAP nipple clear. IDK, sounds like the turbo is working. You talked about it shifting into third differently - is your tranny starting out in first? Starting from second would bog bad and then catch some power at higher RPMs, kinda like you describe. You can monitor which gear you're in using Forscan. Are you monitoring fuel pressure while driving? All-in-all, my guess is the failing injector(s), maybe due to weak fuel pressure.