i recently installed a new engine in my 78 f150, drove it for about a week then started having intermittent starting problems. turn the key, solenoid makes contact but nothing to starter, did this a few times. battery is good as is all connections and grounds. I had another used starter that i know was good, so i put it on. same thing, solenoid makes contact but nothing from the starter, i replaced cable to starter, still nothing. i pulled that starter off and hooked it straight to battery with jumper cables, ground to housing and positive to terminal, Nothing just arching, starter still does nothing, so did same thing to original starter same thing. so now i'm thinking two perfectly working starters have suddenly gone bad?? I then put a new starter on the truck, no difference at all, solenoid activates and nothing to starter.
1. checked voltage on starter side of solenoid , getting 12volts there when solenoid contacts and at the starter.
2. checked continuity from starter body to engine and to chassis, Ground is good.
3. while i was under there , i checked continuity from starter cable terminal to frame and i am getting continuity and i should not be, This is telling me i have a dead short some where, but i can not find anything.
Wiring issues drive me nuts and i'm no good at wiring problems, Does anyone have any suggestions.
I found one forum where a guy had the exact same problem, after a few weeks of posting and trying different things people suggesting he still had the problem, then a few weeks passed and he posted: truck now cranks, yay. he gave no answers as to what he found the problem to be. It was an old forum, so can't locate him. I'm hoping someone here can lead me in the right direction.

Thanks.

 

It's a long shot but take your battery clamps off and clean the posts and clamps up. I've had it happen before where everything looked good but the posts were cruddy and I wasn't getting enough amperage.

 

Yea clean them up good. You say nothing about the battery, was it tested ? If it is "intermittent" sounds more like a bad spot in the ring gear. Have you looked it over ? If all else fails hold the starter switch on, if the wire gets hot you know something is up, if it's cold probably a bad ground. Could even be a solenoid. As for the starters not working after being put in the truck, they should have been bench tested on a machine before they were put in. 3 starters bad in a row ? Yea I can see that with a Ford. I sure have went through a few to get one that worked.

 

battery tested, it is good, have cleaned all cables. solenoid is working properly. The first starter was fairly new, the second starter came off a truck i just pulled engine out of, i know it was working good and the new one is a new one, not rebuilt. problem was at first intermittent, it did it once and worked after a few tries, did it again a few days later, haven't gotten it to do anything since then. I would know if bad place on ring gear (flex plate is new), i would hear the starter doing something, its doing nothing, the only sound i hear is the solenoid contacting.

 

You say you checked continuity from starter cable terminal to ground. Was this the terminal on the starter? If so, it will show as close to a dead short as to make no difference. The starter can draw several hundred amps. Ohms law says 12 volts at 200 Amps equals 60 milliohms. That's 0.06 Ohms.

If it still isn't working, try some voltage drop tests. I've had cables fail at the crimp. Either at the ring terminal or at the battery terminal clamp. Also check for the heavy ground strap/cable from the block to the frame.

 

Testing the starting circuit on early fords.


Ok some of this will be redundant for you but it is the whole process.

• CheckBattery Voltage should be 12v or above. If not Charge battery. This is assuming the battery is good and capable of providing adequate amperage to properly operate the starter. If it is suspect load test battery.
• Checkfor 12V at I Terminal at start relay when Keyed to Start. If no voltage repair start circuit.
• Using aremote starter crank over vehicle check voltage at batteryside of starter relay terminal, Make note of it. If no or low voltage,clean battery cable and relay terminations. If still no or low voltage afterterminals are cleaned replace the cable.
• Using a remotestarter crank over vehicle check voltage on starter side of starterrelay. If voltage varies by more than 1.5V from input side replace relay.
• Using a remotestarter crank over vehicle check voltage on starter terminal. If itvaries more than 2.5V from output side of starter relay, clean connections onrelay and starter. Retest. If Voltage still varies more than 2.5V replacecable.
  
  If you have done all thisand are still getting no starter engagement no crank or engagement but no crankthe starter is at fault.
  
  To test the starter properlywill require it’s removal. And a basic understanding of how it functions.
  
  The early Ford positive engagement starters utilize a movable pole shoe to engage the starter drive.
  When power is applied to the starter current flows through the movable pole shoes drive coil. The drive coil creates an electromagnetic field that attracts the movable pole shoe. The movable pole shoe is attached to the starter drive through a lever. When the movable pole shoe moves, the drive gear engages the engine flywheel.
  As soon as the starter drive gear contacts the ring gear, a contact arm on the pole shoe opens a set of normally closed grounding contacts. With the return to ground circuit opened, all the starters current flows through the remaining three field coils and through the brushes to the armature. The starter motor then starts to rotate.To prevent the starter drive from disengaging from the ring gear if battery voltage drops while cranking, the movable pole shoe is held down by a holding coil. The holding coil is a smaller coil inside the main drive coil and isstrong enough to hold the starter pinion gear engaged.
  
  Test the starter on the bench to see if it the drive engages and it rotates.
  
  If the drive engages but does not rotate. There is a problem with current delivery to the armature. If the starter is rotating but the drive is not engaging there is with the problem the holding coil If neither happen there is problem with current delivery to the field winding or mechanical interference.
  
  Testing.
  
  

• Remove the movable pole shoe cover. Apply power to the starter and insure the grounding contacts are opening when the pole shoe retracts. If not adjust grounding contacts. If grounding contacts are opening or no movement of the pole shoe is noticed the issue is withinthe starter it’s self.
  
  
• Remove rear cover off starter. Inspect brushes if brushes are worn replace. To them replace requires soldering in new ones. If fine move to step 3
• Inspect input terminal to fieldwinding termination. Some of these are connected by a pinch crimp and it will loosen up over time check for tightness. Quality rebuilds will have this connection crimped and soldered. If yours is suspect or loose repinch and solder. If fine move to step 4
• Remove starter hosing from around armature. this will require the removal of the movable pole shoes retention pin. Once removed inspect the field poles for signs of scuffing and the armature for signs of contact with pole shoe. If contact is apparent replace end bushings. If no contact is apparent move to step 5
• Testing field windings. Open the grounding contact by placing a piece of cardboard or the like between the grounding contacts. Check for resistance between each field brush (field not ground)and the input terminal. All should read near 0 ohms. Any that read infinity are faulty or have faulty field windings. If all test fine move to step 6
• Open the grounding contact by placing piece of cardboard or the like between the contacts. Test for resistance between each brush and the starter case make sure no brushes are contacting the case during testing all should read near infinity. Any showing low resistance indicate short to ground in the field windings. An old trick you can try to fix this is to put power to the starter case and the input terminal if it is soft ground the dead short will blow away the spot making contact. Yes this not the “proper” way of fixing this but it will do in a pinch. If all this passes. Then the Armature is suspect.

There are lots of resources on line for testing armatures so I’m not going to repeat all that here.


Hope this helps

 

Sounds like the solenoid to me. Just because it's clicking doesn't mean it's not dead-shorting to ground. My battery isolator in the brown truck was doing that. Tested fine, but got awful warm real quick

 

Only other thing is maybe the starter drive broke.

 

When torquing the cables to the solenoid, don't torque so hard as to spin the lugs!

Later Gen pickups had a different solenoid/relay that can retrofitted to our dents. Like this NAPA/Echlin ST404

When you say you used the Jumper cables, at the battery side, did you clamp to the existing battery (and clamps)? maybe try it in another battery, or drag it to a parts store for testing. Also, be careful with the starter test like this, they can spin outta control real quick!

 

I do agree it could be a bad solenoid but on the other hand that wouldn't explain the burned up starters. He needs to tear all 3 of them down and see what happened to them and maybe that might point to something

 

The starter for my 390 began acting up so I picked up a replacement. It didn't work right out of the box. Didn't even draw much current. I had to use jumper cables to power it directly while it was laying on the ground and may have smacked it once or twice to break it free. It's worked for over 3 years now. I suspect a brush was hung up.

 

I'm at a loss, replaced solenoid yesterday, tried new cables, still just solenoid making contact but nothing else at all to starter. checked all grounds, ran additional ground. have bypassed cables. All indications are the starter is bad, what is causing them to go bad? the other side of that is the cables would typically get hot, but thet are not? I've been working on Fords all my life and have never ran into this sort of thing or if i have its a bad connection, dirty battery post or something. I'll be pulling the third starter off this week end.

 

Have you done a voltage drop test?

You'll need a voltmeter, any type will work, and an assistant or a remote starter or a jumper lead.

Connect the positive lead of the voltmeter to the positive post of the battery. Not the cable clamp but the actual post. This is the part where the assistant comes in handy as there isn't a good way to keep a good connection without just holding it there by hand.
Connect the negative lead of the voltmeter to the post on the starter.
Set the voltmeter to DC and somewhere near 12 volts.
Try to crank the engine and watch the voltmeter.
If you see more than ~ 2 volts, you have a problem in the wiring or solenoid.
If you have 0 volts, you have an open somewhere.

For a way more detailed post with pictures, see this post

 

Have you tried a different battery?

 

This might be frowned upon, but have you tried jumping the solenoid with a screw driver? Also, you need to make sure all wires are correctly connected. Try jiggling the wires running to the solenoid around a bit, you might have a wire that's broken apart inside the housing not making contact.