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the new Engine is in and the Truck runs fine, but i think maybe i have to adjust the Vacuumswitch for the Modulator to get the C6 shifts earlyer.
EDITED 10-07-16 to correct a mistake.
Do you mean adjust the VRV (Vacuum Regulator Valve) on the Driver's side of the IP??
This controls the shift points and I have a chart that shows the SPEED of truck when the shift should occur, not the engine RPM. I will post this chart for you after this post. The Chart appears to be from 1984-1986.
Adjusting the VRV:
When the VRV is properly adjusted "EXACTLY" as in the adjustment procedure from the Ford Shop Manual, the adjustment will be correct.
I wrote "EXACTLY" because the adjustment procedure steps must be followed very carefully in correct sequence. If you miss one detail or one step the adjustment will fail.
I made that mistake because I thought I had the step by step procedure correct in my memory - result = I attempted to adjust the VRV 15-20 times with no success.
To avoid that error, study the steps carefully to memorize them and have the printed instructions with you and follow them precisely each time you attempt to adjust the VRV.
Note: If the VRV is in good condition you can adjust it by "trial and error" method which is fine, and this is much easier than the shop procedure.
This is how I finally got my VRV adjusted. It works fine for now. I will be removing it next year to fix/restore some internal wearing parts.
When the VRV is worn too much it may be very difficult to find an adjustment position for proper shifting.
So i like to ask you were are your shifpoints?
My F250 shifts 1 to 2. around 2000 rpm and 2. to 3. around 2200 rpm if i accelerate moderate.
regards from Germany
Torsten
Last edited by Fixnstuff; Oct 7, 2016 at 11:31 AM.
Reason: Deleted incorrect comment
SHIFT POINT TABLE 6.9L DIESEL in MPH. USA and CANADA
This table was very difficult to find (on the web) It is not in the Ford Shop Manuals. This is from a Technical Service Bulletin which I was NOT able to locate. If you have a C6 you should copy this!
This appears to be for the 1984-86 models but will also apply to 87 and later trucks with the C6 transmission.
This table shows Shift Points (up and down) in MPH so for Kilometres Per Hour you will need to use conversion software (available free)
I will come back tomorrow after some SLEEP and discuss the term 'DETENT' used in the table so we will understand exactly what it means. Basically I think it is the position of the throttle where the kick-down shift to a lower gear would normally occur.
I am quite sure that the LEFT side of the table is for E-Series VANS and the RIGHT side of the table is for F-Series TRUCKS.
ORIGINAL IMAGE:
REVERSED (negative) IMAGE:
THAT IS THE BEST CLARITY THAT I CAN OBTAIN FROM THE ORIGINAL IMAGE CLARITY WHICH WAS POOR
I'm very tired but I'll try to explain the the table:
I HOPE this is close to correct. Comments and corrections are appreciated.
The question revolves around the meaning of 'DETENT.' Transmission techs will probably KNOW. I am just logically speculating and I cannot examine or drive my truck now to get a closer estimate.
Choose the column that best matches your axle ratio. (E-Series LEFT, F-Series RIGHT)
1-2 Min. = 1st to 2nd gear at Minimum throttle
1-2 To Detent = 1st to 2nd gear at moderate acceleration probably 1/2 to 3/4 pedal. If I understand this correctly there should be a point in the accelerator pedal movement where there is some resistance felt and that is the 'detent.' If anyone else can help to define 'detent' your input comments would be very much appreciated!
1-2 Thru Detent = full throttle, full acceleration or very near that.
2-3 Min. = 2nd to 3rd gear Minimum throttle.
2-3 To Detent = 2nd to 3rd gear probably at around 3/4 pedal (I'm not sure of the detent point)
2-3 Thru Detent = 2nd to 3rd gear at approx full throttle.
DOWN SHIFTING:
3-2 Torq Demand Max = I think this is the lower speed range where pressing moderately on the accelerator (1/2-3/4?) will cause a downshift from 3rd to 2nd gear. 'Max' I think would be at the upper end of that speed range
3-2 Thru Detent Max = I think this is the highest speed range for downshifting from 3rd to 2nd gear and requires full acceleration, full throttle or "pedal to the floor"
3-1 Thru Detent Max = Speed range in 3rd gear where full throttle will case a downshift from 3rd gear to 1st gear.
2-1 or 3-1 Closed Throttle = Speed range where the transmission will shift to 1st gear from 3rd or 2nd gear with accelerator pedal in the engine idle position (no push on the pedal)
2-1 Low Range = Not sure about this one but it appears to be the low speed range while driving normally where the transmission will shift from 2nd gear to 1st gear while slowing down or speeding up. I am confused because I am very tired and I can't take my truck out to experiment.
This is the best that I can do for now to try to interpret the shift Point Table.
I thought that my truck was shifting fine (acceptable shift points) but after reviewing this table I can see that mine is out of adjustment far enough to try to correct it when I get the time and convenience to mess with it.
Today i did the adjust the VRV, i loosen the two Hexscrews and turn it around 2 mm back to the Aircleanerside.
Now my Truck shifts a little earlyer 1 to 2. around 1500 rpm and 2. to 3. around 1700 rpm and it shifts mutch smother than before the adjust.
I know now it was o.K. and in the normal Range but for my personal Drivefeeling it feels mutch better to me now, i must concentrate me to feel the shifting and this is the way i like it.
Because about that my second Classic is a 1978 Lincoln Continental Mark V
the test with the Vacuumpump and Gauge i have done before to be safe that the Valve work!
But i think it's not wrong to adjust it the way i did it today to get the personal best shiftingpoint, or what did you think ?
regards
Torsten
First, I am not a transmission tech. just a home mechanic and I try to do everything correctly to specifications, so I study about what In intend to do. My experience with the C6 is very limited but I know when the shifting is acceptable.
My views are based on my own experience and what I have read (usually very much)
I think your adjustment is fine if it is not too faroff from the shift points shown in the table. Many owners have adjusted the VRV as you have, "by trial and error" = adjust and then test it, if not acceptable, re-adjust and test again until it is acceptable.
The Shift Table represents a NEW VRV, not an old one with much wear to the internal lever and cam.
If the VRV has much wear inside then it will probably not be adjustable to match the Shift Table. As close as you can get to the shift speeds in the table is the best in my opinion.
If the transmission seems to be shifting OK then I doubt if any damage will be done to the transmission or the VRV if it does not match the shift speeds in the table.
It is OK for the C6 to have a somewhat hard or aggressive shift, like a "bump" when it hits the next gear, it is a very tough transmission. I don't think it is OK if the shifting is too soft, where it feels close to slipping.
If the shifting feels solid when the truck is working then it should be good.
I am including a lot of information in my replies to benefit others who will read this topic; I am using my own terminology when I don't know the correct name of parts:
Which one did you use? I can see about 50+% wear on the yellow plastic cam lever in the LEFT VRV.
At the bottom end of the cam lever there is a round post that faces into the cam that engages inside the green cam. As the throttle is increased the cam turns to the RIGHT, the cam lever moves UP and this closes the diaphragm, BUT the diaphragm does NOT completely seal a small passageway in the valve body. There are 4 very tiny passageways that allow limited air flow through the body when the diaphragm is closed.
That post on the cam lever is the part that wears out first in a VRV. The diaphragm will last a very long time.
I've been researching and working on making/manufacturing or having someone else manufacture repair kits for defective VRVs but I have that project set aside probably for a few more months.
HERE I will post a photo of a worn out cam lever with wear on the cam and what will need to be done to repair a worn out cam lever. ALSO A VERY IMPORTANT WARNING ABOUT A VERY TINY PART!\
PARTS FROM RIGHT TO LEFT:
Far right: Yellow Cam Lever. The circle mark that you see at the left end of the lever should be a round post that sticks up. That post engages with the inside ramp the round yellow cam. On this lever the post is almost completely worn off with only a tiny part of the post remaining at the left edge. Not enough material left to engage with the cam and operate the diaphragm. This is the number one and most common cause of VRV failure.
What we need to do to fix this lever: Figure out a way to replace that post. My idea thus far is to make a new post from the correct type of plastic, drill a tiny hole in the center of the circle on the lever. The new post will have a 'pin' that can be inserted in the hole for stability and increased strength of whatever method is used to adhere it to the lever. OPTION 2: Manufacture a completely new lever and make it available to purchase as a repair part.
The delay in this project is: FIRST, we have to determine exactly what kind of plastic is used for this lever. It's probably the same plastic as the cam. I have researched this extensively looked at thousands of photos of plastic parts so I think I know what the plastic is BUT I need to confirm this with a plastics manufacturer or fabricator of small parts before I can proceed any further. This project has been set aside until a later date.
NEXT PART: To the LEFT of the cam lever is a VERY TINY BLACK PLASTIC PART THAT IS ESSENTIAL TO THE OPERATION OF THE VRV. YOU WILL LOSE THIS PART IF YOU DON'T KNOW EXACTLY WHERE IT IS LOCATED IN THE ASSEMBLY AND IF YOU ARE NOT VERY CAREFUL. DON'T LOSE IT!
Moving on I will show you where it is located.
To the LEFT of the tiny part is the Black Plastic Valve Body showing inside the LOWER part of the valve body with the bottom of the Diaphragm which is soft and appears to be blue Silicone Rubber. In the center of the diaphragm is a BRASS TUBE. The rubber diaphragm has a hole in the center and the diaphragm is simply stretched over the end of the brass tube which has a recess and holds the diaphragm in place. It's a good seal and unlikely to fail. This diaphragm is over 30 years old and still in good condition.
The brass tube is OPEN all the way through but there is a restriction at the diaphragm end which serves as a SEAT for the tiny black part which is inserted into the brass tube and is free to travel up and down the inside of the tube.
At the opposite end of the brass tube, away from the diaphragm, is a hole (through the tube) where the top end of the cam lever spring (not shown) goes through the tube to hold the spring in place. THIS SPRING ALSO PREVENTS THE TINY PART FROM FALLING OUT OF THE TUBE.
IF YOU REMOVE THE SPRING FROM THAT TUBE BE CERTAIN NOT TO TIP THE ASSEMBLY UPSIDE DOWN OR THIS TINY PART CAN FALL OUT AND YOU NOT LIKELY TO SEE IT.
THE SPRING WILL NOT JUST FALL OFF. So, it is safe to handle the VRV and move it aroundwithout risk. It is only a risk when you intentionally remove the spring if you intend to disassemble the valve body and you probably will not have a reason to disassemble the valve body.
At this time there are no replacement parts available for what is inside the valve body and I can show anyone interested what is inside.
What the tiny black part does:
As the throttle is increased the cam turns to the right, the cam lever moves upward releasing the downward pull on the diaphragm. The diaphragm is moving upward to its center seat inside the lower valve body. The vacuum inside the brass tube increases when the diaphragm is seated and that vacuum pulls this tiny part upward where it will seat at the top of the tube and seal off the passage of air through the tube.
NEXT PART: Hanging off of the left side of the valve body is a metal assembly that contains an unusual spiral shaped spring stamped out of a thin flat steel sheet. As the cam lever moves upward the tension compressing this diaphragm spring is released and this spring expands to push the diaphragm up to it's seat. I don't need to show the spring here. I will be posting all of the photos in a new topic entitled: "INSIDE THE C6 VRV - VACUUM REGULATOR VALVE - WITH PHOTOS" I have a lot of work to do to edit and change the photo formats before I post the new topic and I won't do it today. Look for the new post within the next 7 days.
LAST we have the yellow cam. If you look closely you can see where the post on the cam lever has worn into the cam ramp - probably about 3-5 thousandths of an inch. I was thinking of possible ways to build that surface back up to spec. but that small wear is relatively insignificant compared to the cam lever and it's probably OK like this.
i agree, i can feel a clear shift without slipping, but realy smooth. And for shure the C6 can shift that way, my Lincoln has also the C6 inside
I use the right one that comes with the new Engine, the left one was damage. because someone try to glue a brocken Vacuumpost with CA and floats the VRV in total so nothing was moving inside!
But what makes my Truck also a little diffrent to stock is the DNE2 manual Overdrive that sits after the C6 and bring the output rpm to the Driveshaft down or up 0,75-1 this is why i set the shiftingpoint a little down from stock, because in my way of thinking the overdrivegear must be also in my calculation for the shiftpoints.
Now i will see what mls per Gallon i get with the Truck, i have a short way to Work (only 8 mls one way) so i will use the Blockheater in Wintertime to give the Engine a chance to warm up
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