460 build
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Elder User
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460 build
Just a low buck .030 build for a firewood hauler and trailer tugger, hoping others will chime in. Got early efi pistons in the hole .020, running a .027 gasket would yield "ok" quench of .047; With a ported set of d3's with a 98cc head puts me right in at 9.3-1. Can anyone confirm? There are a 100 different calculators and 100 different answers, just lookin for a 87-89 safe engine.
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Elder User
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Bottom end is assembled, so I don't have option to deck to 0 or change pistons, by going with a thicker gasket, I lose quench, but also c/r, what would be safer? A .040 gasket with .062 quench at 9.2-1 or .027 gasket with .047 quench at 9.5-1?
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Big Block V8 - 385 Series (6.1/370, 7.0/429, 7.5/460) - Ford Truck Enthusiasts Forums
Big Block V8 - 385 Series (6.1/370, 7.0/429, 7.5/460) - Ford Truck Enthusiasts Forums
Cargo Master
Joined: Oct 2005
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From: NJ
What are the part number and specs on those pistons? I run KB137 in my 460. It's about 9.8:1 IIRC. Needs 91+ octane but it performs very well and delivers double digit MPG even in a lifted truck. You really need to pay attention to dynamic compression ratio and play with different cam choices to have high enough compression to get good economy and performance but low enough to run on pump gas. KB137 will work on a budget, but they're hypereutectic... If I had to do it again I'd have spent the extra for forged given my build is skirting to the edge of detonation.
These days with a $.50 spread between 87 and 93 I would consider building it to run on 87 octane, increase displacement to 545 to make up for the loss of power, and go with a 38 gal rear tank to make up for the loss of range.
These days with a $.50 spread between 87 and 93 I would consider building it to run on 87 octane, increase displacement to 545 to make up for the loss of power, and go with a 38 gal rear tank to make up for the loss of range.
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This increases the costs, which are passed on to the consumer.
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Moderator
Joined: Jan 2001
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From: Virginia
What are the part number and specs on those pistons? I run KB137 in my 460. It's about 9.8:1 IIRC. Needs 91+ octane but it performs very well and delivers double digit MPG even in a lifted truck. You really need to pay attention to dynamic compression ratio and play with different cam choices to have high enough compression to get good economy and performance but low enough to run on pump gas. KB137 will work on a budget, but they're hypereutectic... If I had to do it again I'd have spent the extra for forged given my build is skirting to the edge of detonation.
These days with a $.50 spread between 87 and 93 I would consider building it to run on 87 octane, increase displacement to 545 to make up for the loss of power, and go with a 38 gal rear tank to make up for the loss of range.
These days with a $.50 spread between 87 and 93 I would consider building it to run on 87 octane, increase displacement to 545 to make up for the loss of power, and go with a 38 gal rear tank to make up for the loss of range.
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Cargo Master
Joined: Oct 2005
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From: NJ
Not sure I follow with what is passed on to the consumer? Stroker kits cost what they cost, as does a 38 gal tank. Lower compression will give lower efficiency, fewer MPG. The idea is the cost per mile for fuel is less while maintaining the same or greater power and amortizing the additional cost to build the stroker TCO of the engine over some number of miles (likely more miles with a lower compression build than a high compression/high output build) should be lower than a high compression smaller displacement build. Without a back to back comparison it's just ballparking numbers, but I don't understand what you mean by costs passed on to the consumer.
Cargo Master
Joined: Oct 2005
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From: NJ
'Tis the cost of durability, a little extra noise when cold is well worth the additional strength particularly when running near the edge of detonation in a 6000 lbs tow pig. I say this after getting a tank of less than 93 octane from some schmuck who wanted an extra few dollars from my fillup. My hypereutectic pistons miraculously survived but it took out the rings on 6 cylinders and hammered a few bearings among other damage. All that damage and a solid 3 days of work to freshen up the engine from 15 minutes on the highway with insufficient octane. I got lucky, damage should have been worse.
pedant
Joined: Jan 2008
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From: EXTREME southwest CT
I think the OP has stated the short block is already done, and he is not going back.
Stroker kits are nice (and will increase compression all by themselves) but a thousand bucks is 2,000 gallons of fuel at a $0.50 a gallon difference
Stroker kits are nice (and will increase compression all by themselves) but a thousand bucks is 2,000 gallons of fuel at a $0.50 a gallon difference
Cargo Master
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 2,298
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From: NJ
I don't know if OP's engine is well matched to be a performer but there is always the option to go back and do it right if it's not something that will work well in the intended application... It's just easier to do it before it's in the truck than after installing it and some number of miles of frustration.
A stroker kit does not increase compression by itself, it comes down to piston and head selection.
I crunched some numbers and assuming a $.50 spread between 87 and 93 at current prices, $1k for a stroker, and 2 MPG difference (12.5 vs 10.5) it would take 155k miles for the additional cost of a stroker to pay for itself in fuel savings. The savings do come, just later than I thought. If gas gets price increases enough it may never pay for itself. Cost to freshen up is the same either way so it's gravy after that if prices stay low. A gamble over 155k+ miles though.
A stroker kit does not increase compression by itself, it comes down to piston and head selection.
I crunched some numbers and assuming a $.50 spread between 87 and 93 at current prices, $1k for a stroker, and 2 MPG difference (12.5 vs 10.5) it would take 155k miles for the additional cost of a stroker to pay for itself in fuel savings. The savings do come, just later than I thought. If gas gets price increases enough it may never pay for itself. Cost to freshen up is the same either way so it's gravy after that if prices stay low. A gamble over 155k+ miles though.
pedant
Joined: Jan 2008
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From: EXTREME southwest CT
Same bore, same heads, same compression height with flat tops or whatever...
942.25cc crammed into a 97cc chamber plus deck is not the same as 1049cc crammed into the same volume (460 V 512 stroker as example)
flame away if you like.
This poor guy was only asking which head gasket to use with 87-89 octane pump gas in his woods truck, not how to build a performance 460.
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